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Mini tournament HB batrep

Discussion in 'Haqqislam' started by QueensGambit, Sep 25, 2022.

  1. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    Played in a very fun tournament yesterday, and thanks to the folks in Montreal for hosting. Since the forums are a bit tumbleweedy these days, I thought I'd post a summary of the new HB in action.

    Round 1 - Firefight vs. Kosmoflot

    Firefight
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    [b]BARID (Hacker, Killer Hacking Device [UPGRADE: Trinity (-3)])[/b] Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    ASAWIRA AP Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 39)
    GHULAM (NCO) Rifle, Grenade Launcher, Smoke Grenade Launcher / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1 | 15)

    FANOUS REMOTE Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 7)
    FARZAN (Chain of Command) Boarding Shotgun, Shock Mines / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28)
    BARID (Hacker, Hacking Device) Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 17)
    GHULAM (Lieutenant [+1 Command Token]) Rifle, Light Shotgun / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    GHULAM (Number 2) Rifle, Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 13)

    FIDAY Rifle, Light Shotgun, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 26)
    McMURROUGH Chain Rifle(+1B), Grenades, Smoke Grenades / AP + DA CC Weapon. (0 | 27)
    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]2 [​IMG]3 [​IMG]1
    BOKHTAR (Parachutist, NCO) Red Fury / Viral Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 56)
    SHAYTANIYAH REMOTE Missile Launcher / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (1.5 | 16)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 8)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 8)
    MUTTAWI'AH Boarding Shotgun, Jammer, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 10)
    6 SWC | 300 Points
    Open in Infinity Army

    I don't love the Bokhtar the way some people do, but Firefight seemed like the right mission to try her out. For Firefight I stripped out all the specialists. The idea is that McMurrough, the Fiday, and the Asawira fireteam are plenty of attacking potential on round 1, and on round 2 or 3 the Bokhar moves into group 1 and goes on a rampage. The second fireteam is there for an alternate Pitcher vector and a B2 panzerfaust ARO.

    At the table I promptly forgot about the second fireteam and ended up just kind of deploying everyone in the middle of my DZ, so when I realized what I'd done I just put most of them in a 5-trooper Core. At least I still had the panzerfaust on ARO duty.

    I thought I had my Lt in an unassailable spot, but a miraculously super-jumping Uxia killed him on the first order of the game. In retrospect, she may have been deployed in my DZ - my opponent was a newer player who may have made a rules mistake. No biggie, though - this was the only good luck he had. Uxia got spotlit in ARO and GMLed in due course. A bear tried an attack run and I opted not to waste Panzerfaust rounds against Immunity(Total), but the Ghulam's rifle took it down before it got too close (the Ghazi's jammer was there as a backup if needed).

    Then the Asawira and his original two teammates strolled across a bridge from my DZ to a tower in the midfield, and just spent the whole game shooting at everything on the board. The free Bashi walked into my opponent's DZ and removed most of a Scots Guard haris with his shotgun. There was nothing left for the Bokhtar to do, and she came on on turn 3 to poke a panoply. 56 points well spent, for a 10-0 win.


    Round 2 - Frontline vs. Nomads



    Countermeasures/Frontline
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    YARA HADDAD (Strategic Deployment) AP Marksman Rifle / Heavy Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (0 | 28)
    GHULAM (NCO) Rifle, Grenade Launcher, Smoke Grenade Launcher / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1 | 15)
    BARID (Hacker, Killer Hacking Device [UPGRADE: Trinity (-3)]) Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)

    BARID (Hacker, Hacking Device) Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 17)
    GHULAM (Doctor [+3]) Rifle, Light Shotgun ( | MediKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    ASAWIRA (Lieutenant) AP Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 39)

    McMURROUGH Chain Rifle(+1B), Grenades, Smoke Grenades / AP + DA CC Weapon. (0 | 27)
    FANOUS REMOTE Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 7)
    KAMEEL (Hacker, EVO Hacking Device) ( ) / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0.5 | 15)
    FARZAN (Chain of Command) Boarding Shotgun, Shock Mines / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28)
    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG]1
    SHIHAB REMOTE Heavy Machine Gun / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (1 | 24)
    SHAYTANIYAH REMOTE Missile Launcher / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (1.5 | 16)
    FIDAY Rifle, Light Shotgun, Shock Mines, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 27)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 8)
    NAJJARUN Engineer Rifle, Light Shotgun, D-Charges / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    NASMAT PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 3)
    6 SWC | 299 Points
    Open in Infinity Army

    This list was for Countermeasures as well, hence the Engineer and Evo which otherwise look like weird picks. They still do work, though; the Engineer let me put up both the Shihab and the Shaytaniyah on ARO, and the EVO put Marksmanship on the Shihab at a key moment where I needed it to take out Pi-Well efficiently from across the board.

    The game exemplified the adage that Nomads have scary hackers, but their models are all flimsy and vulnerable to alpha strikes. Turn 1, McMurrough took out a Moran and its koala, getting Isolated by a Heckler and Targeted in the process. McMurrough doesn't care, though, he's used to working alone and he shrugs off guided missiles. The Fiday took down a Puppetmaster and an Intruder sniper that got caught in the template. The Asawira team threw over some repeaters and the Yara team removed Zoey with Trinity(-3).

    In the bottom of 1, a beasthunter deleted Yara and her whole team, but by then the damage was done. Turn 2 McMurrough ran into the backline where he just stared down the Nomad GML, and the Ghulam doctor did the same to the remaining hacker (an Interventor Lt). With hacking and shooting both neutralized, the Nomads were helpless for turns 2 and 3. My opponent did well to get a Meteor Zond into my near zone and add an Intelcom card to score that zone, for an 8-3 HB victory.

    Round 3 - Countermeasures vs. Steel Phalanx

    This was a great game. SP has been a challenge to me for a long time, playing vanilla Haqq I've had a lot of trouble chewing through the wounds, ARM, and mimetism. My opponent this time was running the type of list I've had trouble with - limited insertion with a beefy Phoenix link and Achilles.

    I had second turn. The Fiday doesn't do much against SP, so I deployed it to threaten the link with a shotgun to make my opponent waste a few orders. Turn one, Achilles spent said orders to remove the Fiday and resulting mine, then tried an attack run but foundered on the AROs and repeater and ran out of orders. My opponent did two classifieds with a drop troop hacker, though, so I was behind.

    On my turn, Yara's team took out the hacker with Trinity(-3), then took out Achilles with a B4 AP MMR through smoke. Killing Achilles was deeply satisfying, but I only got one classified so I was still behind.

    Turn 2, my opponent did another classified but still couldn't break through my defense. I moved up the Asawira link and got a classified, and McMurrough did some damage, so I was down 2-3 going into turn 3 but the position felt strong. I risked going after another link member with Yara, which was a mistake as I didn't have the orders to put down smoke, and Yara died to a B2 panzerfaust ARO.

    Turn 3, my opponent charged into the midfield with the whole link, doing 2 more classifieds, killing some stuff, and occupying the middle of the board with about a million wounds and armor. It was 2-5, I had to get all three classifieds to tie the game, and it was looking grim. But I already had the Asawira link on my opponent's side of the board, and they managed to do two classifieds on flank, then cross behind the backs of the SP link to do the final classifed on the other flank on the last order of the game, for a 6-6 tie!

    In the end, I came third place and might have managed second or first if I hadn't misplayed Yara in round 3.


    Thoughts

    - I'm really liking the paradigm of two links of three units each. Both links are very versatile and complement each other. The Asawira murders most things, and Yara murders Achilles :-) But, it's absolutely necessary to place smoke before shooting with Yara. She's just too flimsy and not a good enough gunfighter to risk shooting without the effective mim(-6). Also, 2x3 links can spread out more than 1x5, although the Beasthunter in round 2 demonstrated how even a link of three is vulnerable to clumping.

    - Spotlight is only good in ARO. It killed Uxia in round 1, but that was the only guided missile I dropped. But, the linked pitchers are a great way to reach hackers with Trinity(-3). I used to run two Barid HDs, but I think I'll be sticking with one HD and one KHD going forward.

    - McMurrough, unsurprisingly, is very good. @Diphoration's advice on him has been really helpful - McMurrough generally doesn't rambo, but goes into the midfield on turn 1 and waits. He's a pain to remove, and if you don't remove him, watch out on turn 2!

    - I've only tried the Bokhtar a few times, but I've rarely gotten anywhere near 56 points of value from her.
     
  2. Brokenwolf

    Brokenwolf Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for the report! How did you exploration in Vanilla Haqqislam go? What brought you back into HB? Two triads seems to be a sweet spot for a lot of sectorial players.

    To replace the Bokhtar, a Sunduqbot looks like it could slot well into the first list. Have you been able to play with it yet?
     
  3. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    Vanilla was great. I was mostly running HB units plus Liberto, Zuleyka, and Saladin. I didn't miss the fireteams, especially after Raveneye since Asawira+Rafiq is so good. I found I wasn't fond of the Mukhtar - she was great in N3, but DAM13 wasn't doing it for me in N4.

    I went back to HB when they gave us McMurrough :-) So it's not a huge change - Zuleyka -> McMurrough, Saladin -> Ghulam NCO to use the Lt order, the biggest loss I'm feeling is the Liberto. Defense feels a bit flimsy without that cheap minelayer - witness game 2 above where I had no way to stop a Beasthunter.

    Not running Saladin frees up points, and not running Liberto frees up SWC, so overall I feel like I have a bit more to put into attacking power in HB. And I find McMurrough to be a much stronger attacker than Zuleyka (though also losing the Liberto as an attack piece).

    But honestly, the two factions are nearly identical inasmuch as both revolve around the Asawira AP Spitfire for me.

    I haven't tried it, but maybe I should consider the minelayer to help with that missing Liberto problem. 49 points feels like a lot to hang out to dry in the midfield, though. I'd be more inclined to replace the Bokhtar with a Shakush. I ran a list along those lines in a tournament a few weeks ago, and as usual was pretty happy with the Shakush. It feels a little stodgy next to all these newfangled msv mimetism camo superjump viral decoy kids, but maybe I like stodgy. You can rely on stodgy.
     
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  4. Brokenwolf

    Brokenwolf Well-Known Member

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    Do you think you could get away with changing the Farzan CoC for the minelayer? Or is the +1 Command token without a decoy too risky?
     
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  5. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    For a bit was running the Ghulam +1CT with a decoy and no CoC. Then an opponent went after one of them with a Caliban - he didn't think it was my Lt, he just wanted food for the Caliban, but as it happened it was my Lt - and I was like, this is too risky. Ghulams die all the time. Not sure it's good logic since I was running Saladin without CoC and a Caliban could have taken him out just as easily as a Ghulam. Also, a minelayer could have stopped the Caliban.

    You're right, it's definitely worth thinking about. Another option would be to replace the Fiday with a Farzan minelayer. I like Fidays, but I don't love them, although maybe if I faced Nomads more often I'd like them more.
     
  6. Diphoration

    Diphoration Well-Known Member
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    Second

    Do you prefer HB now? I miss McMurrough a bit, but the 2 bikers are so good now.
     
  7. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    Heh, yeah I wasn't sure how far ahead you were so I didn't know if I'd have had a chance to catch up. Funny that the system paired 1st against 4th and 2nd against 3rd for the final round.

    I'm not sure I prefer one over the other. My pattern seems to be to go back and forth - started HB in N3, switched to Vanilla after a year, switched to HB at the start of N4, switched to Vanilla after a year, switched to HB now. I have the models for both so switching every year or two may work well for me. (Tried having SAA as a second army for a while, but two factions at once turned out to be more than I wanted).

    Anyway, I haven't played enough HB to say with confidence which I think is stronger right now. Have you played enough New Zamira to assess how good she is in practice?

    I found Zuleyka was great for her points, but only because she was so cheap. I don't like the gambling approach to her so didn't run her past AROs smoke dodging - I kept her in the back until turn 2 or 3 when she was clear to make a run, which happened sometimes but not always. The rest of the time, she was a smoke thrower and killed things that came too close to my side. Which was great, but McMurrough does all that so much better. What Zuleyka lacked was the ability to survive a reactive turn in the midfield.

    I also found two bikes was too many for me - there often weren't two good spots to deploy them, so I started losing them to long-range fire if I went second.

    I think possibly my playstyle leans more towards solid defense than risky attacks, which may explain why I'm enjoying HB more than Vanilla in most respects, but missing the Liberto.

    So, I'm really keen to hear how the two sisters in one list are working, but not particularly sad to have McMurrough instead for now.
     
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  8. Diphoration

    Diphoration Well-Known Member
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    Yeah, OTM tries to make sure the top 4 play versus each other and since you had already played the other player you should've faced it bumped the order.


    She's very good, not as good as people think though. (She did berzerk a PanO TAG in that tournament and bricked it forever)

    The speed is very good, but she has a enormous base, so there is some amount of counterplay possible. That being said, she's also ridiculously cheap, so for the point cost, she's ridiculous.[/QUOTE]

    Oh I absolutely play them super greedy, super gamble. Now that both are good, and both have dogged, your change to highroll one of them is pretty significant. And if one of them manages to make it deep, then they'll wreak havoc.

    I also tend to play extremely cagey, very defensive in HB/Haqq, but now I do it for 277 points in the list. :) I just view them as smoke warbands that are a couple of points too expensive, but in exchange can accidentally brick a from 14".

    The real MVPs though from vanilla so far have been the Hunzakut (that profile is RIDICULOUS) and the Mukhtar duo (MSV2+Hacker) I would play 3 or 4 Mukthar if they had a higher AVA,t hey're crazy good.

    And, I hate to admit it, but Saladin actually is pretty decent. (Though I still think he's way too fragile for what he gives to the list, but I haven't played him enough to have a definitive take on him).

    Overall though, the vast majority of my list is basically the same as my HB list lol.
     
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  9. theGricks

    theGricks Well-Known Member

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    The Bohktar has actually been growing on me, but I play the BSG or the Viral options (Parachutist, and haris link team member respectively). The Sunduqbut minelayer is amazing though UNLESS it has to fight through midfield. Its just a HI gun platform and mimetism hurts it. My oponents often do mistake it though for two daylami's and a farzan.

    Thanks for the rundown on your battles!
     
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