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Transhumanity on the sphere

Discussion in 'Access Guide to the Human Sphere' started by gravitypool, Aug 29, 2018.

  1. gravitypool

    gravitypool Well-Known Member
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    Was going to post this on the RPG section but I guess it's a valid topic also for the wargame.

    Just a fluff/lore question. All the setting is supposed to be at a point were humanity has developed cyber implants, however aside from nomad miniatures most of the infinity range does not appear to have visible implants on them. It is also referenced in the lore that excessive modification is frowned upon even by nomads (Thus labbeling the subjects as Chimeras and being hunted down).

    So the question is, where is the limit? Is the use of implants and grafting frowned upon on places like Pan0, Yujing and Haqq? Or is it acceptable, yet people prefer to make them look human through Silk? Is it a moral concern to look human?

    Looking at media people like the Aristeia! casters we can see that they do look like it's fine to be all gold skinned in the TV, so why soldiers on the armies of the sphere don't?

    Also, in which point are you not a human anymore? Like, Morlocks are still not considered Chimeras? Because some of them look more alien than the actual Chimera.
     
  2. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    The Chimera is an extreme, in which she has been so heavily modified that she has Structure instead of Wounds, and is drugged into a Frenzy... remember, however, that the Tabletop one is a police officer infiltrated in the Chimera circuit! So, she would be on the "tame" side of things.

    Nomads like Zoe use implants to compensate for a falling body (why she doesn't get a new body is kinda hard to understand), but I'd say that the standard level in Infinity is the old "interface plug"-slash-implanted "smartphone" (comlog), and the people with visible implants and body mods are frown upon the same way a decade or two going around with piercings and tattos was IRL.

    Now, with the new "borg/blueskin" looks Aleph's Lhosts have, I would expect for that bar to be raised to an extent, but still I'd say that the norm in Infinity is "have it, but be discreet", the Euro way in Cyberpunk 2020
     
  3. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    She doesn't get a new body because she's attached to the one she was born with, maybe? I can see a lot of people disliking the idea of Lhosts from an ethical standpoint. Even if these people wouldn't campaign against Lhosts themselves, they wouldn't be willing to use them unless they had absolutely no other choice.

    Another option is merely liking implants more. Like you mentioned piercings and tattoos, there's a lot a person can add to their visual with implants and body mods and some people would definitely enjoy these too.

    I do agree with most of the stuff on your post, though.
     
  4. Ursun

    Ursun Tough as Nails, Grim as Old Boots

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    In some interview a long time agon the question was brought up to gutier (if I remember corrtly) why we don have cool implants like cyber arms etc. and the answer was along the line, technology is so far that cloning replacement parts is easy and cheap enough to not fall back on cyber limbs.
     
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  5. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Nah, to me it's more like it was backstory on one of the RPG characters from the game that birthed Infinity. And she would have had little choice, since that started when she was a child and the cost was enough to make a mess of her family (betrayals to Tunguska and the like). I simply doubt the Lhost option did exist at that time, and then they didn't want to revisit the story. Sadly that makes a headscratching in-universe situation (I would prefer a whole new body rather than having one that s falling to pieces and forces me to replace the parts with mechanical ones)

    And she was unable to use cloned parts, because of rejection matters, I think.
     
  6. Pen-dragon

    Pen-dragon Deva

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    If you could get a cloned part, and look normal, or get a crazy cyber limb, most people are going to go with the cloned part. If you really stop to think about the wonderful intricateness of the human body, it would be really hard to surpass its performance mechanically. I mean maybe you can get a cyberarm that is stronger than a human meat arm, but that extra strength is useless, if the strain produced can't keep the arm attached to the meat body. (cyberwarrior goes to pick up car, arm flexes, car does not move, but the arm rips free from their body, the whole thing is filmed, and shown on Panoceania's funniest videos) Also the arm may be stronger, but does it have a full range of senses, heat, cold, pressure, pain, itch, proprioception, and tension? Does it self-monitor, and importantly self-repair? Does the limb optimize its own abilities based off use? Low-use lower muscle mass, less energy, high-use, increase muscle mass. Was that limb perfectly balanced so as not to cause back strain? What if the user's body mass changes due to lifestyle changes? Does the limb re-calibrate its mass to maintain balance?

    Sci-fi tends to ignore alot of basic function to justify cyber-limbs, because 'cool'. In a setting as advanced as infinity, those that do get modded, will probably go for the full body mods like the Morlocks, and will probably be a fringe culture, not mainstream.

    On the subject of Aristeia!, I feel it is Infinity's version of professional wrestling. While physically demanding, there is a lot of theater and nonsense to push the 'cool' factor. Most of the fans would realize it is entertainment, and not real. I don't see Aristeia! craziness spilling over into regular society except at maybe costume parties.
     
    #6 Pen-dragon, Aug 30, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2018
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  7. Brother Smoke

    Brother Smoke Bureau Trimurti Representative

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    I would get a crazy cyber-limb...
     
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  8. TenNoBushi

    TenNoBushi Well-Known Member

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    There is a story linked to the Kuroshi Rider in Uprising about cybernetic prosthetics (as the Ten No Bushi Program had the Shichiroji Program aiming to replace most human parts by cybernetics).
    As you say, the cybernetic arm being linked to organic muscles and bones, it can't give a strengh beyond the maximum human standard.
     
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  9. Pen-dragon

    Pen-dragon Deva

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    Well sure, because CyberPunk is cool. But i feel Infinity has moved past CyberPunk. In Infinty, I feel like cyberware is the budget option. Bioware (thanks to Silk technology) is where the hotness is. Why just get a limb, when there is technology for a full body mod. A lot of extreme body modifications are available now in the real world, but they are not mainstream. I imagine you might see more cyberware in the Nomad nation, where things are little more socially permissive. I think it would also be interesting to see Ariadna experimenting with the low cost cyberware (helpfully supplied by the Nomad nation) while full scale Silk mods are outside their reach.
     
  10. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, cyberware is basically just a fancier version of the Pirate's Hook. It sends a signal about you. Actually it sends a whole set of signals. 1) You are/were so poor that you couldn't afford cloned parts. 2) If you are now able to afford cloned parts, you want to be seen as a poor, violent hoodlum.

    Though there is that infamous pic from Human Sphere:
    [​IMG]
    Girl with the bag in the lower-center of the pic has a cyberarm.
     
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  11. AdmiralJCJF

    AdmiralJCJF Heart of the Hyperpower

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    The RPG makes it clear that Cyber is the cheap and dirty option, whereas biotech or silk/cloned options are more cutting edge.

    The comparison to tattoos/piercings is quite apt, in certain company they are noting to even think twice about... but if you are law/finance/business you probably aren't going to get far with any visible "modification".

    Personally I found the Haqq details from the most recent release to backers very interesting, as it emphasises that Haqqislamites tend towards the most "naturalistic" solutions possible and that obvious cybernetics are frowned upon. This suggests that the opposite is also true in some subcultures of other factions (at least).
     
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  12. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Speaking of tattoo comparisons, have CB latched on to the Yakuza induced tattoo taboo with JSA? It'd not be farfetched if Yakuza adopting cubernetics mods make JSA society well above average aversion to visible modifications.
     
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  13. Solodice

    Solodice Freshly Squeezed Troll

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    Beyond that as well the Haqqislamites are into modest bio solutions. Seems anything crazy on the end of the cybernetic or bio is firmly in the realm of the Nomads (no surprise there really).
     
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  14. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    I think the Kuroshi Rider was more of a "patch me and let me be back to battle ASAP" than "cybernetics are a better option", and then she kept the arm as memento for those she lost there, and penance for losing the "church of speed".
     
  15. gravitypool

    gravitypool Well-Known Member
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    Those seem pretty interesting points. Also, regarding implants and security. What do you guys think would be the appropiate security measures in places like spaceports, circulars and the like to account for cyberlimbs and possible implanted weapons? Would they go full X-ray on every passenger?
     
  16. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    No, in Uprising there's a whole page of her getting that arm grafted on, basically without her consent(!), and then rehabbing. Was very much a 'Robocop' thing, 'officer was KIA, but not quite dead, so we turned him into Robocop'
     
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  17. AdmiralJCJF

    AdmiralJCJF Heart of the Hyperpower

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    You'd probably be able to integrate that, plus a lot more, into the standard metal detector "arch" we have now.

    So the difference for the passenger would be minimal, but the level of security significantly higher.
     
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  18. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    Not to forget the simple expedient of factory-installed wifi in the cyberware, so the screening gate pings the passenger's personal net with a "Hi there, SEATAC security here, will any cyberware please identify themselves?"
     
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  19. Pen-dragon

    Pen-dragon Deva

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    I also imagine there is pretty low tolerance for violators in spaceports and circulars, especially anything run by Corrigedor. I imagine it is a 'one strike and your out . . . the airlock.' Probably not a lot of repeat offenders. Of course Aleph manages to smuggle nanopulsars everywhere, but nanopulsars probably don't threaten structural integrity.
     
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  20. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I'd imagine anything threatening ship/station atmospheric integrity will result in very quick death for the individual(s) threatening said integrity.

    Otherwise? "Please swap your ammunition for the provided frangible ammo that we know will not put a hole in the hull, and place your ammunition into the lockbox with your seat number on it. You will be able to retrieve station-piercing ammo when you land on a planet."
     
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