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Intuitive Attack in plain sight

Discussion in 'Rules' started by Wyrmnax, Mar 16, 2018.

  1. Wyrmnax

    Wyrmnax Well-Known Member

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    So.

    Have a Morlock. He is right in front of a Dakini.

    Is there anything that prevents me from doing a Intuitive Attack on him with the chain rifle so I get a ftf instead of a normal roll in return?
     
  2. macfergusson

    macfergusson Van Zant is my spirit animal.

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    Are you attacking a marker or something blocked by Zero Viz?
     
  3. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    No. But use your pistol instead for this purpose.
     
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  4. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Those are not requirements, but effects. Also, "Allows" doesn't mean "you can only do this if", but that you have the option to do something that you normally wouldn't (so, increases options).
    "May also" means, too, an increase in possibilities.

    Without a FAQ to correct it, yes you can Intuitive Attack to perfectly vissible troops, to force a FtF and to hope for a crit.
     
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  5. macfergusson

    macfergusson Van Zant is my spirit animal.

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    Lemme just shortcut this circle again...


    upload_2018-3-16_9-59-5.png
     
  6. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    I guess technically you can declare it at any time, it'd just have no effect if there are no valid targets (Camo/model in smoke)
     
  7. tdc

    tdc ALEPH Fragment
    Warcor

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    English is a funny language. "Allows" is used as a single permissive in this case. And so yes, it does mean "you can only do this if"


    No, you can't (well you can, but it would be against the rules)
     
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  8. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    However, in the spanish wording uses "Permite", meaning "allows", but without any kind of limitation.

    I don't see the relevancy of this, frankly. Who is that guy?
     
  9. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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  10. tdc

    tdc ALEPH Fragment
    Warcor

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    he's the guy that handles the wiki for CB and one of the game testors.

    if you look at the credits in the rule book you'll see his name there.

    so pretty much the best (certainly most active) source of CB intention when it comes to rules
     
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  11. daboarder

    daboarder Force One Commander
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    Hes the guy that helped CB write the rules and was the english translator.

    He knows his stuff and CBs intent
     
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  12. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Permissive ruleset, man. Anything that isn't explicitly permitted is forbidden. Otherwise any game turns into calvinball.

    Granted, there may be some wiggling room here if you absolutely must argue that way, I suppose vOv
     
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  13. Wyrmnax

    Wyrmnax Well-Known Member

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    I think this is the whole problem. If that was sitting on requirements - can only declare intuitive attacks against a marker then it would be obvious that my example wouldn't fly.

    But as it is a effect, I can techinically read it like "I can do it at any time (not a requirement to have a marker as a target), AND I can use it to target a marker specifically."
     
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  14. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Yeah, the system is very loose and uses the boxes as it wants without regards to any kind of logic -.-
     
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  15. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    You can declare it sure, but as there is no effect on visible non-markers the trooper will just stand there looking gormless.
     
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  16. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    Why though? The following text doesn't specify anything about target, just calling it "target". Am I missing something?

    On a side note, one of the bullets instructs us to inflict a wound upon critical Intuitive Attack. What happens when you use Ammo that should behave differently in that situation? I think we are supposed to apply that Ammo's effect instead, but I can't see this being in RAW. It looks like if I declare Intuitive Attack with a Jammer, I will have to score a wound upon critical hit, with or even without applying any of normal Jammer effects...

    This forum really needs IJW's favorite dissapointed smilie from the previous one...
     
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  17. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    Not a Jammer (I think that one cannot do Intuitive Attacks, it just doesn't require LoF), but the E/Mitter.
     
  18. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    I think you've meant E/Marat, but actually Jammer can do Intuitive Attacks.
    But on the other hand, Jammer doesn't actually have Ammo type, instead it has "State: Isolated" trait and rules describing it inflicting that state.

    I still don't see RAW that would prevent me from taking said Jammer and hit on 15 against TO Camo markers with it, actually dealing wounds on a critical. Either I'm blind or this is quite ridiculous.
     
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  19. xagroth

    xagroth Mournful Echo

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    considering they go in a 5pts troop, second option is it ;)
     
  20. Spleen

    Spleen Well-Known Member

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    Because the text is specific about what it allows. Try replacing the marker state wording with some other condition like ZOC:

    "Allows the user to make one single BS Attack against an enemy inside his Zone of Control"

    Can I declare this theoretical ability and use it to target things that aren't in my Zone of Control?

    The same applies to Intuitive Attack, it allows you to make a BS attack against camo states or when LOF is blocked by a zero visibility zone, if you are targeting anything else you aren't obeying the effects rules of the skill.
     
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