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N4 2020 and PanO

Discussion in 'PanOceania' started by Narkano, Aug 5, 2019.

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  1. Narkano

    Narkano Armed Shiba-Inu

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    So the GenCon seminar happened and one of the big takeaways was that we are getting N4 in 2020. Of course this means the game as a whole will hopefully see some positive updates and tweaks to address issues like the learning curve and redundant rules. But what would be some PanO specific changes we’d hope or expect?
     
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  2. barakiel

    barakiel Echo Bravo Master Sergeant
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    Great question. PanO's in a better place than it's it's been. Edition changes usually see some unit tweaking, but primarily in the form of point cost. The other big set or changes may not necessarily be the profiles themselves, but what individual weapons and wargear do. From N2 to N3 for example, HMGs went from being the best gun, to merely quite a good gun that was weak at extreme close range. So something like (random example) Montessa Spitfire may be unchanged, but could become way better if Spitfires change, CC changes, HI receive updates, etc.

    Ultimately, PanO doesn't feature a ton of unit variety. Changes to things like Camo, SMGs, Hacking, impetuous, or whatever simply don't affect us much, because we have a more narrow range of options compared to many armies.

    That being said, maybe we can benefit from targeted changes too. Changes to TAGs would be huge.
     
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  3. Narkano

    Narkano Armed Shiba-Inu

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    Good point, TAG changes could be huge for PanO since it’s likely fair to say CB wants us to be fielding them with how many options PanO has been given.
    Tactical awareness, slightly less severed hinderance to dodging, or some level of immunity being a given as a blanket buff to TAGs in all factions might help them see the table more. Obviously that brings up more nested rules which I’m hoping we’d see toned down. Maybe a simple re-costing of armor would reduce their cost enough to make them a less binary list building choice (TAG lives an win, TAG dies I lose).
     
  4. barakiel

    barakiel Echo Bravo Master Sergeant
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    If N4 triggers another across-the board points drop like N3 did, incorporating TAGs would be easier, even if their rules don't change. I kind of hope we don't see that though... Point decreases for some units are warranted, but a move towards even more units-per-list would damage the feel of the game in a significant way.

    Speaking more generally, I don't think the game needs massive overhauls. Clarifying the rules and the presentation of the rules to help both new and veteran players would make a big difference. But I generally like where PanO sits these days.
     
  5. Werekill

    Werekill Well-Known Member

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    The biggest thing I want in N4 is new mechanics so that the game gets more design space. The large amount of recent sectorials kinda showed that the game needs room to grow, in a lot of ways. I still love it though.

    Improved TAG viability would also be great, and so would Vanilla buffs. Something extra in Vanilla to make up for the lack of fireteams.

    Heck, even something like creating a vanilla-only Haris for each faction's common Core fireteam (like fusiliers) could be neat. Anything to make Vanilla a worthy option.

    For PanO specifically, I just want some tweaks. I'm a fan of buffs instead of nerfs for any game, and I'd love to have our weakest units buffed rather than our strong options nerfed. Stuff like the Orc getting buffs, for example.

    I'd also like for our BS to improved on the lackluster units. We're meant to be the top shooting faction, and it's common to see our shooting outclassed nowadays. Buffing already-weak units to have higher BS would go a long way to improving the faction feel.
     
  6. barakiel

    barakiel Echo Bravo Master Sergeant
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    I wouldn't hold my breath for ORCs. They're quite good in two Sectorials, which is more than a lot of units can claim when you compare their Vanilla appeal to their Sectorials appeal.

    Not quite sure why people fixate so intently on them too. The point of Vanilla is you get stuff that's better than sub-par units that Sectorials constrain you too. ORCs are a perfect example of that.
     
  7. Werekill

    Werekill Well-Known Member

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    I'm assuming the second sectorial is NCA? I haven't had a chance to test a link of them yet, sadly.

    I'm also not sure what you mean with your second statement. Orcs come with the PanO starter and are pretty clearly meant as the "base" HI for Vanilla and beyond. They aren't a unit only meant to be valued in a Sectorial, but there's such a wide gulf between them and almost any other PanO HI.

    Even just a small change would be welcome.
     
  8. daboarder

    daboarder Force One Commander
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  9. Stiopa

    Stiopa Trust The Fuckhead
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    I don't expect many changes to mechanics either, but CC and hacking will probably get overhauled to a degree.

    What I do expect, is some rebalancing across the board. This would mean changes for MO, which - while much better after the last update - remains the most restricted of our sectorials. I wouldn't be surprised if CB would try to bolster elite, LI gameplay some more, and this would be right up the knights' alley.
     
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  10. Ayadan

    Ayadan Knight of the TAG Order

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    Beware about asking for stronger LI lists. Because they are already very strong in the hand of a player who knows how to make it work.
    I ask more for a rework of counterintelligence and for giving to LI lists what does counterintellingence for now. Because at the moment, the skill is on cheap units that are nearly autoinclude in their army and they are in armies already able field 16 orders lists with them in said lists. And giving to LI lists 10 orders without giving to your opponent the possibility to tame it down a bit is quite dumb.
     
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  11. daboarder

    daboarder Force One Commander
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    Shrug, who cares anymore. At these days ill just laugh and use any buff i get more regardless of complaints about X Y or Z
     
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  12. Ayadan

    Ayadan Knight of the TAG Order

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    So do I but since playing a LI list right is something rare for what I know, people feels comforted in the idea that LI lists need buff while they won't play them because they will try to get the both the two groups lists and whatever buff to LI lists they can put in them. The best example is NCO, Lt L2 and TacAw with Dashat/YJ.

    At the moment, the balance is rather good. Some armies need some help but they are rather few. Popularity problem is a whole other world.
     
  13. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    After the niu MO I'm not exactly keen on counting on anything.

    But probably either ASA will return or we are looking at Shval vs White Banner N4 starter.
     
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  14. Ayadan

    Ayadan Knight of the TAG Order

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    My money on SWF vs WB. MO will get OOP for the occasion but all the new sculpts will be usable in SWF (excepted maybe Joan but Joan is always playable).
     
  15. Judge Dredd

    Judge Dredd Well-Known Member

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    My money is on NCA. Half the starter is old and many of the models for it are too like auxilia. Or they may cut out all the old skus from both NCA and MO. That would be a bit surprising.
     
  16. Cartographer

    Cartographer Well-Known Member

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    All G:RP TAGs getting Tac Awareness.
    Hackers coming with a massively limited programme list, but a continuous passive buff (so you pick your gadget-equivalent programme at list building, or maybe deployment).
    New and more varied Auxbots, spread across the LI, MI and HI of the faction.
     
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  17. andre61

    andre61 Well-Known Member

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    Smoke! for Pano, But I know it's not going to happen, But I can yell, smoke for Pano! till it happens.
     
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  18. eciu

    eciu Easter worshiper

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    Fact that only Hospitallers got resculped more or less guarantee it. Funny question is if Hosp+Mag will be a thing in SWF.

    Plus MO is already partially OOP, Santiagos are gone (and KotHS afair).
     
  19. Quehacesfede

    Quehacesfede Professional Catastrophiser

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    Well, Magisters also got resculpted. Joan got a new miniature not so long ago, same De Fersen.

    But the fact that CB refuses to make a miniature for the Montesa, and the prehistoric sculpts for the OS, KoTHS, Santiagos and Teutons, are bad signs indeed.

    Even the MO starter is so old it's practically unbuyable. If CB wants to remove SKUs from their catalog, that's were I'll start from.
     
  20. Skoll

    Skoll Well-Known Member
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    Another pass at teuton rework would be nice. But not really holding out hope
     
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