Fellow Posthumans, I played a 200pts game this week end vs a FRRM army. Scenario was Supremacy. Here are the challenges I faced : My list below (we both did not know what faction the other would play) ALEPH ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 10 GARUDA Tacbot Boarding Shotgun / Electric Pulse. (0 | 21) PROXY Mk.5 (Forward Observer) 2 Submachine Guns, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 10) PROXY Mk.2 Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21) NAGA Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30) MYRMIDON Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 16) DEVA (Multispectral Visor L2) Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 33) NETROD . (0 | 4) NETROD . (0 | 4) DEVA Lieutenant Combi Rifle, Nanopulser + Devabot / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27) DEVABOT Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (4) ZAYIN Rebot HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26) LAMEDH Rebot Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8) 2.5 SWC | 200 Points Open in Infinity Army Chasseurs : - OH MY GOD... I had heard these guys were dangerous but I had no idea how devastating they are when played by a proeficient player - Twice in the game a chasseur was able to flank me and drop a mine in my face before popping out of cover the next activation to spray me with fire. This is a nasty and painful trick, but in the end I only had myself to blame (deployement + lack of cheap cover) - Unfortunately I lost my MSV2 first turn (explanation in next point) and that REALLY stung, had the deva survived the game would have turned VERY differently. - lesson learned / PTSD : fear the Chasseurs Foward Observer Para + guided Missile : - And this is how I lost my deva on turn 1. A FO para dropped on a flank and spotted me from max range. I dodged the first missile, NWI the second one, but the third one did the trick. - I regret not taking a hacker (only had a KHD & AHD) to try and hack the guided attacks. - lesson learned : Not sure about the guided missile. Seemed really efficient and my Deva felt a bit doomed once she was spotted. 360 vis chainrifle thora on each side of my DZ maybe ? FRRM in General : - Appart from the shock mines & Flame attacks they are really bothered by the NWI - Line troops / cheerleaders are really weak, garuda went to town on them, although I would swap the BS for a Combi on the Garuda in the future - I revealed my proxy mk2 quite early to try and kill the para to no avail. She did not do any damage but held the para & one chasseur for a complete turn. She did not kill a lot of points but my opponent wasted a LOT of orders dealing with her, and it was a small victory in itself. In the end I narrowly won the game because my KHD was able to hack an objective while his specialists failed their rolls. This despite being TWICE in loss of lieutenant (soul crushing)
This year we tried many things with guided missiles with my usual opponents. It can be brutal if it lands, but overall we all believed it cost too many orders for too little. To sum it up, if a FO can mark a target, so can a sniper, but with dam 15 DA marks, so you don't need to use another order to launch a missile. Sure you can mark with hacking or satlink, but it's unreliable, requires several things (repeater/sniffer, EVO + another rem for satlock ...) and can lead to many wasted orders when it's so much easier to just shoot the damn thing. I don't think it's worth taking a HD just for u-turn, but if you take the danava, don't forget her HD+ can do it too. The best use of guided missile i saw was a panoceanian using a CH:TO FO (can't remember if it was a spec sergent or a croc man) to infiltrate the opponent's field, mark some remote who was close to another trooper (it was turn 1, so no one had moved before) and kill the both of them. Was pretty unusual though, my own samekh is joked for having scored more objectives than hits (hey, those things are fast !). Given you were playing with only 200 pts, and without knowing the enemy, there were little you could do with your list making. Your list looks solid enough. It's more a matter of deployment, and what happened after that. Perhaps you could have had a better coverage for your flanks ? (yes, torakhites are good for that) Perhaps your deva was a little too exposed ?
Deva was deployed on my right flank, not too far from my Chain Myrmidon (and his smokes obviously). The Para dropped on the opposite flank and the DEVA actually ARO'd twice on the furthest band without hitting unfortunately. I did not expect such a long range threat from my left flank. My lieutenant & Proxy mark 5 were on the left flank and would have been able to deal with any short / medium range danger.
Consider this - it took the enemy 4 orders to take down your deva with missiles once he had something with vision to it. ... Thats not efficient at all. It hurt you because you pretty much *only* brought the deva that can deal with camos, no direct weapons, no templates, no sensor, etc. So your oponent figured out what was the biggest threat to his list and acted accordingly.
No direct weapons ? Half of his army has nanopulsers, with even a HFT. Or did i misunderstood what you wanted to say ? It's true the msv2 deva was the core of his army. But don't forget it was a 200 pts list built without knowing the opponent. I'm not sure the problem was in the list here.
I think the list is quite good. I would have gone for Proxy mk1 Medic + mk4 HRL + Mk2 AHD, however, and possibly leaving aside the remotes (no engineer... too many points in that Total Reaction. The Garuda would stay, though). Suggestion: if your Lt bites the dust, always choose the Posthuman as Lt later. So the enemy has to kill/isolate ALL proxy bodies AND all the Netrods to dump you on LoL again. I'd probably prefer this list: ALEPH ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 10 Tacbot GARUDA Escopeta de Abordaje / Pulso Eléctrico. (0 | 21) PROXY Mk.1 Médico (MediKit) Fusil Combi, Nanopulser / Pistola, Cuchillo. (0 | 10) PROXY Mk.4 Lanzacohetes Pesado, Subfusil, Nanopulser / Pistola, Cuchillo. (2 | 20) PROXY Mk.2 Hacker (Disp. de Hacker de Asalto) Escopeta de Abordaje, Nanopulser / Pistola, Cuchillo. (0.5 | 21) MIRMIDÓN Chain Rifle, Nanopulser, Granadas de Humo / Pistola, Arma CC AP. (0 | 16) NETROD . (0 | 4) NETROD . (0 | 4) DEVA Teniente Fusil Combi, Nanopulser + Devabot / Pistola, Cuchillo. (0 | 27) DEVABOT Lanzallamas Pesado / Pulso Eléctrico. (4) DEVA (Visor Multiespectral N2) Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistola, Cuchillo. (1 | 33) Rebot LAMEDH Pulso Flash, Sniffer / Pulso Eléctrico. (0 | 8) Rebot LAMEDH Pulso Flash, Sniffer / Pulso Eléctrico. (0 | 8) NAGA (Minador) Escopeta de Abordaje, Minas Antipersona / Pistola, Cuchillo. (0.5 | 27) 4 CAP | 199 Puntos Abrir en Infinity Army You can upgrade the Garuda to Combi Rifle if you think the +1 burst is better than the template (used right, and catching the enemy from behind, I think the BS is better). The idea here is to use the Naga as a roadstop. If your enemy knows (assume he does), he knows you have a TO hacker, but doesn't know if he's a Dasyu (a Dasyu costs 37 points as KHD, but 40 as AHD) or an Ekdromoi (AHD is 26 points, so he would smell something fishy). Point is, save the Mk2 for the right moment, Rambo with the Garuda from the beginning, and ARO right with the mk4 (dodge or return fire), while the others provide support. You don't want to use your troops in your first turn, aside from the Garuda! Since you don't have an engineer, nor any Servant, I suggest deploying the mk4 on the ground, so you can heal him with the mk1 if you need without isolating your only healer. Of course, it's a risky gambit. But there are three ways of playing Aleph: wiht an engineer and lots of remotes, or with a medic and little to no robots... Or with a Sophotect! Also, do not fear to use the Lt order from the beginning, it's quite obvious, so at least do a Supressive Fire.
I wonder about that. The wiki say: G: Jumper and Lieutenant If the G: Jumper trooper is the Lieutenant and all his Proxies enter the Isolated state, or any Null state, then that will result in a Loss of Lieutenant situation. This situation can be cancelled normally whether the player has an AI Beacon or not. I understand that having all proxies in a null state result in a loss of lieutenant state, no matter if you still have AI beacons. Plus, the normal way of cancelling the LoL state is to appoint a new lieutenant. So i don't think netrod can be of any help about being in LoL.
I find that the total reaction 360 HMG is a very scary threat, if only for the psychological effect. I would not see myself removing it from the list. About the posthuman Lt. That is very smart, I would not have thought about that, I chose the Naga as it was the most difficult target to reach / hit / wound. But he ended up doing a very good rool and my save rolls were miserable. The naga did his job perfectly though. As you said it was a big roadblock that covered 2 lanes thanks to a well placed mine. I am sure to bring at least another naga in the future (though not in 200pts maybe)
This is the error... You should have Dodged. PH 11 instead of BS 6 (12-6 for range) could have saved your Deva against the WIP 11 or less (14 -3/-6 for range and maybe -3 from cover?) of the Para Commando. And with a successful Dodge you can move out of LoS or go prone to avoid further attacks.
Words of wisdom. I just facepalmed right now ... I figured the movement would not allow me to get out of his LOF, but I forgot I could simply go prone with the dodge. ..
Yes, that is correct. I either misremembered something, or it was "stealthily changed" at one point (wouldn't be the first time, and not having a changelog anywhere is quite... incovenient). Anyway, it still is the best Lt if you still have at least 2 bodies, since all have either 2 wounds or 1+NWI, plus the different bodies. Well, the problem with the 360º total reaction is that is a remote. Unless you have an engineer, once your enemy takes it into KO he can forget about the remote, while having the chance to repair it will force your enemy to keep pounding at it until it's totally dead (total of 3 wounds). The mk4 does not really want to kill, just to not be killed (it's there to make your opponent to sink orders into taking him), and in case of death you don't lose the order, plus the SMG means moving ahead, suppresive fire, and AP or Shock ammo, plus the Dodge at 14 (11 in case of Surprise Shot, Vs 4 for the Total Reaction). At 300 points I'd suggest you to bring both, with a Sophotect, and leave them close (at different heights or more than 4 cm between bases) so they support each other (meaning the enemy needs to use the smoke combo or face ARO from 2 models) and you can bring back both (specially with a Yudbot so the Sophotect can still roam around reparing other stuff). Of course, at 300 points the Dakini also raise hell (mimetic Suppresive fire in the middle of the table, in cover: -9 to attacker!), and can be real objective grabbers for 15 points as paramedics (16 to grab supplies!!! Movement of 15-10cm!!!)
I really like the guided missiles - conceptually. Indirect fire is a godsend vs. fireteams, and the Samekh packs that extra punch compared to a daikini grenade launcher. Trouble is, it is 25% of your SWC, which forces you to make it key in your strategy, where it is more just of an extra trick in the bag. But trouble isn’t as much the Samekh as it is Spotlight. If Spotlight were reliable - like a B2 straight WIP roll, then it would be another matter. Or if Sat-lock were more readily available, then I’d see the point. But placing our FO specialist in a direct FtF in order to ‘maybe’ cause damage is a bit theoretical. Sacrificing a 28 pt. Naga Specialist to protect an 18 pt rem is just not worth it.
I also like the concept of guided missiles. But in N3, it is just too weak to be useful. My samekh usually spend all the game covering my back with its ARO (and i must say, it's not bad at all, BS12 and no negative range, 14AP+DA+ignore Arm in cover). And it earned me more objective points than it did wounds, simply because as it stays in the back, it is usually still up in turn 3, and it is fast enough to do some non specialist objectives like panoplies. In N2, spotlight was a straight WIP without reset, it was the infamous nomad dirty trick. There should be some middle ground for guided missiles between N2 and N3. I also would like if guided missile was an option in "the grid". Since antennas are not troops, they can't enter "targeted" state, thus we can't use guided missile on them. It would be nice if guided could be an option here.
Yeah, I've heard of that. And I really liked how it gave an aggressive use to Hacking – and gave the Nomads something to do with their abundant repeaters, beyond just setting up AROs against HI and TAGs. But still a B1 with WIP15 at best, resisted by opposing WIP, those aren't great odds, compared to spraying someone with a HMG. At best it is still two orders for a kill. And the combo would take 2 SWC at least for the missile launcher and the hacker. Which is the same as a HI or TAG HMG. And in todays environment with the addition and popularity of the KHD, it might not be that bad. Until something is done, I'll prefer Achilles and Patroclus as my guided missiles, and leave the Samekh at home.
It wasn't a face to face roll, so pure WIP14/15, the odds were far greater than now. So it was at least 2 orders, but with great success chances and no risk at all. When you shoot someone with an HMG, you have always the risk of a lucky crit.
Forum: "I don't think HMG works well with AD." Everyone I play: If they took an HMG on that Para they would have cut the order cost on that Deva kill in half or less.
It's especially surprising when we think that in Aleph we have great long range AD, perhaps the greatest, so we should be aware of their potential. Diomedes Mk12 for ex. is a pure murdering machine up to 60 cm (24'). The garudas can have both spitfire and HMG on BS12 mimetism frames (and you don't really care about being hackable when you have such range). The ekdromoi may seem more short ranged, but the combination of HMG and superjump allow for unexpected line of fires.
The problem is that most people go with Infiltrators, specially Nagas, since their cost is not big and you have the order avaiable (unlike a Dasyu in Hidden Deployment. And yes, you can "downgrade" him, but why go with such an expensive option?). And in SP, the idea tends to be "Assault", so...
