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Razor - TO Camo Minelayer

Discussion in 'O-12' started by split-infinity, Aug 15, 2019.

  1. split-infinity

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    If the HD Razor Minelayer drops a mine in deployment, it is pretty much broadcasting "Hey there is a guy in Hidden Deployment within 8" of this Camo Marker!"

    But if downgrade TO and deploy as a regular Camo Marker alongside the Mine Camo marker gives him a little of a shell game, not much but a little. Or deploy as non-minelayer as Regular Camo and let them think there is a Minelayer in HD. More shell games.

    That brings me to my question.
    If a Razor deploys as Camo marker, not TO, and is discovered it is at the Camo -3, but in following orders after he/she is discovered does it remain Camo -3 or does he/she regain the benefit of TO -6?

    Thanks in advance.
     
    ZlaKhon likes this.
  2. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    -3 to discover as they're in the Camouflaged state, but in subsequent orders you can choose to use C&H level 3 (TO) for the -6 to BS Attacks.

    Be careful of enemies doing Discover+Shoot though, as they'll be at -3 to both.
     
  3. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    There are several profiles in the game with the same "problem"... the shell game is that the enemy doesn't know if it's a camo trooper, or a mine. Once the mine explodes, the TO can be anywhere, but a Sensor full order from the mine's position must reveal the Hidden Deployment TO...

    So: deploy the mine in a way the enemy will need to eat it, not discover it, and the TO can possibly shoot at the sensor guy (the pulse is a full order), unless they use a remote to plant sniffers.
     
  4. ZlaKhon

    ZlaKhon New scale enthusiast

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    Minor point, but sensor is a short skill:
    http://wiki.infinitythegame.com/en/Sensor
     
    AdmiralJCJF and xagroth like this.
  5. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    yeah, I thought it was short for +6 discovering a single marker, full order to make the sweep or the Triangulated fire... anyway, the problem now is the Sensor troop can Sensor + shoot/dodge, so... ufff
     
  6. MrNailbrain

    MrNailbrain Relentless Optimist

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    Let’s completely disregard the shell game, because honestly that’s not a big deal in a faction with very limited options for camo troops and only one camo option that deploys outside the DZ. This isn’t Ariadna or YJ, leave the camo shell game to the big boys.

    You are bringing the Razor because it’s one of two unit choices in the faction with mines. (The other is the SMR and MSR Lynx profiles). Mines, simply put, are one of the best defensive tools in the game, because they completely ignore camo. Every other defensive tool in the game is unable to target a camo marker and have to play the game on your opponent’s terms.

    This is a painful lesson I learned playing Varuna, which similarly has only one source of mines (Croc Men). All the Jammers and BS16 Mimetism MSV2 Snipers in the world can’t stop a lowly camo token.
     
  7. AdmiralJCJF

    AdmiralJCJF Heart of the Hyperpower
    Warcor

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    To be fair, easy access to MadTraps will help improve things for O-12 in comparison to the likes of Varuna.
     
    MikeTheScrivener likes this.
  8. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

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    It's a short skill, but not a short movement skill. It can't be combined with shoot/dodge/etc.
     
  9. MikeTheScrivener

    MikeTheScrivener Kamau Amphibious Intervention Operative

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    Madtraps are a godsend for this army. An EVO repeater synergizes really well with double Kytta for defense too. AVA 2 TR bot also helps.

    tbh a Razor is pretty low on the the list of things I would take in the army – much less a Razor mine layer who is possibly outclassed by his specialist options.
     
  10. MrNailbrain

    MrNailbrain Relentless Optimist

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    You don’t need the Minelayer to get mines out there. All the profiles come with it. So take the FO for grabbing objectives and lay a few mines while you’re at it. Side note I love that he comes with a BSG, when I take a Croc FO the first thing I miss is that he only has a combi not the BSG.

    It’s not a model that will appear all the time but for some missions I think that the Razor will be very important.
     
  11. MikeTheScrivener

    MikeTheScrivener Kamau Amphibious Intervention Operative

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    exactly my point – I find minelayer really only to be useful in quantity >2 or a camo shell game. Other than that just spending orders to place them usually accomplishes the same thing.

    I actually find him super similar to the croc man in VIRD. Which for me, I include him like once every full moon. It's always tough to justify that points cost for a unit that doesn't reaaaaalllyyy do a whole lot more than other units in the faction and dies pretty much just as easily. TBH I kind of want a combi on him though – makes it easier to reach out a kill enemy TR bots and he misses out on suppressive.