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Limited insertion list building theory

Discussion in 'Tohaa' started by borings, Jan 21, 2019.

  1. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    heyaaaa. So we havin a limited insertion (what a gross name for a game format) jawn next week here in philly, and i figured i'd share my lists with yall and talk about my choices and such. Missions are gonna be acquisition, supplies, and frostbyte. 300 pts, single combat group, no other extras.

    [​IMG] Tohaa - Acquisition/Supplies (300/300 | 5.5/6)

    Group #1 | 10 Models | [​IMG] 10 [​IMG] 0 [​IMG] 0

    [​IMG] Clipsos Observer | Forward Observer, Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines, Pistol / Knife (25)
    [​IMG] Clipsos Observer | Forward Observer, Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines, Pistol / Knife (25)
    [​IMG] Clipsos Observer | Forward Observer, Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines, Pistol / Knife (25)
    [​IMG] Taqeul Lieutenant Viral | Lieutenant, Advanced Command, Viral Combi Rifle, SymbioBugs, Pistol / Knife (40)
    [​IMG] Taqeul Chain of Command Viral | Chain of Command, Viral Combi Rifle, SymbioBugs, Pistol / Knife (40)
    [​IMG] Nikoul Viral Sniper Rifle | Viral Sniper Rifle, Pistol / Knife (28)
    [​IMG] Nikoul Minelayer | Minelayer, Viral Sniper Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines, Pistol / Knife (30)
    [​IMG] Armand MSV 1 | Multispectral Visor L1, MULTI Sniper Rifle, Nanopulser, Breaker Pistol (2) / Shock CCW, Knife (45)
    [​IMG] Kaeltar SymbioMate Shotgun | Chain of Command, SymbioMate (2), Flash Pulse, Light Shotgun, Pistol / Electric Pulse (21)
    [​IMG] Kaeltar SymbioMate Shotgun | Chain of Command, SymbioMate (2), Flash Pulse, Light Shotgun, Pistol / Electric Pulse (21)

    Ok so the basis of this list is trying to pretend like i care about board control when i relly just want to do things with clipsos. Acquisition and supplies dont realllly care too much about killing stuff, so most of my killing potential is going to be incidental. The real goal is to make my opponents think about hiw to deal with snipers instead if doing their mission.

    Each unit, by mission, starting with

    Supplies:
    Clipsos:
    these all want to start basically right behind the tech boxes. Hopefully, i go first, and i have each grab a box, and then i use my 5 command tokens to coordinate them all back while moving taqeuls forward. Going second, grab whatever boxes my opponent didnt grab, but basically the same. In limited insertion, people are not going to have the orders to grab more than 1 or 2 without multiple infiltrators or drop troops. The clipsos should definitely not be used for aros, but they could prolly be used to drop some mines as they retreat. After the clipsos get across, try to have them jump ub byildings, go prone, amd then suppressive fire
    Taqeuls: they wanna start as far forward as is safe, and move the bugs to cover whatever boxes didnt get opened right away. Make sure to put them in standby. After you have a box or two secure, feel free to have the lt. run forward to try to get a kill or two before dying. They are meant to act as speedbumps, and to be something to soend orders on in turns 2 and 3
    Snipers: each one should be looking at at least one tech box. I would have armand be the reserve troop, since he gets to deploy up to 20" in, and should be in a spot where he can see some guys to kill as well. It does mean he doesnt get a symbiomate, but he honestly doesnt need it as bad as the nikouls. Going first its worthwhile to spend an order or two on armand to clear the eay for the clipsos
    Kaeltar: really just here for mates. Have them stand on the edges to be on the lookout for walk ons, or otherwise covering the snipers butts.

    This list is pretty straightforward for this mission. Infiltration is the best way to get the boxes. Gao tarsos are mebbe as good, what with paramedic giving them two rolls, but on the flipside they hafta make a phy check just to get there, which really counters than advantage, especially since i will assume in limited insertion that my opponent will have hackers which makes dropping in even worse. The clipsos being cheaper and having to to make them harder to shoot makes the difference for me. The clipsos in cover and suppressive puts a -12 on them shooting, which is pretty nice. I would worry about sensor im limited insertion, and while i do expect to see msv2, most troops with it are too slow to be able to get to the clipsos and pick up their supplies with any amount of reliability. Also, speaking of msv2, normally im reticent to bring this many snipers because of smoke trick, but in limited insertion i expect to see that less, as smoke is usually on very cheap guys, and the trick itself can be too order intensive for people to consider being worthwhile

    Acquisition:
    Clipsos:
    whereas the clipsos in supplies wanna appear right away and run around, these clipsos are holding out til turn 3. Not really worried about sensor showing up here, and even if i was, not really worried about the opponent spending some orders moving a sensor unit to midfield just on the off chance he finds something. That being said, the clipsos in the middle will prolly see action if i go first, namely moving around dropping mines
    Taqeuls: if im going first, i want the xenotech and the datatracker to be on the lieutenant, standing right in the middle, 4 inches away from the center beacon if at all possible. First order should be lt. moving up and then doing the xeno mission. They should then just hug the center thing. Going second, they should do the same, but the xeno should be on the CoC taqeul. The datatracker will prolly get knocked out at some point, the plan is to have them regenerate on the last turn. Sure, its a 50/50, but i don't think theres really a much better option. The CoC taq should be on data tracker hunting duty. Its fine if they die doing this, as long as the enemy datatracker dies too
    Snipers: just cover the objectives as best as possible. Armand might be used pretty aggressively on this mission, since he gets to start at the actual midline if he wants to
    Kaeltar: same as in supplies

    This list is obviously not as good as it is in supplies. I like it better than the frostbyte list however, as it offers more guys to interact with objectives. General gameplan is to kill time til turn 3, and then have clipsos show up and have them do objectives.hopefully the taqeuls and snioers will prove hard enough to kill to earn that much time. To be fair, this is the exact kind of mission that clispsos are best at, especially going second


    Finally:
    [​IMG] Tohaa - Frostbyte (297/300 | 5.5/6)

    Group #1 | 10 Models | [​IMG] 10 [​IMG] 0 [​IMG] 3

    [​IMG] Sukeul HMG | HMG, D-Charges, Pistol, Breaker Pistol / Knife (35)
    [​IMG] Makaul DA CCW | Eclipse Grenades, Heavy Flamethrower, Pistol / DA CCW (13)
    [​IMG] Makaul DA CCW | Eclipse Grenades, Heavy Flamethrower, Pistol / DA CCW (13)
    [​IMG] Sukeul HMG | HMG, D-Charges, Pistol, Breaker Pistol / Knife (35)
    [​IMG] Sakiel Nullifier | Nullifier, Combi Rifle, Pistol / Knife (18)
    [​IMG] Makaul DA CCW | Eclipse Grenades, Heavy Flamethrower, Pistol / DA CCW (13)
    [​IMG] Neema Breaker Combi Lieutenant | Lieutenant, Advanced Command, Breaker Combi Rifle, Panzerfaust, Nanopulser, Viral Pistol / Shock CCW (46)
    [​IMG] Kaeltar SymbioMate Shotgun | Chain of Command, SymbioMate (2), Flash Pulse, Light Shotgun, Pistol / Electric Pulse (21)
    [​IMG] Kaeltar SymbioMate Shotgun | Chain of Command, SymbioMate (2), Flash Pulse, Light Shotgun, Pistol / Electric Pulse (21)
    [​IMG] Gorgos Pulzar Peripheral | AP Spitfire, Flammenspeer, Pulzar / Shock CCW (82)
    [​IMG] Chaksa Peripheral B | Pulzar, Pistol / Knife

    Ah frostbyte, what a silly mission. This seems really appropriate for limited insertion. My plan here is to kill their datatracker. Secondary is to kill their heaters. The gorgos is gonna be my datatracker, and hes just trying to live as long as possible.

    Im gonna break my trend and talk about his in terms of triads, hope thats ok
    Sukeul/makaul/makaul: tohaas best shooter and our best cc guy. If you get this triad to a heater, you can attack it with a burst 3 attack that requires the heater to make 6 armor saves vs damage 18. It should die in a single burst is what im saying. They should be able to do that to the enemy datatracker too.
    Sukeul/sakiel/makaul: these guys are the same as the other ones, but they also have the responsibility of dropping a nullifier or two to make it so the gorgos can safely get into the exclusion zone
    Neema/kaeltar/kaeltar: haha jk these arent a triad! The kaeltar should be on the wings. Mebbe try to turn in a heater on turn two or three. Neema is just trying to survive. She should go into suppresive asap
    Gorgos: the crux of this plan. 5 of the points in this mission revolve around the datatracker. We want ours to be our heartiest unit (the gorgos is one of the most defensive tags in the game) but he needs some nullifiers to be safe. Spend the extra orders he gets to move into a good spot. Use the symbiomate aggressively. We want this big guy to lose his armor and then activate a heater on the last turn if its feasible. Oviously, dont rip off yer skin if it still has 2 or 3 wounds, but losing one to be able to do a mission and then hide somewhere is worth it.


    Its quite possible theres a better list, mebbe with more ectros, but i dont like tohaas odds with them. I am 100% sure opponents will be bringing hackers here, and while nullifiers make for ok defense, they dont offer the mobile death that sukeul makaul triads bring. I mean, the sukeul is our best shooter, and the makauls just explode heaters. I could try to play defense and turn on heaters and such, but if someone brings a 5-man with 2 wound units, theres really nothing tohaa has that can stop them in limited insertion, especially in a mission like this, where the goal is essentially kill as much as possible.


    Anyways, i dunno if going over my thought process is helpful for anyone else, but i hope it is for someone. I haven't really tested these yet, so they are mostly theoretical. I did play the supplies list earlier, and i got a 7-0 victory (i had one box and got one clasified, my opponent had none), so theres that.



    Edit: i realized i should clarify: we use models for the objective markers, so in supplies/acquisition the clipsos will have something to hide behind. Im not sure i would want to try this strategy if that werent the case, as they would be exposed for longer than i would like
     
    #1 borings, Jan 21, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2019
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  2. Saitan247

    Saitan247 Well-Known Member

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    Thx for sharing, really like your write-ups :)
     
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  3. Alkasyn

    Alkasyn Well-Known Member

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    I think it will be very obvious you have 3 Clipsos in the first list and I'd consider a Minelayer Clipsos to cover that up (set a mine up and set him in regular camo to make it look like you only have 1 guy in Hidden Deployment).
     
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  4. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    That is a valid point, but like i said im really not expecting to see sensor in limited insertion. Having three observer makes supplies doable, as i have a decent chance to win the wip roll and go first and grab all three boxes. not winning the wip roll means im in position to grab any boxes they couldnt get to with the small order pool.

    Also, if i deploy first, i dont have to ask my opponent to walk away, i can just write a note saying "clipsos .1 cm behind each objective marker". If i keep armand as my reserve, i have a 120 pt gap, which could be a lot of things. Yeh its most likely clipsos, but its not guaranteed to be 3 observers, mebbe im being crazy and bringing a sniper, or mebbe even a tarsos hmg.

    Having a mine up there would be nice, as it would threaten having an igao, but the downside of having a mine would be that it wont a two wound model, and i consider the chances of an opponent bringing up a one wound model to be pretty much nil. Like, mebbe a jsa/tohaa player would have a mirror list of this with ninja/clipsos, but i dont ever really try to build counters for mirror matches.

    All that being said, if this werent limited insertion, i would 100% have some minelayer in the mix.
     
  5. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    Thanks! I was thinking about these lists, and i really dont feel great about tohaa with just ten orders, and i realized that since it is such a departure from my norm that perhaps other people could benefit from seeing my thought process, mebbe learn from my mistakes. Im gonna try to do a post-batle report next week if i remember.
     
  6. Alkasyn

    Alkasyn Well-Known Member

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    It's not about sensor, but about the surprise factor. In your writeup the enemy knows there are 3 Clipsos somewhere on the board.

    In my suggestion the enemy thinks there's 1 max 2 things in Hidden Dep.
     
    #6 Alkasyn, Jan 22, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2019
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  7. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    Well in supplies, if im going first the first thing im doing is revealing all three, so its not really a surprise at all. The only time it would be surprising is during deployment, but the surprise isnt really useful as i have to assume my opponent will have aro pieces watching the objectives, so them being there or not isnt a thing. Going second, i want all three of theto be able to grab whatever box is still left. Like if i bring minelayer, and they dont go for that box because its clear i dont have a specialist there, i have to spend extra orders moving to get to that box, which they also could have tried to get better coverage on in the meantime. Basically im not playing them for surprise, im playing them for the fact that they all get to start out at the objective with no way for my opponent to stop them from getting there.

    For acquisition, yeh i agree, minelayer would actually be nice, especially on the center one, since it doesnt care if im a specialist or not. But again im not playing them for surprise here, im playing them for the fact that going second, the only way the opponent can stop them from getting to the antennae is sensor, which i dont anticipate as a problem.
     
  8. Saitan247

    Saitan247 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah I understand that more orders mean more possibilities for an army. I really liked your "Best List" thread, this really influenced my list building. Moreover I really started to include more CC (Makauls rule :)).

    Looking forward for you Batrep...
     
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  9. Alkasyn

    Alkasyn Well-Known Member

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    That whole game plan is a mistake, imo.

    You have 7 orders plus 1 order per Clipsos. This won't allow you to safely grab a box and retreat into safe distance with each Clipsos.
    The sequence of taking the Obj with a single Clipsos requires at least 3 orders per Clipsos, imo:

    1. Either break LOF with Smoke or Kill ARO pieces (with something else that the Clipsos unless you want to risk your Specialist)
    2a. Decloak and roll for the box
    2b. Possibly roll for the box again
    3. Run towards safety
    4. Possibly run towards safety again.

    You've just used a minimum of 3 and an optimum of 4 orders for 1 objective. You won't be able to grab another box, remembering that you have to fail somewhere along the way because of the random nature of the game. And if you go grab boxes and leave the Clipsos undefended - you just made it easier for the enemy to get the boxes from you (no Specialist roll required).

    Meaning you won't be able to get all the boxes anyway, meaning you'd be able to just use 2 camo markers on one box and either make it unclaimed or use Orders later to claim it if you'd be winning hard.

    Anyhow, I don't really care how you play, but I'd never take 3 FO Clipsos :)
     
  10. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    the sequence im going for is
    1-2 orders: use snipers to flush out aro pieces
    X: each clipsos tries to grab a box with thier own order
    3: i assume at least one has failed, coordinated order move all three plus a taqeul, try to grab box with the one that failed
    4-6: spend three command tokens doing coordinated orders moving the clipsos away from the boxes and the taqeul forward
    7: last command (extra from taqeul) for coordinated to put the clipsos that are left alove and the taqeul into suppressive fire

    Granted, this relies on the opponent not using a command token to stop extra coordinated orders the first turn. The plan in that case is to try to kill as much as possible with snipers, and just move the taqeul forward to defend the boxes, and to spend all the coordinated orders the second turn.
     
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  11. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    Also, just to be clear, im not trying to be argumentative, my goal is to present my thinking so that others can understand the reasoning behind the strategy here. I think you are bringing up good valid points.
     
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  12. Ben Kenobi

    Ben Kenobi Well-Known Member

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    What I learned on the hard way is, that, if you don't field at least two Triads, even in LI, you give away much of the potential of the Tohaa.
    In Supplies, three Cplisos are overkill, cause you will never have the orders to bring them back, even with 15 orders.
    You are lacking attack pieces too to get boxes back if your opponent has the first turn and gets 2-3 of them.
     
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  13. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    This is limited insertion, remember. The opponent isnt going to have the orders to get all 2-3 boxes and pull them back unless they are doing either this list or a variant of it, and i'm not really a fan of trying to plan for mirror matches. I mean if it looks like they have a mirror list, i can just spend one of my 5 command tokens to stop them from coordinating to get away. Whereas if i go first i can command token to coordinate 5 times, this part of the plan i know works, because it worked in the game i played last weekend where i won 7-0.

    If the opponent somehow gets 2 though, and manages to pull them back, yeh i could see that as a real prollem. That would require them having enough orders to get past the snipers, get the boxes, and then pull back to a safe distance, which i see as a real longshot.

    As far as the 2-3 triads thing, normally i would agree, except for the case in supplies. This list is just so much more order efficient for getting the boxes and pulling back that it overcomes the normal advantage that fireteams have. I mean yeh this list isnt using any of the normal advantages of tohaa, but i think LI puts a real damper on their advantages anyway
     
  14. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    Ok batrep time! I'm gonna split this into multiple posts to make it easier for me to post. Long story short, the theory seems to be sound, especially for supplies.
    Scores for the day were:
    Acquisition 9-1
    Firefight 6-0
    Supplies 9-1
     
    #14 borings, Jan 28, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
  15. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    For round 1, acquisition, my opponent was playing shock army. Based on what i saw, im pretty sure this was his list:

    [​IMG] Shock Army of Acontecimento - Untitled Roster (300/300 | 5/6)

    Group #1 | 10 Models | [​IMG] 10 [​IMG] 0 [​IMG] 1

    [​IMG] Bagh-Mari Paramedic | MediKit, Combi Rifle, Light Shotgun, Pistol / Knife (24)
    [​IMG] Bagh-Mari Paramedic | MediKit, Combi Rifle, Light Shotgun, Pistol / Knife (24)
    [​IMG] Bagh-Mari MULTI Sniper Rifle | Minelayer, MULTI Sniper Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines, Pistol / Knife (28)
    [​IMG] Bagh-Mari Combi | Combi Rifle, Light Shotgun, Pistol / Knife (22)
    [​IMG] Bagh-Mari HMG | HMG, Pistol / Knife (26)
    [​IMG] Rao Lieutenant | Lieutenant, Combi Rifle, Assault Pistol / Knife (23)
    [​IMG] Knight of Montesa MULTI Rifle | MULTI Rifle, Chain-Colt, Pistol / DA CCW (42)
    [​IMG] Naga Observer | Forward Observer, Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines, Pistol / Knife (28)
    [​IMG] Singh Combi | Combi Rifle, Assault Pistol / E/M CCW (35)
    [​IMG] Teucer Feuerbach MSV 2 | Multispectral Visor L2, Feuerbach, Nanopulser, Pistol / Knife (48)

    First up, draw classifieds, and my choice is follow-up or capture. I figure with all the viral I'm bringing, follow up is the one to go for.

    He wins the wip check, chooses deployment. Prolly not the right choice for acquisition, but i have a well earned reputation that if i go first i almost always win, so it is what it is. I take deployment, and take a side with longer firelanes to take advantage of my snipers. A quick aside: i am the one who set up most of the tables we played on today, i tried to not build things with specific advantages for my lists in mind, but maybe on some subconcious level i couldnt help myself. I told my opponents this, and said i was recusing myself from choosing tables for that reason, and i made it clear which tables i made. My opponent chose an interior map, one with halls and doorways that we keep open to not give warbands too much of an advantage. One of my sappers was able to see 2 of the 3 paths that had to be crossed to get to the mid of the board, but only through tight corridors that could be easily crossed with cautious nove. My opponent complained about it, and i pointed out that if i didnt have sapper, there was no way to have lof on those corridors and be in cover, and i pointed out that it is very difficult to build a balanced map trying to account for sapper. Anyways, i figured i should be clear on that at the get go.

    He deploys first, with the baghmari in a link very far forward on thleft side of the map behind a wall. Tuecer is behind some boxes with lof to one of my snipers, stephen is in the middle with a clear path to the center objective, and he has the xenotech attached. The montessa is on the right side starting out behind a wall. His hvt is placed near the center of the board, behind a crate that is very hard to get to. I deploy my nikouls in good spots with coverage, the kaeltars hiding in the back, and the taqeuls as far forward as possible but still in cover. The taqeul on the left is actually prone on top of a shipping crate, with one bug on too and the other behind the crate. The taqeul on the right is my Lt., and is also the xenotech (prone as well). I place my hvt on the far right side as well. All three clipos are deployed .1" behind the three objectives, with one on each, all hidden deployed. His reserve troop is the naga, which he places as a camo marker near his hvt. Mine is armand, and i place him almost at the middle, on top of some crates prone where he can see the whole baghmari group. My opponent groans at that, and accedes it was a strong move.

    After deployment, i announce my datatracker is the taqeul that is also with the xenotech, he announces his is stephen.

    We get started, i see no reason to deny him spending a buncha command tokens so i keep my 5. First thing, the montessa does an impetuous move forward. The closest troop is the taqeul on the right, and he rounds a corner to get closer. Both nikouls actually have LoF to the corner he rounds, and he fails his dodge against their shots, and ends up dying to viral. He spends a couple orders moving the xenotech up and dropping the xenojawn. He then spends 5 orders moving stephen up to a position where he can shoot armand in the back, which involves jumping up the crate pile armand is on. I fail 4 change facing rolls in a row, and he is able to take armand out, freeing up his 5man. The hmg guy tries to take out the sniper on the left, but only removes his symbiomate and ends up getting knocked out by a symbiobug. He has to spend a command token to reform the fireteam, and tries doing a sniper vs sniper battle which goes nowhere. His last order is putting stephen into suppressive fire, prone up on the crates in the middle.

    I start my turn with 6 orders, plus Lt. First i spend my lt. Order moving the taqeul forward, and try to drop the xenotech jawn and failing. I move again (order 1), this time right in front of tuecer. The symbiobugs are also moving here, and gambles that i get close enough so he tries to nanopulsar, but the taqeul is like a half inch out of range. One of the bugs dies, but tuecer gets merced by the 2 viral shots that get through. I spend an order moving the taqeul up (#2), and then with another (#3) i am able to get into a position the see stephens back arc, and he dies to viral as well. I want to have lof to the hvt for my classified (prolly greedy but whatever) so i run the symbiobug up around the corner to see if the camo reveals itself. He goes for it, and somehow whiffs the shot (this was the same order that i shot stephen in the back). I then have the taq go up and kill that guy (#4), and then spend an order (#5) looking at the hvt for my objective. I spend one more order (#6) on this guy, doing the xenotech objective (which i fail again) and tucking back behind where the naga was hiding.

    He starts his second turn in LoL. Singh drops in, around the corner from the taqeul where no one can see him. He converts three orders to regulars, and is able to get the taqeul to unconscious. He spends his last order having a paramedic revive the hmg.

    My first Lt. died, so i pass it to the other taqeul with CoC. Down to 5 orders plus Lt.. Singh ducked back around the corner for some reason, so i go for regenerate on the taqeul (order #1). Roll a 12, which is higher than his Phy :(. But wait, i know that symbiont armor has a clause that says bearers of that equipment get +3 on the check for regen and medkit! He lives! My datatracker is so happy! I spend a coordinated order (#2) on him, my lt, and the two kaeltar in back, moving them around, having the lt stand up, and moving the taqeul up to the xenotech, and have the second part be to reinitiate the link. An order (#3) is spent on having him move toward the central objective and trying the xenotech jawn again (finally succeeding) and then another (#4) to get him and the xenotech into b2b with the central objective and putting the symbiobug in standby. An order (#5) is spent on my sniper, to shoot the hmg, but nothing happens. the lt order is spent on that as well, but he doesnt make it.

    He has 5 orders for his last turn. One is spent on a shootout between singh and my center taquel, which ends in singhs death. Next up a couple shotgun blasts to the face for my taqeul on the left, which end up with him prone trying to survive. He does a cautious move to the left antenna, and spends his last order activating it.

    Final turn, and time for my final form to be revealed! Same order pool as last turn. Clipsos on the right pops put, activates the antenna. Taqeul in the middle (order #1) has to step over to shoot at the paramedic next to the antenna and kills him. The clipsos in the middle cant really do much, but he shows up anyways. There is a mine next to the left antenna, which is covering where my clipsos will show up on that side. I have my lt stand up with his order and try to deal with this shotgun guy in his face, to no avail. i spend another order (#2) coordinated this time including the left taq, the sniper, and the center clipsos, all shooting at this guy, but he lives somehow and continues standing there. Order #3 is the center taq getting back onto the center objective. Order #4 is my lt jumping down from his perch to set off the mine that is in the way, just accepting that the hmg guy is going nowhere at this point. The last clipsos shows up, and tries to activate the antenna and fails. My opponent missies his aro as well tho. I decide not to spend my last order, as the only advantage i can get would allow my opponent another opportunity to kill my guy, which i dont think of as worthwhile.

    End score: 9-1 (2 for controlled antenna, 1 for activated antenna, 3 for controlling the tech coffin, 2 for controlling with datatracker, 1 classified)

    Mistakes my opponent felt they made: he felt the naga should've put down a mine instead of shooting the symbiobug, it prolly would've been a better play. Stephen could've been positioned better, which would've been big. He prolly should've cancelled the knight's impetuous order.

    Mistakes i made: armand should've been positioned better. It worked out in my favor because in order to get to his blind spot my opponent had to spend a lot of orders, and the guy that got there got killed for the same reason, but it was still bad positioning (his front arc was pointed like 5 degrees to far to the right, so stephen was able to jump up next to him on the crate and be just barely in his back arc). I couldve soent some more coordinated orders bringing the kaeltars to bear, but it was fine where they were.

    Overall the list performed beautifully. Im glad regen worked on the taqeul.
     
  16. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    Round 2, military orders:

    [​IMG] Military Orders - Untitled Roster (300/300 | 4.5/6)

    Group #1 | 10 Models | [​IMG] 9 [​IMG] 1 [​IMG] 0

    [​IMG] Joan of Arc DA CCW Lieutenant | Lieutenant, MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser, Pistol / DA CCW (50)
    [​IMG] Santiago Killer Hacker | Killer Hacking Device, TinBot A (Deflector L1), Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges, Pistol / DA CCW (37)
    [​IMG] Santiago Spitfire Specialist | Specialist Operative, Spitfire, Nanopulser, E/M Grenades, D-Charges, Pistol / DA CCW (43)
    [​IMG] Knight Hospitaller HMG | HMG, Pistol / DA CCW (39)
    [​IMG] Knight Hospitaller Combi Doctor | Doctor, MediKit, Combi Rifle, Pistol / DA CCW (35)
    [​IMG] Konstantinos Infiltration | Infiltration, Combi Rifle, D-Charges, Assault Pistol / CCW (34)
    [​IMG] Order Sergeant MULTI Sniper Rifle | MULTI Sniper Rifle, Pistol / Knife (21)
    [​IMG] Order Sergeant Combi | Combi Rifle, Pistol / Knife (13)
    [​IMG] Mulebot EVO | EVO Hacking Device, Electric Pulse (25)
    [​IMG] Warcor Aerocam | Aerocam, Flash Pulse, Stun Pistol / Knife (3)


    We played on a shantytown map, there we goood firelanes from rooftops, with some pretty hefty large lof blockers in the middle. I won the check and took initiative.

    I deployed first. Neema was on a rooftop on the left, up above the gorgos, who was also on a rooftop. I had the fireteam with the sakiel in it on the left on the ground beneath them. The fireteam with two makauls was in the mid, and the kaeltar were both hiding in spots where they wouldnt do much aside from provide orders. One of the kaeltar i kept back, because it was one of them, the gorgos, or neema, and i wanted neema and the gorgos to have symbiomates so keeping them back wouldnt do. My opponent deployed his fireteam in the middle, the evo repeater behind a building on the left, and the order sgt with a combi on the left. Only the sniper had a good lof down the middle, and he was in the fireteam with the knights. His warcor was somewhat near the mid, a decent spot for coverage but where he wasnt in too much danger. His reserve ended up being konstantinos, who was also positioned watching the middle approach vector.

    On my turn i dropped a nullifier to protect neema and gorgos, and then walked up towards the mid. They spent their datatracker and Lt. orders moving up closer and getting into cover. I spent a quick order to take out the sniper with my mid fireteam, but the rest was spent on advancing the left team. Once i was close enough, i spent a few orders putting down some smoke to cover the dead zone heater. I smashed the heater (more out of spite than anything) while moving the sakiel and sukeul up a ladder to a ledge that overlooked pretty much they whole are that his fireteam was in. I had the makaul walk out of smoke and cc konstantinos, and spent my last order putting the suk, sak, neema, and gorgos into supppressive fire (i realize now i couldnt have had the gorgos join in, because of the stupid chaksa, but it didnt come up and i didnt think of it cause i really never use the gorgos).

    He was able to kill the makaul on the first order, but i was fine with that as he had done his job. The rest of his turn was spent trying to dig out the sak and suk, with very little progress. He went for the sakiel first, and due to dumb luck it took him like 6 orders to take him down. I made 9 armor saves on him somehow, against an hmg. I got a double crit on one shot, so one of those orders was having the doctor stand the guy back up again. He then threw an em grenade at the unconscious guy, and was able to isolate the sukeul. We both totally blanked on isolated cancelling suppressive here, but i dont think it wouldve made much difference (the e/m was one of the last things done, and i couldve just gone back into suppressive on my turn with her order. I didnt use the mate, and i could've gone into suppressive safely by using it then)

    My turn two was spent moving the makaul/makaul/sukeul fireteam up the right flank and taking out the doctor that was there. Not much progress, but it was going well.

    His turn two was spent trying to dig out the sukeul and failing. Joan had a slight advantage overall, but she ended up getting hit twice during the proceedings, with no hits at all going to the sukeul (didnt even have to use mate).

    My turn three i had the sukeul move up more, taking out the spitfire santiago. I ended with the fireteam on a roof overlooking joan and the hmg knight, and ended up using the sukeuls mate when i whiffed while shooting the hmg knight and ended up getting hit 6 times by various guys standing around (she stepped out of smoke, so she was the only visible one, and i just missed all her shots). I had the gorgos rip off its skin so it could go prone, putting it in a place that he would be very hard pressed to reach.

    For his turn 3 he acknowledged he needed to kill the gorgos, and getting to it involved me getting free shots off with both sukeuls and makauls. He was able to kill one makaul, but the supressive sukeul just wouldnt get hit, so he couldnt advance. I think his route wouldve involved getting shot at with 8+ unopposed hmg hits, 2+ pistol shots, and then a single face to face against the gorgos in cover. So like, real long shot here. It didn't pan out.

    All my guys froze except the gorgos and neema, who were worth 126 points. His guys froze except joan, the hacker santiago and the hmg hospitaller, who also added up to 126 points. My list was only 297 to begin with however, to his 300, so i ended up with 3 points for kills and 3 points for controlling the exclusion zone. Both classified i drew weren't possible with the list, but i was fine with that.

    Overall the game was really close. If i hadnt been able to get the spitfire guy, it wouldve been a tie, and if he had been able to get through the sak and suk in the middle faster it wouldve been very different. That was a rough 5man for me, as my preferred tactic of cc is not so great against knights. Going first was also crucial, as it allowed me to get into a very favorable position.

    I say the mind blank (on both of us; i asked him at the time and he said isolated didnt cancel suppressive) on the e/m wasnt a big deal, but i think the psychological difference of the mate being there vs. not might have made him play differently, so mebbe things would've gone different. I never play stuff that gives isolated, and i usually dont play units that are in a lot of danger of isolated, in my defense of the blank.

    I prolly shouldve had the mate that was on neema on the sakiel, which is counterintuitive but prolly right. Dropping the nullifier at the beginning ended up being a waste, but it wouldnt have made a difference with the moves i ended up doing. Like i couldve not dropped it and it wouldnt have changed how far i got. And mebbe he couldve been playing some holoprojector guys and secret hackers, i dunno, better safe than sorry.
     
    #16 borings, Jan 28, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
  17. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    Round 3, Combined Army

    [​IMG] Combined Army - Untitled Roster (299/300 | 2.5/6)

    Group #1 | 10 Models | [​IMG] 10 [​IMG] 0 [​IMG] 1

    [​IMG] Anathematic Hacker | EI Hacking Device, Nanopulser, Plasma Rifle, Pistol / Shock CCW (88)
    [​IMG] Skiávoro Sepsitor Lieutenant | Lieutenant, Nanopulser, Sepsitor Plus, Plasma Rifle, Pistol / CCW (64)
    [​IMG] Speculo Killer Boarding Shotgun | Smoke Grenades, Boarding Shotgun, Pistol / Monofilament CCW, Knife (34)
    [​IMG] Dāturazi Chain Rifle | Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades, Grenades, Pistol / AP CCW (14)
    [​IMG] Ikadron Baggage | Baggage, Repeater, Light Flamethrower (2), Flash Pulse, Pistol / Electric Pulse (9)
    [​IMG] Ikadron Baggage | Baggage, Repeater, Light Flamethrower (2), Flash Pulse, Pistol / Electric Pulse (9)
    [​IMG] Ko Dali Combi | Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, D-Charges, Assault Pistol (2) / Knife (38)
    [​IMG] Rasyat E/Mitter | Eclipse Grenades, E/Mitter, Combi Rifle, Pistol, D-Charges / DA CCW (31)
    [​IMG] Ímetron AI Beacon | (4)
    [​IMG] R-Drone Repeater | Flash Pulse / Electric Pulse (8)


    Ugh i just spent an hour on this post and it logged me out and deleted it :(

    The short version is this is the same person i played against last week. I went first, and he was never in a position to safely take the supplies away from me, due to mines, symbiobugs, and snipers. Ill write a longer version if anyone asks me, but i feel so soulcrushed right now after losing the first draft
     
    #17 borings, Jan 28, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
  18. Saitan247

    Saitan247 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the the great Batreps... Congrats on your wins.
     
  19. borings

    borings Well-Known Member

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    hahahahah i went and wrote it again and forgot to save it, and i got logged out again. woof.
     
  20. Teslarod

    Teslarod when in doubt, Yeet

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    @borings make pressing Ctrl+A Ctrl+S every few minutes a habit. It'll save you a lot of time.
    Also depending on your Browser, at least Google Chrome saves drafts automatically for me every 30 seconds or so.
     
    borings likes this.
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