Do you fall? Do you not fall? Do you fall if you're not a remote? These questions and more hopefully answered here. My logic has always been thus: From Prone: "If a trooper enters the Unconscious state, it falls Prone automatically unless it belongs to a Unit Type unable to go Prone (REM, TAG, Vehicle...) or has a piece of Equipment that prevents it from going Prone (a Motorcycle, for example)." So what I get from this is that there are only two specific things that can prevent you from going prone when you fall unconscious; troop type and equipment. I don't think it's the intention of this to include anything else here. From Climb: "Troops can never be in the Prone state while they Climb or hold on to a vertical surface." Using that first quote as context, holding on to a vertical surface (which is not a troop type or piece of equipment) cannot stop you from going prone. Therefore, you go prone, and the only way to resolve this to a legal position is for you to not be holding on to a vertical surface anymore.
The only way to resolve it as written is to not fall (you're not allowed to fall while climbing) and to not go prone (again, your prohibited from going prone while climbing). It's not very different from a biker going unconscious. As with everything when things gets messy with unforeseen rules interactions; do the least wrong.
I think the Climb restriction apply when you declare and perform that Skill. So if you were climbing, and then in your reactive turn you get shot and die, then there is nothing special happening. (edit: Actually, even in the Climb skill, when using a climb Entire Order, there is nothing saying you can attempt to climb, fail to do so (because you got shot or otherwise) and then fall.) I think either you stay up and on the wall ; or you become prone and on the wall thus entering a combination of state that is not usually attainable when spending your Orders. From the fluff side of thing, I don't know what kind of sci-fi tech allow you (and forces you) to climb up as if you are walking on the wall, maybe glue-boots ? maybe a hook-and-rope ? maybe combination of both ? In that case, i could see how being unconscious you would still not fall down (modern non-scifi climbers already have fall preventive measures) yet you'd be forced to be prone on the wall (hanging by the rope or upside down by your glue-boot) even though you cannot actively climb in that position.
it seems very different from a biker because a motorcycle is one of the things explicitly called out in the Prone description as not letting you enter it. I don't think this argument is about being "allowed to fall." It's about not being allowed to hold on to a vertical surface.
I thought i saw a discussion in which it was stated that you do fall, but I'm mobile at the moment and can't really effectively search.
Psych said you fall because of common sense. We told him common sense is not applicable when rules are clear. The result is that of rems and tags going unconscious, they cannot go prone so dont. So hanging on wall while not prone.
Is it really so unbelievable that a trooper can be unconscious and still be attached to whatever gear he was using the scale said wall? Most buildings we use for terrain are smooth and don't facilitate climbing without some type of equipment or additional help. Fluff aside, I think its relatively well stated that you do not fall OR fall prone if you're unconscious while climbing. Just might be tough to doctor him or her.
i agree it is well stated, as "fall" in the used "automatically fall Prone" is not the same as Falling to the ground taking Falling Damage. But i think it could be confusing in English though, as falling prone could hint a vertical fall until your body hit the ground, rather then the rule meaning being synonymous to "automatically enter Prone state" or "automatically activate Prone state" or "automatically become Prone". "fall" was a good descriptive verb to use but other verbs could have been used.
Are you told your trooper is allowed to stop climbing? Are you told your trooper is allowed to fall? Permissive rule set means you have to be told what you're allowed to do.
I don't think permissive rules are incompatible with my train of thought. If I enter unconscious, I am told go prone unless my troop type or equipment prevents it. Since clinging on a wall is not one of those two very specific things, I must go prone. Then, I am told I cannot be prone and hanging on a wall at the same time, so one of those two things has to change. I remove myself from the wall since I have nothing telling me that I can prevent myself from going prone.
How do you remove yourself from the wall? You can't stop climbing at will. That's not within the rules. You've just made up a rule. I can't prove it doesn't exist, because that proof is impossible.
So your argument is essentially: There is not a rule in place to that explicitly handles how to remove yourself from a wall. Because this is a permissive rule set, that means I cannot remove myself from the wall, and the cleanest resolution of two incompatible states becomes that I don't go prone.
Yes. Do the least wrong. If one rule doesn't work, don't invent a completely new rule, just accept that one rule can't be fully executed.
Permissive ruleset means, as far as I understood from the english speakers (I am not familiar with the term, frankly) that you can only do what the rules define, everything else is essentially "parts of the world that have not been coded" in the Matrix. Considering that the only way to Fall (and take Fall Damage) demads to declare a Jump order (Entire Order, unless you have Jumping Plus), my take on this is that you cannot fall once Unconscious if you are climbing because the only way the rules consider "falling" is after a Jump. Personally, I think this is mostly relevant only when we talk Nomads (and their Climbing Plus Tomcats) and remotes that manage to place itselves at a height a S2 (or S1) engineer/doctor can reach.
My POV is that the exception for Unit Type and Equipment is incomplete and is intended to basically say 'if, when a Trooper goes UNC, it can't for any reason a Trooper go Prone it remains standing'. Admittedly that is interpretation not RAW. However, even if we dismiss that and accept your interpretation then REMs still would never fall off a wall when going Unconcious (they don't go Prone so the incompatible interaction would never happen). Your interpretation therefore creates two completely different interactions for say a Tomcat and a Reaktion Zond going Unconcious whilst on vertical terrain: I think that should be resisted unless absolutely necessary. Basically, I agree with @Mahtamori this interaction isn't sufficiently covered so go with the least wrong interpretation (or alternatively the solution that requires the least interpretation and is the most coherent).
I can follow your and @Mahtamori's logic on how this works and I'm sufficiently convinced from a rules standpoint of your positions. Having said that I'lI speak my final peace and say I don't think I'll ever be able to give up that from a "common sense" perspective, that's very counter-intuitive.
The model has moved sideways on the wall and is currently climbing over a trash pile, an enemy trooper or a friendly trooper, i.e. it can not legally be placed on because the base can't be fully supported or it isn't clear of other models. This needs to also be addressed if the common-sense approach is taken. (That said, this is not, as far as I know, handled should a model Jump over another model and then fall on it, either)
That one's easy. Common sense says they take a damage 20 hit from the knee drop you've obviously executed.
