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I am pretty bummed about the change in the Corregidor background

Discussion in 'Nomads' started by prophet of doom, Oct 13, 2020.

  1. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    I think some of the most poisonous things in my culture is the idea that governing is on a single scale of capitalist/commie, and that somewhere there is a perfect ideology that if implimented will fix things forever. Althou a lot of Europe has that issue as well.
    I've found that everyone who has a paradise-on-Earth ideology is always one population cleansing away from achieving it.
     
  2. Daireann

    Daireann Well-Known Member

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    For me Corregidor always were cruel place.
    People are cold and pragmatic. “You can’t work? Too bad...” - and you are thrown into space!
    Alguaciles always were like militia. This ship like little republic this it’s own dictator and talks about freedom. Like PanO with it’s talks about economy and freedom, Like Yu Jing with their stuff, like Combine... etc
    And as I mentioned long ago, there are no “good guys” among factions)

    Ok, but we also should mention, that some piece of romantic flavor has each of them.
     
    #122 Daireann, Oct 19, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  3. Lampyridae

    Lampyridae Well-Known Member

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    Good to see you again!

    I also suspect that the Mobile Brigada are Spanglish for Mobile Infantry (they're not called that in the Spanish novela though).
     
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  4. Cervantes3773

    Cervantes3773 Rogue AI
    Warcor

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    The smell of biltong called to me. ;) Hope you're well.

    I think "Mobile Brigada" has historical roots in Europe/Eastern Europe (Ukraine?) but having trouble quickly finding it today.
     
    #124 Cervantes3773, Oct 19, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  5. Daireann

    Daireann Well-Known Member

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    It reminds me about movie “Brigada” (2002)
    Drama about 1898-2000 years and criminal.
    Common guys solve the problems in post-soviet world. Right after ussr fell.
    It was really painful for economy, lots of people didn’t know what to do.
    Heroes act rough, they are terrible persons sometime. But for most of people irl in 00s they become heroes.
    May be cause they survived, they were strong and from common people.
    I hate that movie actually and all that criminal romantic)

    I know, they have no connection with our Mobile Brigada, but you could see, why I have some associations.)
    MB are brute force of justice for nomads after all.
     
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  6. Kiwi Steve

    Kiwi Steve Well-Known Member

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    I think it can be best summed up by a meme I read years ago. "Harry Potter is so unrealistic. I mean a red head with two friends... Cmon."

    As the rejects of society I just assumed an above average number of number of red heads.
     
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  7. prophet of doom

    prophet of doom Well-Known Member

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    I agree that there are differing definitions of socialism and that France has a stronger influence of socialist ideas in their political system due to the strong influence of the French Socialist party. The French union are also good at organising some good strikes, they deserve some praise for that.

    I think neither of us is wrong.

    The definition of socialism I use is a more radical one, that of communist and anarchist writers. I think a socialist society would not allow liberal corporate management to run anything as people have liberated themselves from capitalism. For such writers, France would be the example of half arsed reformists who succeeded to get some concessions from capitalist overlords, missing the chance to get rid.of them. You will note that in your list other countries have partial ownership of companies as well. The USA has this as well and also steers its economy to some degree. You wouldnt call those countries socialist as well, would you? I don t. France may have egalite and fraternite in their motto, but it is still a class society with huge economic divide.

    Which points again to Corregidor. You can t really declare a society to be socialist or anarchist if it relies on working for capitalists and turns to criminal bankers for loans.

    At best, Corregidor is an egalitarian society of unionists who grudgingly accept the fact that they live in a capitalist world and try to sell their labour for the highest price they can, militarily enforcing worker's rights.

    And that again, is a cool concept I d hate to see ruined. I am sure a lot of people take some escapist, catharthic joy out of representing the workers on the tabletop, shooting at capitalists, cops, religious fanatics and pseudo-communist stateimperialists. And the occasional alien invader.
     
    #127 prophet of doom, Oct 20, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2020
  8. prophet of doom

    prophet of doom Well-Known Member

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    Brigada obviously means nothing more than brigade. I think the eastern european gangster theme is reserved to Tunguska.

    I had the association with the international brigades who fought against Franco in the Spanish civil war. The term was also thrown around amongst Europeans romanticising Latin American leftist movements.
    I wouldn t read too much into that unit's name.
     
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  9. Sergei Simonov

    Sergei Simonov Well-Known Member

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    I am guessing you are American...

    Most factions in the game do a good job at representing the real world shades of grey in implementing ideologies. No society can be pure 'ism' because that ism is always filtered through the self interested human ape-beast. Most western nations do a semi functional job of blending elements of liberal, socialist and vaguely fascistic policies together to form functional states as the needs of the day demand because real statesmen understand what ideologues and religious zealots do not-- the isms are tools, not goals, and taking a specific policy will implement those goals, much like China implemented special economic zones to reap the profits of capitalist economies while maintaining the central planning and social control of communist dictatorships. It's the same way people can argue whether or not France is socialist, social democracy or capitalist.

    Most infinity factions come off as 'post-ism' in that they are blending elements to meet functional goals but keeping enough visible rags of their foundational philosophy to claim they are the ism that the people believe in.

    The biggest reason I like CJC-- they never try to present themselves as an ideal society or any pure 'ism.' They are adopting whatever they need to survive. Maybe 'dictatorship' is the wrong word here, but brutal pragmatists fit the bill. 'Stop writing revolutionary pamphlets and daydreaming about a class purge Carlos and weld that damned bulkhead or get a free airlock ride!' He who does not work does not breathe.

    If putting the boot in the face of some striking workers is needed to maintaining CJCs reputation and demand for their workers they do it. If there's no realistic way to maintain private property on a post prison ship, they wont. But arguing that a 24th century space crate can fit a failed 19th century industrial age ideology is kind of silly.
     
  10. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    I am, but I doubt there is a single western culture that doesn't have the issue of trying to cram beliefs in to the character limit of a social media profile.
     
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  11. Lampyridae

    Lampyridae Well-Known Member

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    Case in point: happening right now with YJ's ancestor.
     
  12. Lampyridae

    Lampyridae Well-Known Member

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    >snip<

    Never mind.
     
    #132 Lampyridae, Oct 20, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2020
  13. Daireann

    Daireann Well-Known Member

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    After some time I have a question.

    What happen with old persons on Nomad ships? Especially on Corregidor.
    I am not sure about “throw-in-space”... I guess, they have some kind of job for them.
    Why person could be left in space?

    By the way... Pamphlet were written on Bakunin already. I am not sure, other ships agreed with it completely)
     
    #133 Daireann, Oct 20, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2020
  14. Willen

    Willen Well-Known Member

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    It would be good to see if the RPG says something about it, but if not I am guessing taking care of the children and babies. All work-able population needs to work, that includes roles typically caring for children, so I am assuming the few that reach old age and cannot contribute in other ways are teachers, caretakers for the young and sick.

    Not everybody is a ruthless space mercenary in reality, you need a big support network for your society so that we have Brigadas, Hellcats and Tomcats.

    I also want to say I have been following the macro-political discussion in this thread and guys/gals, congrats. Amazing, polite and civil (dis)agreements. Exactly what I would expect from fellow Corregidorians. Leave the heat for the foes of Corregidor.
     
  15. Daireann

    Daireann Well-Known Member

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    Good point. I remembered video that I watched some time ago about grandparents and how humanity got them.

    By the way...
    ...I am just peaceful artichoke here. Just interesting faction and weird enough discussion to be involved)
     
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  16. Icchan

    Icchan Well-Known Member

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    I believe Corregidor are futuristic space communists: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popular_Front_(Spain)
    I'm basing my entire theory on the fact that the logo looks very similar, only upside down. (Well, at least the Nomad logo of which the rest are derived from, in the beginning of Infinity sectorials weren't a thing).
    Oh and there's also the International Brigade that used the same three pronged star, whose members were formed from many volunteers from a lot of different nations. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Brigades
     
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  17. kesharq

    kesharq Lucky Dice-Roller

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    In the Nomad RPG Book the Black Hand is described as a sort of many direct action affiliation groups. Equipped and supported, but not controlled, by the Nomad military and Nomad government. General Sarmiento is quoted that even he does not understand how the Black Hand is able to work.

    Affiliation groups and direct action are typical for early anarchist groups in the 1870-1920.
     
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  18. prophet of doom

    prophet of doom Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for digging that up! Yes, the symbols of the Nomads are certainly leftist. I bought the Riot Grrls just because of their name and their logo. I don't even like the models that much. I wish they would look like punks.



    Direct Action is still alive and kicking today, but was especially popular in the 1960 and 70s with urban guerrilla groups in Europe and Japan.

    The iconography of Nomads certainly points to anarchist, socialist, anti-fascist movements.

    Unfortunately, the often inconsistent background does not reflect such ideologies very well. When I first read about the spaceship called Bakunin I thought that would be super-cool and filled with anarchists. And when I read this fluff I was immediately disappointed. There are these individualistic communes in their isolated modules and the whole ship is described more as a laisser faire artist space. I didn't want to collect Bakunin because it had Christians and Furries. Cool models, and that's why I eventually bought them. But I had to paint my Reverends in anarcha-feminist purple and black to forget about the fact that they are representing Christians. The whole thing started because I couldn't resist the Riot Grrls. Nomads should have more units like them.

    I had this idea that the three Nomad ships represent three different ideas about anarchy: Laisser Faire and artistry, anarcho-syndicalism and anarcho-capitalism.

    I never touched Tunguska because anarcho-capitalism is obviously a contradiction in itself and mobsters and bankers are despicable. I had my suspicions as to why the other two ships cooperated with Tunguska, and I finally come to the conclusion that there is not as much anarchism in Nomads than I wanted to admit. For me, the background is a bit of a failure. It uses leftist symbols and imagery, but the Nomads stay capitalists. Or something in between. But certainly not as cool as I imagined them to be.
     
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