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Where's Ariadna's TAG

Discussion in 'Ariadna' started by Charbe86, Jun 24, 2018.

  1. Charbe86

    Charbe86 Member

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    I know the blackjacks fill a similar role, but are Ariadna likely to get an official TAG?
     
  2. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

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    Ariadna's tag is called the RM100, but it hasn't been seen since artwork in the corner of a page of the 1st ed rulebook...

    Scutlebutt and hearsay often points to CB considering it as a second S8 model, but unless Gencon brings something more solid we're either playing FRRM for the anaconda or hope your opponent/TO allows soldiers of fortune...
     
    Golem2God likes this.
  3. Charbe86

    Charbe86 Member

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    That seems a bit rough if they're bringing TAG themed missions in to ITS.
     
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  4. chromedog

    chromedog Less than significant minion

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    Where's Ariadna's TAG?

    They're hiding it in the same box with Pan-O's smoke+ MSV tricks.

    Otherwise, give up the fetish for furries and they might consider it (werewolves blow the whole conservation of mass thing out of the water).
     
    A Mão Esquerda likes this.
  5. Wombat85

    Wombat85 Well-Known Member

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    Sorry OP I need to jump in here. How? Pufferfish do this all the time in a simple volume expansion with no added abilities. Another option is that they possess a hyperactive glad that allows the conversion of energy source into mass, we do this all the time with farmed chickens where they double thier weight in the last week or two of life.

    Back to the OP, this faction doesnt have TAG's, if you want one, pick another faction.
     
  6. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

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    Problem is in a competitive environement : in tournament, not having TAG prevent Ariadna to reach max scoring in some mission. I think that, at least, we should have acess to one of the two mercenary TAG (like last season)
     
  7. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    If you're going to a tournament with TAG missions and you want a TAG then play the French and use their Anaconda.

    Otherwise just play the missions without the TAG. It's not like ISS has access to a TAG, or Vanilla Yu Jing even use theirs on a regular basis.
     
    #7 Triumph, Jun 24, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2018
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  8. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

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    'use frrm' isn't a great solution, given that they're being discontinued so they're not going to be a direct revenue source for CB. There are basically 3 workable solutions:
    • Release RM100
    • Put the Anaconda in vanilla
    • Have @HellLois count dog warriors as tags in the missions that need tags
    All three have different ways to sell models, but thanks to Mcmurrogh the third opinion feeds another option to the other factions that have him, and with Soldiers of fortune potentially everyone has another way to complete the objectives.
     
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  9. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Or do nothing. I really think you guys are making a problem where there isn't one, TAGs aren't particularly necessary to win those missions as you're making out.
     
    Hiereth likes this.
  10. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

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    Doing nothing is an option, but it's not actually something that we need to discuss because it's literally what happens if we don't make changes. TAGs are the big shiny thing, Ariadna is the only vanilla army without one, and the sectorial with one is going to be made of proxies and conversions from now on. If YuJing players choose not to use their TAG then I'd at least like the opportunity to ignore an ariadna TAG...
     
  11. Scribbler

    Scribbler Well-Known Member

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    Wait, Ariadna actually has a TAG in it's lore? I thought the whole point of Ariadna was to be the super low-tech guys who didn't get shiny toys and had to rely on swarms of camo and teseum AP ammo to compete with everyone else, and we didn't get TAGs unless we hired them from somewhere else.

    Please, tell me more.
     
  12. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    It is something that should be discussed given that faction identity is a thing. As another user pointed out, Ariadna's TAG access is limited, much like Pan-O's access to smoke. You knew what you were signing up for when you joined there.
     
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  13. A Mão Esquerda

    A Mão Esquerda Deputy Hexahedron Officer

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    It’s an old thing, and it appears that the Blackjack, Dog Warriors and anything else that might come down the pike fulfilling that role in Ariadna, with a true “TAG” highly unlikely, at least as an organic part. The only things that fit currently are the Anaconda or perhaps the Iguana, as those are the only mercenary TAGs that could fit. Scarface ain’t gonna happen...
     
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  14. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

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    The lore on it is as follows:
    It's named RM100.

    End of lore.
    It's been on the back burner for the last 10 years, it might not even be canonical anymore, but the working theory is it's a prototype that had some missing technologies etc so it was never deployed.
    PanO smoke is actually exactly the same as an ariadna TAG, it's a pointless restriction that makes very little sense especially with the introduction of soldiers of fortune. Faction identity shouldn't be about what you can't do, or what you're bad at, but what *only* you can do(EG sepsistors, triads/enomotarchos etc) or what you're best at (nomad hacking nets, CHA/JSA close combat etc). Now the middle ground is 'you don't do X because you do Y instead' EG the tohaa don't have STR because they use biomechanical alternatives. If you need TAGs for a part of the competitive rules set, then allowing an alternative to the TAG for the factions and sectorials that don't have TAGs is at least as good an option as saying they shouldn't compete.

    As far as knowing what we signed up for, the requirement for a TAG was only introduced last season, and it came with the option to field a TAG, this season the requirement for some missions remained, but the option to field a TAG was left to the discretion of the TOs, and also comes with the option for everyone else to draw from the mercenary pool,which upsets people so it tends to be omitted...

    So anyone who started more than a couple of years ago didn't sign up for needing and not having a TAG, we signed up for having Werewolves that filled the role of a TAG...
     
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  15. Andre82

    Andre82 Well-Known Member

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    This IS a problem.

    Having ANY faction that can't compete in an ITS tournament is a issue that should be addressed.
    Normal gameplay wise it is not an issue but for ITS having a almost auto fail faction is questionable at best.

    Now you can fix this by giving them a tag, or you can adjust ITS so tags are not needed to score max points.
     
  16. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    You don't need a TAG to compete in those missions. Not having a TAG does not prevent you from winning or achieving a major victory. Let's be real here, scoring a 10-0 victory instead of a 7-0 victory has less to do with using a TAG and more to do with you beating up a far weaker player, and either way you still earn the maximum tournament points for the round.

    ISS does not have a TAG. Steel Phalanx does not have a TAG. Hassassins don't have a TAG. You don't see people saying that these armies are suddenly noncompetitive. Tohaa and Yu Jing have TAGs and they don't even use them because they're not very good. Ariadna does not need TAGs to be competitive in Season 9 either.
     
    #16 Triumph, Jun 24, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2018
  17. cazboab

    cazboab Member (phrasing)

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    ISS, Steel Phalanx and Hassasins all have the option of going vanilla, all of them have models available to do so. Tohaa and YuJing have the option to use the Gorgos and Guija whenever they want.

    Ariadna has the option to use a sectorial which is no longer in production, forcing proxies and conversions, which while its a huge part of the hobby to me, is simply something that many people aren't interested in. Every other vanilla has the option of a TAG.

    Every single point you can earn in ITS is possible for everyone but Ariadna, it might not be easy, worthwhile, or even necessary for a major victory, but it's possible for every other faction to hit 10 points in every mission. Random draw on objectives might screw you out of a point or two, or it might hand you an easy-as-automatic point.

    Let's for the sake of argument, say that ITS 10 has a mission objective that only dog warriors can do, can you imagine how that would be received? Do you really think you'd be able to convince nomad players to only play Corregiador? Even though they have models available, I think you'd probably not make much headway...

    Philosophically we're left with the choice of one faction being at a disadvantage from the off with no way to counter it, or a minor change that also benefits other people...
     
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  18. Andre82

    Andre82 Well-Known Member

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    It being possible to score 7/0 is not really a good argument. A three point disadvantage is not balanced.
    Victory points are still very important. It was literally the difference between 1st and 2nd place at my tournament yesterday.

    Maybe people should be saying that...
    Personally I think the issue is probably more an ITS issue then a faction issue. Tagline solved the issue by letting everyone have Scarface as an option (kind of bullshit they took him away after people bought him) but we don't have that now.
     
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  19. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Depends how vital the scoring is to the mission. Replace the wording in Show of Force from TAG to Dog Warrior and I wouldn't care the least bit, I already don't use a TAG for that mission, bringing a Guijia is inferior to just using YJ's HI options and killing the Datatracker instead.


    If you have multiple players with only major victories after the final round then it's on the tournament, there wasn't enough rounds played to give someone the opportunity to be the clear victor. If you're going to tiebreakers on a close tournament because a player couldn't rise above the rest then them's the breaks, that's how it is. Some factions have an easier time on certain missions over others, particularly on more the more objective less shooty missions like Rescue, Looting and Sabotaging, Highly Classified. That's just how it is, Ariadna isn't a special case here.

    Yes the Scarface thing was a dick move on CB's behalf.
     
    #19 Triumph, Jun 25, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2018
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  20. Káosz Brigodéros

    Káosz Brigodéros Vanguard, Inc.

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    Actually we do have a TAG but we keep calling him Veteran Kazak!