So imagine this; what if Fireteams were gutted so that Haris and Core Fireteams became the same thing. Sectorials would no longer be limited to a single 3-person Fireteam similar to a Triad, but not anywhere near as flexible as a Triad or Enomotarchos. Arguably some sectorials wouldn't care all that much about this, but several sectorials would go down. Meanwhile, the strength of vanilla isn't in getting Sixth Sense and +3 BS on their strongest shooter dude, but rather the micro-adjustment available to having access to all units. That is to say, flexibility is a very strong quality in this game. What would you think are appropriate unique loadouts to keep a sectorial competitive and diverse? Now, I'm not talking about "fixing problematic units" that are either left behind in the external balance or the internal balance, because that laundry list can be made long and tend to also affect vanilla (not to mention be highly subjective), but more along the lines of breathing new life into less used troopers by putting them into complementary roles or giving them complementary abilities like this rough IA outline: MÓWÁNG (NCO, Forward Deployment +8", Specialist Operative) MULTI Rifle, Flammenspeer / Heavy Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 46) TAI SHENG (Strategic Deployment) Mk12, Chain-colt, Flash Pulse / Heavy Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 43) YĀN HUǑ (Neurocinetics) MULTI Heavy Machine Gun / CC Weapon, Heavy Pistol. (1.5 | 51) LÙ DUĀN FTO (*wildcard w/o Echo state) Mk12, Heavy Flamethrower(+1B) ( | Deployable Repeater) / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 21) It can be a unique weapon set up, it can be a new skill, etc, paid for of course. Except Mimetism. That's not a rule or anything, it's just lazy.
I'm totally on board with this, but with one caveat, no trooper should be wholly left out of vanilla (you know who you are...). I don't mind if you're left with only the most bare-bones, basic version available that wouldn't even be remotely competitive. Increasing the amount and variation of sectorial-specific profiles would be a good way to design sectorials without having to rely wholly on fireteams as a defining crutch, and would help with factions that are stuck sharing key troopers between multiple sectorials (Shang Ji, for example).
Give Ko Dali a Parachutist (Deployment Zone) profile in OCF. Give the OCF KHDs profiles that are actually useful for killer hacking in OCF. I like the idea of giving Kerr-Nau, effectively, K1 ammo on his Trinity.
Without getting too deep into this, command skills (NCO, CoC etc) would be logically more prevalent in a sectorial (due to clearly definied force structure unlike vanilla hodge-podge). Counterinteligence, maybe, Strategos (easier to order around your own troops). Why?
What about troops with AVA 0 in vanilla but with certain LT options (same sectorial) they increase their AVA to 1/2?
I think they are already kind of making some changes. While Spiral is not a sectoral of Tohaa, it kind of is anyway, it has significant difference with troop choices. And the low AVA can really suck in other Vanilla armies as well. Tohaa ────────────────────────────────────────────────── TAAGMA Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 16) Spiral Corps ────────────────────────────────────────────────── TAAGMA Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 16) TAAGMA (Hacker [Zero Pain]) Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 18) TAAGMA (Tri-Core) Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 20) TAAGMA (Multispectral Visor L2) VIRAL Sniper Rifle ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 24) TAAGMA (Lieutenant) Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 16) TAAGMA (Lieutenant, Hacker [Zero Pain]) Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 18) TAAGMA (Lieutenant, Multispectral Visor L2) VIRAL Sniper Rifle ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 24)
They are even exploring the option of creating not only profiles but also sectorial exclusive troops (and we have already started to see some of them), at the moment it only happens in one sectorial of one faction: Coadjutor Crosiers and Trinitarian Tertiaries are both in Military Orders but not in PanOceania. More cases may occur in other factions in the future.
Gwailos too, are only available in Shasvastii. Not to mention the Soldiers of Fortune in ForCo, 75% of whom are exclusive to that faction, Arslan in DBS, and Emily & Uhahu in StarCo (unless the Soldier of Fortune add-on is used)
Doesn’t that just turn vanilla into a sectorial like any other? Edit: I mean, specifically having faction units not available to vanilla.
Gwailo is another example, available to SEF but not vanilla CA. Putting sectorial specific profiles on top of that, MAF exclusive Beasthunter with jawbrute peripheral isn't available for the rest of CA. On top of that borrowed units and mercs that make sense in the lore, like all of the bounty hunters in ISS, or bunch of mercs on QK. Add another layer with increased Ava on certain troops and with all of that you have so many reasons to play sectorial without relying on fireteams at all.
I agree. To me Vanilla should have at least one of most troops. However I can understand a few like MO. Those troops are very tied to the MO organization and don't do anything outside of them. For Gwailo, it could be that they are very few in number. Even in Shas they are AVA1. There's probably only a few hundred in the Human Sphere. So it does makes sense but I don't want to see to many of that. Edit: Did anyone notice the Tyrok Hunter does not get the Skurgot in Vanilla CA?
I wouldn't count units exclusive to NA2 sectorial as being missing from Vanilla since we can't play Vanilla NA2. But I do consider that Vanilla rarely has access to the complete set of what their sectorial has. Simply on the basis that sectorial can borrow units, that are present elsewhere in the universe (ie. other factions), but absent from Vanilla. (And i admit in the case of NA2 sectorial, some are exclusive to them.) I was introduced to Infinity (N2HS) under the new feature of Sectorial, where they had only a subset of Vanilla profile, but at greater AVA. I feel like this is simply not the case anymore. Sectorial are no longer a strict subset of Vanilla units. Tunguska has Raoul and Wolff. Corregidor has Massacre and Wolff. Bakunin has Avicenna and Wolff. (I just realized Wolff is in every nomad sectorials but won't work for Generic nomad, lol) Nomad is not that bad, but some faction's sectorial have a lot of outsider; enough to make the sectorial feel very distinct.
Sectorials always had loaner units though, I started around the same time and Corregidor always had Mr. Deadpool, McMurrough, and Valerya. NCA, SAA, and ISS always had Aleph loaner units.
I like the idea of sectorial specific profiles, I think it would even be fair to roll back a few of the existing vanilla profiles to make the sectorials a little more unique, especially if they tone down fireteams a bit
The opening post is a little confusing in its wording? Are you asking, if sectorials were limited to three man fireteams but had additional sectorial only profiles? If so, 100% on board. Full cores are so boring, but I feel most sectorials need the raw stat boost five strong links give you. I'd love to see sectorials with three person links only and more unique or better AVA on useful troops as well as more flexible links. I'd also be on board with vanillas generally seeing a drop in AVA in certain useful profiles. A bit annoying when vanilla gets precisely the amount of like, Morans or something, that you would want to play and sectorials either get identical AVA or something meaningless like 5 AVA on a drop trooper.
Yes, that's the question. And also, what kind of loadout additions you'd like to see to promote a more diverse play style for your favourite sectorial?
Thats a hard one, I don't tend to play sectorials for the reasons given. I did play Morats recently and I had a few ideas for them Oznat with Gaki and Preta sync Zerat with infil+6, Combi Light Flamethrower. Not as good as a speculo/grief but it gives MAF a T1 in their DZ aggro piece. Zerat with a Gaki sync. Less essential now with the Tyrok but still useful Zerat with hidden deployment MULTI Sniper. a bad noctifier really. A Gaki with forward deployment and hidden deployment. Preta which swaps chain rifle for mines, similar to in 2nd ed Daturazi with Killer Hacking Device. Gives up chain rifle or smoke not sure which. Daturazi with Jammer. Gives up chain rifle or smoke not sure which
as someone who plays almost exclusively aleph. The inclusion of the OSS shukra LT is extremely defining over vanilla's deva LT. the cheapest vanilla LT is the deva who is 1 point cheaper than the standard OSS LT, but the shukra is significantly better. not only giving his LT order as regular but reserving an extra model (strategos) and countermeasures is significant. the deva is tankier but both have extremely obvious LT syndrome and therefore must be hidden extremely well, but only the shukra does work worthy of 24 points while also being deeply hidden just by existing. That and other OSS player's absolutely love the asura in OSS due to the LT multi-rifle hacker+ profile with +1 order compared to not even having an LT hacker+ profile at all. That said, as someone who plays against sectorial factions significantly more than vanilla across the various factions. I don't mind if sectorial's gain unique profiles as long as that faction's profiles have compelling enough models to make running vanilla over sectorial worthwhile. For example, while vanilla aleph has a small couple of strong options, I don't feel it is compelling enough over running OSS instead.
I think it is a very compelling point, as indicated by king above, that perhaps Sectorials due to being "a more cohesive group" should gain mostly specific LT profiles and NCO, other than "exclusive weapon loadouts." I really like that idea tbh... adjust AVA, a couple defining profiles for the sectorial gain LT and NCO profiles exclusive to the sectorial, done.
IMO, TacAware and NCO are two of the most potent skills in the skill set for making solo units viable when they are missing the typical high-potency skills (marker state, forward deployment of any description, long range and high burst guns, etc) as they make a unit more flexible and mobile without making the MODs themselves screw the opponent over doing it. While thematically I agree that it makes sense for Sectorials, I do think that denying vanilla these tools is to the detriment of the game as a whole. That said, putting these skills on the heavy guns and only the heavy guns is probably something that they don't need to do quite so often. It's fine, CB, we're gonna bring HMGs and Spitfires on their own merits, those aren't the profiles that need this type of skill.
