With the departure of the Japanese forces and their CC-oriented troopers, there is now design space for more integrated Chinese (or rather main-land SE Asia) special forces. We still have remnants of Ninjas, but they are fighting a shadow war as the main Ninja clans are hunting these traitors down, and as such I'd like to propose that the story progress further with high-command integrating these remnant Ninjas in training programmes for new special forces troops. Enter the Wuxia. Wuxia in general roughly means Martial Hero and anyone who've seen Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon or similar works should instantly be familiar with what I mean: these are not the crazed Shaolin Monks of Infinity, nor are they the skulking Ninjas, but they are martial masters, often in roles of law enforcement, with a very, very, strong moral compass. So, what does this have to do with Ninjas? A sub-group of Wuxia are the Cike and this focuses more on the martial aspect of living and less on the other 7 virtues of a Wuxia. Cike would make for an excellent starting point for the Sino-oriented Ninjas which would be supplied with different, specialised, equipment and weapons by the StateEmpire. The idea is simply, really. Take a Ninja and give them different weapons. Possibly shuffle the hacking devices around a bit, but keep the general statline the same. The other part of the idea is a completely new unit to roughly fill the space that Domaru, Haramaki and Shikami; namely a martial arts HI focused more on the offensive than the Crane Agent's generalist approach. While the Cike is fairly self-explanatory; how would a HI Wuxia look like?
@Mahtamori Just wait that I complete the Art for the Recreations of Lu-Bu and Guan-Yu for the Fan Art Subforum. . .!!
From my very limited experience, if you are serious about hitting something in the face in Infinity, you'd better have some special delivery method. And if it's something as big of an investment as HI with considerable CC stats and extra skills, you'd want some way to survive in the midfield in case you go second or expect it to last. Since we aren't talking about cheap warbands who have their own extra orders and smoke to just footslog in (already have those anyway), special deployment options come to mind. As of survival measues, marker state is typical, but we don't really want a direct Oniwaban replacement, or some weird CC Daofei. If anything, Ninjas are still there for some of such work. So... CC-oriented MechDep guys with perimeter weapons and expendable guns for some limited mid-range AROs? AD profile to fit with Wuxia theme of crazy jumps (Super-jump is stolen by Shikami, so...) and to give that AD HI to IA? 6-2 or 6-4 MOV with multiterrain (tbh I wanted that archetype for Ramah AD, should they get one, but w/e)? If you really want some marker state to reach opponents, would Holo2 matter? It's not the most reliable thing, and besides we're encroaching onto what Sepulcher could become the day CB decides to do something about it, but oh well. SF shenanigans would fit that "midfield survival" theme as well. That is a bunch of random boring ideas that tend to occasionally be in conflict with each other, plus I have very little idea of what can work well with the rest of YJ army, but oh well.
刺客 Cike (literally Stabbing Guest) are actually the Chinese name for assassin. The historical Cikes are often credited as the original inspiration for the Wuxia genre due to their mysterious nature. (Not so different from how Shinobi inspire the pop culture Ninja) One of the most well known Cike is Jing Ke, who attempted to assassinate Shi Huangdi, who would go on to become the first Emperor of China. Jet Li's character from Hero (2002) was loosely based on him While Wuxia characters often wear just robes, the more militaristic ones tend to wear whatever armor is available in the time period they are in. Will probably have some kind of Climb+, Super Jump or Hyperdynamics (Or combination of them), since preternatural athletic feats are basically a given in this genre. Then take your pick of CC skill, MA would probably be more appropriate than Berserk, NBW might be appropriate for some character. (Lu Bu having it would certainly be quite appropriate) Weapon wise, your typical CQC range weapons will probably work (SMG, Chain rifle/Colt, Nanopulser, Spitfire/Redfury and what not), I like the idea of dual wielding pistols though, plus a CCW of some kind. Of course, good CQC units need a good way to cross the table efficiently, so alternate deployment methods, smoke/eclipse grenade, higher than normal MOV would all be helpful. Visually they will probably wear stylized version of the Invincible armor fashioned after traditional Chinese armor. So like high tech version of these: It would probably be silly to not mention Dynasty Warriors.
Excellent imagery! My only real qualm is that Shikami seems to be modelled after Wuxia rather than Ninja, and Shikami are in game (and traitors).
If anything, Chinese part of YJ army was always looking more down-to-earth to me (pun not intended), even though Wuxia in general is anything but.
When the profile dropped, I really had thought that the Shikami was CB incorporating some wuxia style into Yu Jing, which now that its gone makes it a little tougher... you don't want just a 'Chinese Shikami' with Super-Jump and ODD since that's a lot of overlap, but in many ways to do the unit right it is going to need to 'feel' similar. But perhaps that's a part of the challenge: a wuxia unit, that is different from the Shikami profile, but when the two are on the table both players' first thought should be making a bee-line for the other to engage in an epic center-field martial arts duel. I'd definitely start with Hyperdynamics 2 or 3. The Shikami has ODD as built-in protection, giving this hypothetical Wuxia unit a bonus to dodge can fit well, the Shikami has a weaker bonus but it can fire back, the Wuxia has a better bonus but in dodging forgoes the counterattack. Dodging through a hail of arrows or soldiers to reach the target or objective has a very wuxia or HK martial arts feel (at most extreme, our unit is Jackie Chan holding a baby in one hand and a Ming vase in the other, in a room full of ladders).
Add enough hyperdynamics on top of decent PH and you will at least get a unit with a purpose - a giant middle finger to mooks with CRs and random traps somewhere in tight midfiled. Which is fitting enough. Tossing mooks around and deflecting monstrous hails of projectiles (which is what CRs generate) is something Wuxia heroes definitely do. Add NBW if you want him to also be able to face berserkers. Not sure if it's within CB's design limits - making someone who dodges on 20 or even better, but at least there are always sidearms, so... Probably will be a fair unit with function, specific strength and (provided you don't overbuff everything else) weaknesses. That's actually a more interesting concept than I could think at first.
Forward deployment or airborne infiltration (gliding across rooftops?) seem obvious. Keep the phys low at 11 or so, but give it mimetism, 1-2 levels of HyperD, 6-2 or 6-4 movement with C+. Give it natural born warrior and the assault rule (but not berserk), and possibly a special CCW (Wuxia CCW, similar to the templar one?). Give it a Tac Bow with marksmanship L1 on one profile and SMGs / assault pistols on another. Definately give it Sixth Sense. Maybe NWI too?
Well, the two genre share lots of tropes, so it's not surprising to see similarities.There is enough room to make a CC focused HI that are quite different from those traitors though. Here's my idea: Yousha (游侠) Direct Action Team HI, Regular, Frenzy, Hackable BS13 CC24 PH13 WIP 13 ARM3 BTS3 W2 S2 AVA 2 Equipment: Albedo Special Skill: MA3, Forward Deploymen L1, Super Jump, Kinematica L2, Specialist Operative, Fire Team: Duo Yousha - BS Weapon: SMG x2, Smoke Grenade, Nanopulser, CC weapon: EM CCW, Pistol Yousha - BS Weapon: SMG x2, Smoke Grenade, Nanopulser, CC weapon: DA CCW, Pistol Yousha (MSV 1) - BS Weapon: Shock Marksman Rifle, Smoke Grenade, Nanopulser CC Weapon: Shock CCW, Breaker Pistol x2 Yousha - BS Weapon; Redfury, Smoke Grenade, Nanopulser CC Weapon: Shock CCW, Breaker Pistol x2 And maybe some more. FD, Albedo and smoke will help them get up the field efficiently to employ their short to mid range weaponry. Also everybody dual wield!
Well, back when Paradiso first dropped, the running evil-combo I was suggesting was someone with MA3 and NBW. You don't get any MA, Guard, or Protheion skills and I still hit you at +3 to my CC and -3 to yours. I'd suggest Mech Deployment to get farther up the field quickly.
@Warhydra Problem with Hyper-dynamics is that it's got to be really damned high in order to be worth it on a slightly more expensive model, and it's not an inexpensive skill to begin with. Using Crane as a template, you'd need Hyper-Dynamics 2 (56% dodge vs Dakini when both in cover) for it to start being good and that's only in the reactive turn where you can't shape your own advantage. On the other hand, Hyper-Dynamics on a melee HI with Kinematica would make for the first unit with a really potent Engage. @Section9 I like NBW. Now that CC has been scaled down in Yu Jing, I think that skill could fit and be an interesting counter-point to JSA. Possibly not MA3, MA1 would be sufficiently deadly - NBW has a second mode and that one stacks with Martial Arts; MA1+NBW2 = +3 attack, -3 enemy defense AND +2 PH on DAM. MA3+NBW would be insane against a Jotum or similar (+6 attack, -3 enemy MOD, +1 PH)
As it was noted already, Hyper-dynamics unit doesn't have to be FtF winner in order to have a niche. Dodge is great if normal roll is all you need. A somewhat stupid example: Hyper-dynamics 3, PH 11, NBW, MA1 gives you a great unit to troll DTW users and minelayers complimented with a rough equivalent of MA3 (provided you have good CC attribute) when you don't need to nullify CC Special Skills, and some resistance against berserkers (since if we are going to fight warbands, we will encounter some of those). Granted, you will probably pay through the nose for something this niche.
I think you meant to mention @Shiwan, but yea, Hyper-dynamics is a less efficient way to get into melee than say, throw down a Smoke or Eclipse grenade. While the Japanese CC HI had no smoke for some reasons, I dont see why the Chinese versions cant have that capability. To make Hyper-dynamics a viable way to reach melee, maybe we need a special skill that lets you move while dodging in the active turn? NBA with MA would be pretty awesome and hey Domarus have Berserk+MA3 so having 2 CC special skill is not without precedent.
Well, yeah, precisely. Once we start making something with quality, you'll see the price skyrocket. Pupniks are criminally cheap, but they don't generate orders and have precisely 0 ranged capability as well as essentially no melee skill. The model you describe would probably be in the high teens prior to giving it a ranged weapon (besides the mandatory pistol), unless it was impetuous and irregular in which case it'd be competing with the Shaolin and be roughly same price without DTW and smoke.
Sorry, yours registered better as a fleshed out idea when skimming the thread. It's mostly about the combined values of NBW+MA3, since those don't come with drawbacks like Berserk does.
Yea, that would be pretty overkill and probably very expensive, not to mention really odd since the guy would easily outfight Achilles and Kitsune! This probably needs to be a special character thing.
Well, yeah. Although in any case irregular and frenzy feel right on unit like this. Fluff-wise, archetype we are using as base is sometimes... somewhat whimsical :) On Shaolin - true, but Shaolin don't always fare too well against DTWs themselves, plus our new guy has some degree of insurance against his progress (and possible extra order investment) through the board being undone with a bad roll. Well, what is the price difference between MA1 and MA3 anyway? Because like I said, you can settle for MA1 in this case as combined with NBW (if we really want that) it will be a rough equivalent of MA3.
I think it's something like 2 points difference. And NBW+MA1 would be equal to MA3+2DAM (almost like combining MA3 and MA2), like I wrote earlier.
