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The Joy of Invading Savage Planets: A Guide to the Onyx Contact Force

Discussion in 'Combined Army' started by gamma ray, Nov 29, 2017.

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  1. bloodw4ke

    bloodw4ke Well-Known Member

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    CoC option would be nice. Calibans generally would be a really good patch for OCF.

    What I have in mind re: engineers is dealing with imm- states. ADHL are outsizedly effective against stuff like Xeodrons (hello Jaguar haris), and if Dr. Worm is out of the picture, that's that.

    So, he's near mandatory (esp. for classifieds) and also kind of annoying to pilot given the synchs - sure they're fast, but there's no order economy from coordinated orders. And not linkable, even solo. There's kind of a glaring disparity when facing a Vostok in a 5 man core with an engineer - extreme case, but a lot of sectorials in N4 now have those kinds of links. OCF got left behind in that regard.

    Another thought: doctor isn't nearly as useful in OCF, so always having to take it to bring an engineer is annoying and reduces list variety.
     
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  2. HardDisk

    HardDisk Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    CoC would make more sense in OCF than in Shaas
     
  3. Melkhior

    Melkhior Doing filthy things for EI

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    IMHO Calibans in Onyx aren't that good idea, because they are too similar to Umbra Legate, which would mean almost no table time for Legate, because camo is too good ability to pass. Both engineer and CoC can be added via new unit.

    I could see new unit with fireteam core option with cost between Rodoks and Unidrons with engineer option and some other tools.

    IMHO I still don't understand why Maakrep trackers don't have at least haris option. They looks like typical fireteam unit and haris would probably mean more table time for them, because right now I don't see them in Onyx list, because if need MSV we have Ko Dali. Even special fireteam with other unit would make them more interesting.

    Other tools that would be helpful or at least interesting to be added:

    - REM driver
    - cheaper infiltrator or FD unit ( I know we have Greif, but he has low AVA and we use him mainly as Impersonator) + points for minelayer option
    - counterinteligence
     
  4. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    @Melkhior Legate is just a poorly constructed unit IMO. Don't shed any tears for it.

    But it's clear that Onyx has, like, negative amounts of effort being put into it right now.
     
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  5. Sergei Simonov

    Sergei Simonov Well-Known Member

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    Hate to say it but it's true. A negative amount of effort and a sectorial that looses more than it gains by a huge margin. I do hope that onyx gets a rework at some point, as it's the oldest unmodified sectorial in the game iirc, and because they are some of my favorite minis in the range.

    Until that day, better to just put them on the table and say you are playing Shasvastii. I am very skeptical of a sales policy to power creep your army out of the game to make you buy more armies.
     
  6. Daireann

    Daireann Well-Known Member

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    Or may be CB would make new sectorial and just abandon this one. Not the first time.

    But I hope, they wouldn’t. (Only hope we have)
     
  7. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Vulnerability (Total)

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    From my experiences playing N4 Onyx, I have to say that Nourkias is always going to figure in one of my two lists from now on. Him with a KHD for cybermask is just outrageous and if you can get him through the door and feasting he becomes completely game-warping. While he's great in vanilla, lack of other options makes him S-tier in Onyx, and he compliments our standard defensive Unidron defensive link so well. The only problem with him is that he's such a great rambo, and late-game button pusher, that he overshadows a lot of our other options.

    The other trooper that I now find it very hard to leave at home is the Noctifer LT. It's exhorbitant, but solves Onyx's central problem. The main upshot of running him is I rarely find swc for Kiss anymore. It always seems to come down to the last 0.5. Nourkias loves NCO when paired with him, and Nork's 0swc as a primary attack piece helps the Noctifer tax to go down a little easier.

    I honestly think Onyx aren't far from being a real force. Caliban, and Caliban alone, would be enough imo. Making him ava1 would also force a real decision, as CoC would lock out our (new) best engineer. Of course I'd love to see the Maakrep and Legate retooled from the ground up, as they both suck and are brutally costed, but hey, this would be a simpler fix.
     
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  8. Morray

    Morray Well-Known Member

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    Ahh man I love the Maakrep, his use of regen now as well makes him pretty great. If I'm not looking to take the unidron link I'll usually find a place for this dude.

    I know everyone's pooping their knickers about the link team snipers, and how it's not fair we don't have one, but you get past that and the dudes pretty good at hanging around and being a general pain in the arse.

    Agree with Nourkias, he's a doll. But I disagree with the Legate rework, he's a complete beast.
     
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  9. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Vulnerability (Total)

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    Interested in how you use the Legate! I want to like the chap, obviously, but he's only a few points off Nourkias.
     
  10. Morray

    Morray Well-Known Member

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    Well he's a little cheaper obvs, also the Spit fire/boarding shotty & FD+8" & mimetism -3. Plus a 3" dodge. I'd not dismiss the dude so quickly.
     
  11. Time Bandit

    Time Bandit Vulnerability (Total)

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    BS & HD+ is nice for cybermask hunting, and leveraging his MA4 but he straight up sucks in that lonewolf role compared to Nourkias. The only real reason to take him is the added utility of that hd+.

    Spitfire profile belongs in a link really, but there his role as a midrange gunner is filled by a unidron spitfire with assisted fire, which is 24pts and .5 swc cheaper. (How embarrasing!) More generally the dron core is a strong defensive link for sure, but isnt all that in the midfield, which is where the legate wants to drag them.

    He really feels like he needs specialist operative on all his profiles.

    In short: are you spending 40ish points on an umbra? It's gotta be Nourkias... Are you spending 80ish points on 2 umbra? That's pretty crazy but fill yer boots and take a legate too, but you're paying through the nose for redundancy and risk (if a list can deal with Nourk, it sure as hell is specced to deal with a legate too.)

    Love to be wrong about this, if I'm missing something here.
     
  12. Tanan

    Tanan Well-Known Member

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    I have been dabbling with Onyx for a while. Here are my 2 cents.
    - Onyx is a weird faction. A lot of tools and weapon profiles that aren't available in other factions.
    - Poor healing abilities, but zombie-like durability in the form of bioimmunity, dogged and regeneration.
    - A lot of hidden deployment. The enemy warbands beware!
    - Excellent drop troopers
    - Lack of direct template cheerleaders
    - Lack of warbands
     
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  13. Morray

    Morray Well-Known Member

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    We do have two 9 point DT cheerleaders + repeater in Ikadrons, possibly one of the best I've seen.
    Plus, the humble unidron is an amazing pain in the arse, especially in a link.
     
  14. Lawson

    Lawson Well-Known Member

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    I've had my eye on CA as my next army in N4 for awhile.

    I happened to pick up the "Betrayal" mini pack the other day because I like the version of Adil that's included for my WB, and it was a better deal to buy the whole pack than try and get him individually. The Betrayal pack comes with Ko Dali and Nourkias, which seems to position it well for Onyx. That said, I'm really drawn to Speculo Killers (I've been wanting to try Impersonation for awhile) and some of the other Shas figures.

    If I wanted to go Onyx directly, I feel like I could buy the "Combined Army Starter Pack" along with Bit & Kiss, Nexus Operative, Greif Operators, Support Pack, and Drone Remotes Pack and have enough to put together a list. Any thoughts on this? Would it be better to go vanilla CA if i want to be able to include the characters from the Betrayal pack?

    My number one goal in picking up a new army will be for it to play as uniquely as possible compared to my existing factions because I really enjoy experimenting with different play styles. I'm currently in White Banner, Svalerheima, and TAK.
     
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  15. Kiyomasa

    Kiyomasa Member

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    In the games i have played Onyx I haven't used any teams. They are an aggressive sectorial and the unidron core encourages defensive play.
    Nourkias is an autoinclude and I normally use a Suryat Lt so Nourkias can use two Lt orders. The Tags and mini tags are really good as well. Bit and Kiss are almost an autoinclude. Kerr Nau to throw up white noise to mess with the inevitable msv sniper.
    Ko Dali is very good as well, but onyx doesnt have the access to smoke to make her shine.
    Dr Worm is almost always taken with a couple of slave worms to help healing the tags (normally for me the overdron and one or two Xeodron.
    I have tried the sphinx and it is very cool. the sad fact is there is more depth in Vanilla.
     
  16. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    How is OCF an aggressive sectorial? It's not amazing at winning firefights. It doesn't have too many cheap guys with templates to win fights that way.
     
  17. Kiyomasa

    Kiyomasa Member

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    Its not firefights, I play with Nourkias, Ko Dali and hidden forward units which means im up in their grill as quick as possible. Doesn't always work but i find I run out of points fast when building the list and Imetrons and Ikadrons are in the list for 4 cheap orders. The overdron and Xeodrons are pretty good gunfighters. Just my experience which is limited, so other more experienced players may differ.
     
  18. WiT?

    WiT? Well-Known Member

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    Interesting take. What do you gain from being in Onyx over vanilla, if you are not using the links? Probably not the defensive noctifier and I'm drawing blanks on what other non-link toys they get that vanilla doesn't also have its greedy paws on
     
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  19. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    That sounds an awful lot like you're playing a list you could simply play in Vanilla.
     
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  20. Hecaton

    Hecaton EI Anger Translator

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    Nah, the Overdron and Xeodron will fail against real gunfighting units. None of those units you describe can't just be used in vanilla CA; in fact vanilla handles Nourkias and Ko Dali better because Smoke Grenades.

    CB hasn't put enough effort into OCF to make it worthwhile over vanilla. There's a lot of players who think that's how it should be, though.

    You wanna make OCF an aggressive sectorial? Give it a sectorial-specific Ko Dali profile that has Dep Zone walkon. Make its hackers good like they used to be.
     
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