I do not think I have ever seen an answer to this. Camouflage and TO Camouflage states in their effects that "Troopers cannot enter base to base contact with a Camouflage Marker." Is there a rule which allows you to ignore this rule for friendly Camo/TO Camo?
I always assumed this was superseded by the standard rule allowing you to pass through friendly models with equal or lower silhouette.
Except equipment. You vault friendly equipment if you treat them like an obstacle (which is what @ijw has suggesged you do) or can't pass them if you don't. That being said I've always seen both equipment and troopers played the same way and think that's far easier: so I don't make an issue of it.
So are you saying that you can enter Base to Base contact with a Camouflage Marker or are you saying that you can simply just pass through a Camouflage Marker without entering Base to Base with it? In other words; but how does that relate to the camouflage marker?
I don't know. I'm just pointing out that 'troopers and not Markers' is a false division, as being in Marker state stops a trooper being a model*, but doesn't stop it being a trooper. Personally, I play that troopers can move through friendly Markers, based on Silhouette Attribute value, because it makes sense in terms of gameplay and doesn't lead to weird 'So my TAG can walk over my mate Bob if he's visible, but if he's put on a ghillie suit he becomes impassible?' situations. Obviously that's not a rules argument, but a pragmatic gameplay decision. *Ignoring Holo2.
I think that's the generally accepted way of playing it as well, even if the rules really don't say that, but I'm quasi asking the question that maybe "can not enter Base to Base" might be interpreted as that you can go through a Camo but never count as entering base to base with it.
Then there’s the whole bit of physics where the trooper uses the mine skill to place a camo marker in base contact with itself, and it’s forbidden to enter base contact with the marker. On the other digit, not being able to engineer a camo’d TAG because the engineer allowed to enter base contact with the marker goes weird if you look at the two sequences: 1. Engineer moves into base contact with a damaged revealed TAG 2. The TAG turns its camo back on 3. Can the engineer fix the camo’d TAG? Was base contact supposed to be broken in step 2?
There’s also a potential difference between “base contact” as a measure of distance and “base contact” as a prerequisite for certain skill declarations. For example, a Sophotect may be able to pass through a TO marker representing a wounded Dasyu in NWI state, but she can’t heal her until she is revealed as a model.
The next question is, does camo get cancelled when a friendly troop moves through it? From the camo state rules: "Cancellation: - The Camouflaged trooper enters base to base contact with a model." It would certainly mean that the camo troop moving through other friendly troops would reveal itself. Are Tinbots markers or models?
It would have to say 'when a model enters base to base contact with the Camouflaged trooper' to do that.
You mean "Does camo get cancelled if it moves through a friendly trooper?" which is a damned good question, and I think it does even if I don't think I have ever heard anyone play it that way (we certainly don't)
After looking at the rulebook, and then digging out the 2nd edition rulebook to compare how Camouflage used to work, and how much of Camo’s behavior was from the 2nd edition FAQs, I’m not entirely surprised. Because the rules say that you get bizarre situations like: - If you have a camo’d TAG, the TAG has to come to the engineer (initiate base contact to break camo), the engineer can’t initiate base contact. - Once you put a mine down, you can’t leave and walk back into base contact with it. (If you don’t treat mines/deployed equipment as troopers for the Camouflage rules, huge portions of the rules break, too.)
They are “game state markers” much like wounds, unconscious, prone, etc. They don’t have any negative interactions with camo in any way.
Troopers cannot enter base to base contact with a Camouflage Marker. You guys are thinking physical base to base as in minis touching each other. That's not what the rule talks about. The rule is talking about the game term 'base to base contact'. Cancellation A trooper's Camouflaged state is canceled, and its Marker replaced by its model, whenever: The Camouflaged trooper enters base to base contact with a model. Initiative is on the Camouflaged trooper here... ...as in "it is impossible for other models to claim base to base contact with a Camo Marker and reveal him". This effectively boils down to Camo Markers not getting revealed if someone walks into them, but still allows them to do so themself. As IJW points out correctly a Camo Marker doesn't cease to be a trooper under the Marker. Here is a piece of rule text to make that more clear: Enemies cannot declare Attacks against a trooper in the Camouflaged state without previously Discovering that trooper, or declaring Intuitive Attack. A Camo Marker should count as a trooper just fine for moving and moving through him - assuming it's not a Mine. Oh and btw, you can vault over enemy Camo Markers since you can't enter base to base contact if they don't reveal: A trooper's Movement ends automatically whenever he enters base to base contact with an enemy, even if the movement route specified is cut short as a result.
Yes, cannot enter base to base contact, as in cannot ever touch an enemy Camo marker. Which means that no, you can't vault an enemy Camo marker, because that implicitly involves base contact.
