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Starting CA...should I go Vanilla CA or Onyx?

Discussion in 'Combined Army' started by gomjabbar, Jan 9, 2019.

  1. gomjabbar

    gomjabbar Member

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    Hey guys!

    I'm starting my Infinity career tonight with friends that already play the game. They will show me everything from the ground. I played a few years back a little after N3 was released but we started too big and got overwhelmed, so we stopped.

    So for my reboot I decided to go for the looks first and I choose Combined Army. I want to play Shasvastii as my main force but I will wait their reboot.

    I already have the equivalent of the Onyx box plus too much models already hahah. I have the Anathematics, Nexus, the 2 Noctifiers, one Suryats (HMG), one new Charontids (Plasma rifle), the Support Pack and 2 Ikadron&Imetron blisters.

    I'm leaning toward Onyx since I already have most of the models I need but what would be the simpliest route to learn the army? Onyx or Vanilla?
     
  2. krossaks

    krossaks Well-Known Member

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    Even if i prefer Onix, for a beginer Vanilla is better. Playing with links can be hard (mistakes are very punishing) and you have enought CA vanilla only models to play with.
     
  3. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    I think Vanilla CA is better than onyx in all but raw firepower.

    It's hard to compete with the brutality that is the Unidron Link or a well used Xeodron link, but you do have aspects and access to stuff like the Full Auto Sogarat or the shas infiltrators that really make up for it. Besides, Vanilla CA is probably the only army in the game that's almost 100% immune to Loss of Lieutenant.
     
  4. gomjabbar

    gomjabbar Member

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    I got a Drone box and was thinking of assembling a Q-Drone and a E-Drone, they seem to be the most useful of the lot. Should I get a second box for the two other drones?
     
  5. Ben Kenobi

    Ben Kenobi Well-Known Member

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    That's simply not true. If the Lieutenant with G:Mnemonica gets isolated, you will be in LoL.

    My third Army is Onyx I started with and the only complexity is the Fireteam. And if he plays Vanilla or Onyx is for the learning irrelevant, cause you will only lern through mistakes you make. And you will make mistakes and you will loose at the beginning.

    Play what you want. Both factions are good.
    But play at the beginning only small games with 150 points. They are faster and you can learn better how to play.
     
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  6. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    That's why I said "almost" and not just 100. Isolation is one of the few ways to get a CA army to go into LoL, and that doesn't come into play that often.
     
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  7. jfunkd

    jfunkd Rebel Myrmidon Graffiti Artist
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    All of the Drones are useful, but Q & E are probably the most commonly used. Where S3 REMs are concerned, very few people will give you trouble if you run one you built as an E-Drone as a M or R version.
     
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  8. Barrin

    Barrin Nomadic squirrel
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    Tell me some minis that are most visually appealing to you and how much money are you willing to spend on your army. You'll get the answer then. ;)
     
  9. gomjabbar

    gomjabbar Member

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    Well the only army that I like the look of (mostly because they feel unique and are not puny humans) is the Combined Army. For the looks, I love the Anathematics (bought it), the Umbras (got the one from the starter), the Rodoks (got them), the Daturazi (will buy them soon), the Unidrons are also nice (got the 3 from the starter).

    But the one army I want is a Shasvastii one, but I will wait for the reboot except if you can convince me that it's a good idea to buy now :P
     
  10. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    Noctifers are baller. Aida Swanson looks great, and I have a soft spot for the Malignos and the Caliban in terms of look.

    I'd totally get Aida and use her as a proxy for a Speculo in vanilla (or just use her as herself. She's pretty good in the table too).
    Also, Sheskin is kinda cool, but has a slightly derpy look. Her status are absolutely beastly, though.
     
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  11. Barrin

    Barrin Nomadic squirrel
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    Start building Onyx then. Don't buy the Daturazi, get the box of remotes, two blisters of Ikadron/Imetron,Nexus, Noctifers and maybe Kerr-nau or Bit&Kiss, and you're prety much done. You can use your Anathematics as a very nice Sphinx proxy. Use your Unidrons in link and just write down different weapons to them. No need to rush into support box. You'll have a lot of fun with this army and can use roughly half of it in upcoming sectorial you really wanted.
    Unidrons and umbras are not really the best bets for vanilla CA army, so don't get trapped in it with more purchases like daturazis.
     
  12. gomjabbar

    gomjabbar Member

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    Well I already bought too much stuff lol:
    - CA Starter Pack
    - Support Pack
    - Remote box
    - 2x Ikadron/Imetron
    - Anathematics
    - Rodoks box
    - 1 Suryats (HMG)
    - Noctifiers blister (the one with 2 minis in it)
    - Nexus
    - Charontids (plasma)

    Yesterday we started Operation Coldfront as a tutorial. It was freaking awesome. We did the first 3 missions 2 times each (we were 3) and I just can't wait to try my Combined Army when I feel comfortable with the rules.
     
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  13. jfunkd

    jfunkd Rebel Myrmidon Graffiti Artist
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    Vanilla CA is very competitive, but it's a challenging army to play for new players because it requires experience to be order efficient compared to sectorials. Though it's more forgiving in some ways too, especially at deployment.

    If you're going to go Vanilla I'd recommend sticking with the Aspects as Lts at first, especially if you like the Anathematic. He's badass btw.

    Based on what you've posted I'd get the following for Vanilla, and it's probably cheaper than what you'd need to acquire for OCF:

    Daturazi
    Bit and Kiss
    Shas Starter (or get Shrouded and find a proxy for the Speculo)

    I consider the above to be more or less mandatory units to have, but not necessarily auto includes in every list.

    These two are so good they should be in your miniatures lineup, but vanilla CA can run without them if you use B&K and the Dats.

    Krakot
    Kerr Nau

    With what you have, that's probably enough to play a lot of good lists with the Charontid and Anathematic.

    In the future you may consider the following for Vanilla CA:

    Anyat
    Rasyat
    Oznat
    Zerat
    Avatar
    Skiavoros
    Libertos
    Ko Dali
    Pretas (though I hate the current models)
     
    #13 jfunkd, Jan 10, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
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  14. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    I really, really, really don't Recomend Zerat, Oznat, Anyat or Rasyat for Vanilla combined. Vanilla has options that are way better than these guys for the same cost:

    Anyat: pretty unique loadout, but if you want a K1 combi you have better options on the samaritan and if you want non-impetuous smoke you have the speculo.
    Rasyat: Between Ko Dali and the Fraacta there's very little reason to take this dude.
    Oznat: On her own she's pretty crappy. Maybe if you want to run the new sensor profile, but then you need oznat+preta;
    Zerat: Get a Shrouded. Same cost, smilar skills, but way easier to use. Sure, the FO profile with boarding shotgun is neat, but she's finnicky and dies easily.

    Really there are very few Morat models that have use in vanilla. Daturazi are the most obvious ones, as are krakots. You can argue for a lone rodok or one of the HI models, maybe the Raicho too thanks to the new profile. But there's very little reason to use morats in vanilla.
     
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  15. jfunkd

    jfunkd Rebel Myrmidon Graffiti Artist
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    @DaRedOne, I will respectfully disagree about the Rasyat. The Rasyat is Utility AF with his Eclipse and ability to complete Classifieds in season X. There are many things he can do that Ko Dali and the Fractaa cannot.

    As for the others I agree that the profiles you point out are the most useful in Vanilla to me.

    Oznat's Sensor profile is fantastic in single combat group Vanilla CA because it provides an an extra dogged wound and DTW in the slot.

    The Zerat is more of a personal choice, but is cheaper than the shrouded and often just as useful. I usually pay the additional points for the Shrouded, but I have been surprised how effective the Zerat FO can be.

    Anyat is something I rarely take too, but she is so much toolbox in a cheap package that she's worth consideration.
     
    #15 jfunkd, Jan 10, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
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  16. TheDiceAbide

    TheDiceAbide Thank you for your compliance.
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    As much as I love vanilla CA, I think that Onyx is a little easier to step into. Not because they're a better beginner army, but because they can make better use of the boxed sets of minis that are available.

    That said, looking at what @gomjabbar already bought, he's well on his way towards a solid vanilla army.
     
  17. toadchild

    toadchild Premeasure

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    If you want to play the Anathematic and Charontid you bought, vanilla CA is the only option.
     
  18. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
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    I had to actually go back and look at Ko Dali again to make sure I was not going to say something stupid, but I just can't see how the Rasyat trumps Ko Dali in most cases. Sure, the Rasyat has better CC and Smoke, but they have the same PH, same Armor, and Ko Dali has better BS, MOV and BTS values. They both have D-charges so Ko Dali can take out objectives as effectively as the Rasyat can, and with protheion she can buff herself up to 3 wounds.

    Sure, there are some moments were the rasyat would still be better, and he is cheaper, but overall I do think Ko Dali edges him out, especially when you remember CA has access to white noise to blind visors as well as eclipse smoke does.
     
  19. toadchild

    toadchild Premeasure

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    I think you're understating the cost - the combi or shotgun Rasyats cost about 10 points less than Ko Dali. That's not an insignificant amount of your army budget, especially in a faction where everything is expensive.

    If you want an AD Spitfire, the Fraacta outlcasses the Rasyat hands down, for a mere +1 point. The Fraacta hacker is also the only AD specialist.
     
  20. Leviathan

    Leviathan Hungry Caliban

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    A fairly poor specialist sadly, but since it's currently the only one until Cadmus get a rework, it does bear mentioning.
     
    toadchild likes this.