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Impetuous Activation: How does it work?

Discussion in 'Rules' started by Drey, Nov 11, 2022.

  1. Drey

    Drey Well-Known Member

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    Howdy folks, I’m having an enormous amount of difficulty wrapping my head around how impetuous activation functions so I’m going to try to lay out how I *think* it works with my reasoning, and hopefully folks can guide me in the right direction when I’ve inevitably misunderstood something.

    Let’s begin:

    It’s my impetuous phase and I have an impetuous trooper, let’s say a Ghazi with 4-4 Mov.

    I want to activate him for some free movement, so I remove the impetuous token and declare Move.


    Now the rule says ” When declaring Move, Jump, or Climb, the Trooper must always move the full corresponding MOV value, attempting to perform the first of these options that the Trooper can complete:”
    1. Enter Silhouette contact with an Enemy Trooper during this move.

    2. Go towards the Enemy Deployment Zone without doubling back from the movement's starting position. (See FAQs & Errata.)



    I measure 4” for my move like I’m allowed to do and find that there are no enemy troopers within 4”, so clearly, I need to follow #2. Here’s the catch: When I deployed my Ghazi, I put him in a corner like so (didn’t want him to get shot, after all):
    upload_2022-11-11_12-25-10.png

    Now the rule tells me that I “attempt to perform the first of these options that I am able to *complete*” If I try to move this Ghazi towards the enemy DZ, I find myself in a corner, unable to go anywhere but backwards, I am not able to complete moving towards the DZ unless I moved backwards then forwards again, which is also illegal with “without doubling back”.



    So what happens? I can’t meet #1, there are no enemies within 4”. I can’t meet #2, there is no way for me to go towards the enemy DZ.

    What I *think* happens is that the activation converts all skills in it into an idle. Impetuous is an Obligatory skill, so while its activation is optional, I must follow its prescription. Inability to follow its prescription means that my activation fails.



    Here are alternatives I’ve heard to this and why I don’t *think* that they work:

    1. The ghazi moves 0” and gets a 2nd short skill like normal (following the declaration restrictions of impetuous)

    a. This is the least likely because the rule (in big bold letters) says that troopers “must always move the full corresponding MOV value”. There’s even an exception clause in impetuous that says “Troopers may only move a shorter distance if they reach Silhouette contact with an Enemy or a Special Terrain area hinders their Movement or forces them to declare Jump or Climb.”

    2. The ghazi uses its full move to move as far away as possible while staying as close to the enemy DZ as possible (so likely touching the wall the whole time)

    a. This is a little more possible because it does meet two of the three priorities listed by the FAQ:

    i. Use his full MOV value.

    ii. End his movement as far as possible from the movement's starting point.

    iii. End his movement as close as possible to the enemy Deployment Zone.

    So where it falls apart for me is first, since you’re moving away from the enemy DZ, you are not ending “as close as possible” to the enemy DZ. But even this I could understand if it that’s just a final check at the end of following the first 2, I used my full move to run away from my starting position and did so in a way that made me end further from the DZ than where I started, but it was closest for what I had to do.

    But this doesn’t excuse ignoring the very base part of the rule where it says “Go towards the Enemy Deployment Zone without doubling back from the movement's starting position.” Running backwards is kind of by definition NOT going towards the enemy DZ, so I *think* this is a no-go, you can’t just run backwards for your impet activation.

    3. The same as #2, but with the interpretation “it only says I need to ATTEMPT to perform this, not that my attempt needs to be successful.”

    a. This is unlikely for two reasons, first that it does say “that the trooper can complete” which would imply that the attempt must be successful in totality, and the second, that if only the attempt matters then you can get away with moving vaguely towards an enemy model 20” away and then say “well I attempted to perform this and this was the best I got” which essentially opens carte blanche to move vaguely towards any enemy model on the map and call it a day.



    But this all brings me to another wrinkle I’ve encountered: interpreting the FAQ.

    I interpret it as follows:

    You must follow the base rule “Go towards the Enemy Deployment Zone without doubling back from the movement's starting position” and then the FAQ tells you *how* to accomplish that in a way that isn’t cheesy.

    So:

    When I declare move I must move towards the enemy DZ, THEN I must do so in a way that uses my full move (I can’t cheese by moving .1” or going prone), I must do so in a way that gets me as far from my initial position as possible (I can’t cheese by zigzagging), and I must do so in a way that gets me as close to the enemy DZ as possible (I can’t cheese by just running backwards or running into a wall and moving laterally when I could’ve gotten closer)



    I have also seen it interpreted in a different way though:

    The FAQ describes how to move with impetuous in its entirety, the base rule is replaced with those three priorities and as long as they are met it’s a legal impetuous activation.



    I disagree with this interpretation, primarily because there are plenty of places in the wiki where text has been replaced with new text as needed instead of an additional FAQ addendum, and I *think* the FAQ is an interpretative document that explains how something is meant to be played and is only prescriptive when it explicitly replaces rules.





    Let’s look at a few other scenarios:

    upload_2022-11-11_12-25-22.png

    This time there is a way for my Ghazi to move first away from the enemy DZ and then towards it without doubling back (around the right side). Is this a valid activation? I *think* yes. I can move towards the enemy DZ and I can do it using my full move, moving as a far away from my original spot as I can, and ending as close to the DZ as I can, mission success.



    upload_2022-11-11_12-25-36.png

    This time my Ghazi would only be able to move laterally against the wall, but doesn’t have the movement to get around it. Is this a valid activation? I *think* no, it violates moving towards the enemy DZ so a purely lateral movement would not be a valid activation

    upload_2022-11-11_12-26-49.png


    This time my Ghazi would have to hug the wall as he moves, but it is towards the enemy DZ. I *think* this is a valid activation.

    upload_2022-11-11_12-27-0.png
    This time my Ghazi would be able to eventually move towards the enemy DZ, but it would take him ending his movement further from the enemy DZ than he started. Is this valid? I *think* yes, he is fulfilling the main rule that says that he must move towards the enemy DZ, it just happens that to fulfill that he will use his full move, he will move as far as possible from his starting location, and he will end his movement as close to the enemy DZ as he can [GIVEN that he MUST move towards the enemy DZ]. If it happens that moving towards the enemy DZ makes you end up further from it in order to move towards it, there is no requirement that I am closer to the enemy DZ from my starting point, only that to fulfill my goal of moving towards the enemy DZ, I get as close as that movement can.


    upload_2022-11-11_12-27-15.png


    Final one: my Ghazi has been immobilized by a heinous Bluecoat riotstopper. Is Dodge+move a valid activation. I *think* no. I declare dodge because that’s legal while immobilized, then I declare move which would turn into an idle because I’m immobilized. But in resolution I find that I have violated one of the requirements of the impetuous activation, namely that I MUST use my full move and I don’t meet the exception clause of getting into sil contact OR touching special terrain like a terrain(aquatic) zone that is difficult terrain. The result is that my dodge also becomes an idle, but because I still activated my Ghazi, the nearby Bluecoat in LoF gets a valid ARO and shoots me with an SMG.



    TL;DR: Impetuous activation is optional, but its requirements are obligatory. I *think* this means that in order to successfully activate I MUST follow the prescription of the impetuous rules. I *think* if I can’t follow those rules completely then I should choose to not activate that model during the impetuous phase, and if I activate that model anyway then the entirety of the activation becomes an idle but enemies still get valid ARO’s from me activating.



    My reasoning is twofold:

    1. That’s what the rules and FAQ say as best as I can interpret them

    2. Impetuous is an enormous discount already and being able to activate a model without spending an order should understandably come at a price, either in points cost (which it doesn’t) or in heavy restrictions in what that activation can do (which I *think* it does)



    Thank you for reading this gargantuan post, and I hope that I can be guided towards better understanding how impetuous works if I’ve misunderstood anything here.
     

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  2. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Drey likes this.
  3. Robock

    Robock Well-Known Member

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    I can declare Shoot+Move. My Shoot was legally declared and the requirement are met during Resolution... so why is it turning into Idle ? I don't see which rule allows other skill to also turn into Idle if the Move prescriptions failed to be able to be met.

    Ok, i see. the idea is that the skill "Impetuous" failed and is turned into Idle (which then voids the subset of declared Skill combination).

    You can still Climb ? instead of declaring move+something, if you were to Climb then your (x,y,z) coordinate (assuming all displacement is done with the centre of your base) would actually be a half-base closer to the enemy DZ than where you started.
    (and without going into math and computer game; just generally speaking i think most would agree that if you were climbing the wall rather than standing behind it; you would be what could be said as "being closer")
     
  4. Drey

    Drey Well-Known Member

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    Remember, you get to choose between climb/jump/move first "When declaring Move, Jump, or Climb, the Trooper must always move the full corresponding MOV value, attempting to perform the first of these options that the Trooper can complete:"

    THEN you need to follow the rules for impetuous. You don't need to worry if jump vs move would fulfill the requirements better.
     
    Robock likes this.
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