Climb+ / prone / ladder / guts roll

Although it is written as an effect of the climb skill, I believe this:

• Troops can never be in the Prone state while they Climb or hold on to a vertical surface.

Is meant to be universally applied, and I don't think C+ is meant to override that aspect. I could be wrong, however.

All the others are fine as long as they conform to their respective rules (guts movement only being away and to improve cover, deploying your troop so that the entirety of its silhouette is inside your DZ, etc.)

 

Relevant rule snippets:

Prone:
While Prone, troopers cannot Jump or Climb.

Ladder:
Those pieces of scenery representing stairs and ladders allow to move vertical or diagonal surfaces using the Move Skill at no cost, without declaring Jump or Climb.

Climbing Plus:
This Special Skill alters the user's Climb Skill from an Entire Order Skill to a Short Movement Skill.
Climbing Plus allows the user to move along vertical surfaces as if executing a normal Movement on horizontal ground.

Guts:
If the troop fails its Guts Roll, it must go Prone or move up to 2 inches in order to abandon the danger zone, gain Cover, or improve its Cover against the attack.
______________________________________________________

My thoughts:
1. Yes, because you use ladders with the Move skill, not the Climb skill.
2.a Yes, because Climbing Plus changes Climb to a Short Movement Skill.
2.b No, because even if the Climb skill becomes a Short Movement Skill, it is still the Climb skill, which you cannot use while Prone.
3. Yes, as long as all requirements for the Deployment are met. (I found no rule that forbids this.)
4. (see 3.)

Now we first have to clarify the kind of 'or' in the Guts rules:
i) logical or: ...it must go Prone and/or move up to 2 inches...
ii) exclusive or (xor): ...it must either go Prone or move up to 2 inches...
To me i) makes the most sense.

i.5. Yes, but the trooper has to go prone first, and then move 2 inches.
ii.5. No, it is 'either go prone or move 2 inches'.
6. Yes, see 1.
i.7. Yes, see 1.
ii.7. No, it is 'either go prone or move 2 inches'.
i.8.a. Yes, see 2.a
ii.8.a. No, it is 'either go prone or move 2 inches'.
i.8.b. No, you cannot go prone when using the Climb skill.
ii.8.b. No, either go prone or move 2 inches (onto a wall).

 

I rarely use climbing plus so I'm not familiar enough with the rule to answer part 1

My opinion on part two :

Guts:
If the troop fails its Guts Roll, it must go Prone or move up to 2 inches in order to abandon the danger zone, gain Cover, or improve its Cover against the attack.

Guts use move with lowercase which usually mean the verb move and not the skill Move. If it mean the verb, then no going prone is allowed so it's going prone OR move 5cm to get better cover

 

"Troops can never be in the Prone state while they Climb or hold on to a vertical surface."

The bold parts there, as pointed out by Sabin is definitive. Nothing in any other rule contradicts it.

 

But you are still on a vertical surface and nowhere in Climbing Plus does it state that you can go prone while on a vertical surface.

Note the "or" in the quoted rules

 

That's just it. I think it's been ruled in the past that you can't be prone on a ladder because of that text. If that's the case, then that text extends beyond the climb skill to any vertical surface under any circumstance unless stated otherwise.

 

Again,
it is anoying that this is under the Climb rules, not the Prone rules,
as it affects going prone on ladders, which is not Climb...

Prone has the weaker ruling, that you cannot use the Climb or Jump skill,
and does not mention vertical surfaces...

 

As it happens, it was by me, based on exactly the same logic that people have already been using in their replies.

If you're holding onto a vertical surface, whether that's via Climb, Climbing Plus, a ladder or whatever, you can't be Prone.

It would be better if it were in the General Movement Rules or the Prone state instead of being 'hidden' under Climb, but the text is not ambiguous.

 

@ijw : Whats your opinion on the second set of question regarding guts move ?

 

That's certainly how we used to play it.

@ijw have there been any FAQs or other changes to that?

 

You’re asking “How sure are we that the words say what they say?” :-/
I assume what you meant to ask was “Are we 100% sure that GUTS move is ‘exclusive or’ (choose one) and not ‘inclusive or’ (choose one or more)?” And casual “inclusive or” isn’t very common in this sort of situation.

I think one of the important things to remember is that the General Movement Rules require that the model go Prone, or cancel Prone, at the start of the movement. That sort of goes opposite to the whole “diving leap into cover” cinema.

It’s also worth noting that the previous edition was set up the same way, except that Prone was a separate movement skill from Move.