1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Silhouette or Base on Game Table

Discussion in '[Archived]: N3 Rules' started by daszul, Feb 11, 2019.

  1. daszul

    daszul Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2018
    Messages:
    732
    Likes Received:
    876
    What happens if a trooper with climbing plus walks on a wall near the edge of the board?
    What happens if the silhouette leaves the board while the base is still in it?
    Is it legal or not?
     
    #1 daszul, Feb 11, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
  2. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    12,018
    Likes Received:
    15,302
    Undefined behaviour. Part of the model is literally outside the game.
     
    daboarder, inane.imp and Hecaton like this.
  3. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,708
    Likes Received:
    2,086
    Are you allowed to voluntarily leave the game area, even partially? Think about a building put near a board edge that is closer to the edge than the diameter of a base. Can you move past that? No, right? Well, I don't see this as any different.

    Sorry if this sounds a bit snarky. It isn't meant to be. These are just the questions and (hopefully right) answers that came to my head while mulling this over.
     
    BLOODGOD and inane.imp like this.
  4. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    12,018
    Likes Received:
    15,302
    On the one hand, a lot of games have rules that define that you're never allowed to have models leave the game table, on the other hand... why do you even need those rules when you don't need rules that say "at no point during the game are you allowed to intentionally flip the gaming table"? You have a gaming table on which the rules apply, everything not on it is outside of the game and as such not governed by the game.

    In either case, as the rules for Retreat! hint at, those are the only rules that govern moving units off the board as far as I can remember
     
    daboarder and inane.imp like this.
  5. DukeofEarl

    DukeofEarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,444
    Likes Received:
    1,385
    Just spit-balling here.
    Wouldn't it work just like walking through a doorway too low? I.e. impossible as you can't go prone
     
    meikyoushisui likes this.
  6. MindwormGames

    MindwormGames Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2018
    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    282
    I don’t think there’s a rule against it.

    It’s simpler to say that no part of a model’s silhouette can leave the game table, but I don’t think that’s a rule as written.

    Seems like you’d have to wing it on a case by case basis. But I think it is cleaner and less open to abusive shenanigans if no part of a silhouette can leave the game table.
     
  7. solkan

    solkan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2017
    Messages:
    1,335
    Likes Received:
    1,982
    I think the last time it came up, the other player and I just pointed to those sides of the buildings and said, “No walkies.”

    I’m just going to be spiteful and suggest that anyone who tries to move a model’s volume outside of the table’s boundaries be forced to endure a 5th edition 40k argument over whether its permitted to pivot a vehicle while it’s standing next to the table edge. You will learn suffering. :smiling_imp:

    Because the alternative is drawing line of sight to and from points in a trooper’s volume that are outside of the playing area.
     
  8. fartsocks

    fartsocks Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    34
    I think if you poke off the edge of the table, it should pop out on the opposite side of the table, Pacman style, giving your opponent an ARO
     
  9. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,572
    Likes Received:
    1,502
    I'm pretty sure this is not RAW but an house rule. RAW only include the notion of narrow/wide/cargo gate.
     
  10. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    7,331
    Likes Received:
    14,817
    Access Widths are only in use if you're using the optional scenery rules, most metas that I've come across just go by the physical size of the doorway if it's not an objective room.

    EDIT - and letting troopers move through gaps that are shorter than their Silhouette leads to some really stupid stuff, especially if you have buildings on supports...
     
  11. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,572
    Likes Received:
    1,502
    So you confirm this is house rule ?
     
  12. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    12,018
    Likes Received:
    15,302
    Considering most doors in use in my meta are not quite 25mm wide, access width is a must. The same goes for officially licensed terrain, most doors just aren't large enough to fit a silhouette through them.
     
    Icchan and theradrussian like this.
  13. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    7,331
    Likes Received:
    14,817
    You can call it a house rule if you want. For me it's direct extrapolation from the published rules for Sapper, Mechanical Transmutation, replacing models and markers, Boost etc. which require enough space for the whole Silhouette.
     
  14. theradrussian

    theradrussian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2018
    Messages:
    506
    Likes Received:
    851
    yes, but direct extrapolations and infinity are oil and water :D

    For what it's worth though, it's times like these where a healthy dose of common sense helps make the game function.

    We always rule it as no part of the model's Silhouette can leave the game table.
     
    DukeofEarl and FatherKnowsBest like this.
  15. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    Messages:
    6,040
    Likes Received:
    7,177
    I pretty well insist on using access widths to describe doors. But that's because I love putting prone S5 through Narrow Gates that my opponent's haven't expected them to be able to path through.
     
    Belgrim, Xeurian, Mahtamori and 2 others like this.
  16. Willen

    Willen Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2017
    Messages:
    531
    Likes Received:
    735
    Sorry for the necro but this brings me to another question... RAW nothing says that the Move skill must fit the silhouette through the path, we only talk about the base to fit the surface.

    Therefore, would a S5/S6/S7 trooper be able to traverse a 1 inch alley if they go through the wall using Climbing+? Assuming the wall can accommodate the base of course.
     
  17. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    6,420
    Likes Received:
    5,380
    You cannot keep the base in contact with the ground for the whole movement if the base wont phisically fit.

    Having Climbing Plus, however, lets you reduce your S to 0 while climbing (by going Prone), so the Climbing Plus unit can go Prone, then make a move+move as long as the wall is as tall as its base's size...
     
    chromedog likes this.
  18. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    7,331
    Likes Received:
    14,817
    You can’t be Prone on a vertical surface, even with Climbing Plus.
    • Troops can never be in the Prone state while they Climb or hold on to a vertical surface.
     
    BLOODGOD and chromedog like this.
  19. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    6,420
    Likes Received:
    5,380
    Wel... If a trooper enters the Unconscious state, it falls Prone automatically unless it belongs to a Unit Type unable to go Prone (REM, TAG, Vehicle...) or has a piece of Equipment that prevents it from going Prone (a Motorcycle, for example).

    So I mixed the answer because of that. I agree, however, that there is nothing allowing you to voluntarilly enter prone state and then climb (in fact, it is forbidden to Climb or Jump while in the Prone State per the Prone rules entry).

    I find it hilarious, however, that RAW a Climbing Plus troop can go Prone if Unconscious (unless remotes, TAGs, etc..), but can't climb prone XD
     
  20. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2019
    Messages:
    2,213
    Likes Received:
    3,456
    @ijw, does this also apply to a troop (who doesn't have climbing+) walking up a ladder?
     
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation