1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Holoprojector and Bashi Bazouk

Discussion in 'Rules' started by McPopson, Dec 7, 2021.

  1. McPopson

    McPopson New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    8
    Likes Received:
    2
    Hi

    I was re-reading rules on Holoprojector in context of Bashi Bazouk and there are two things that are a little unclear to me:

    1) Lets say I deploy Bashi as 3 Ghulam snipers, using both Holoecho and Holoprojector. The Wiki states that:
    "If the player is using Models instead of Holoecho Markers, then the first time he activates the Trooper in his Active Turn, the player must place a Holoecho Marker next to one of the three Models, but it does not have to be the Model of the real Holoprojector bearer. In this way, the adversary can know he is facing a Holoprojector Trooper in order to be able to delay his AROs."
    So this means I have to place Holoecho Marker ONLY when I activate this Bashim not sooner. So he can pose as 3 Ghulam sniper for a whole game. Am I reading this correct? I'm asking, since the Example text box states something different. I assume the rules are correct and the example is wrong?

    2) Bashi deploys using Parachutist. Can he deploy in the Holoecho state? Holoecho state is cancelled by any Entire Order skill that isn't Cautious Movement. And Parachutist is an Entire Order skill. But on the other hand, Holoecho state is activated automaticaly on deployment, and he is deployed at the end of the order. So first I declare using Parachutist skill, which should cancel Holoecho. But since Bashi is not yet even deployed, he is not in Holoecho state. Then as a result of the order I deploy him on the table. And now since I have deployed him, he can automaticaly enter Holoecho state, as per rules?
     
  2. Bobman

    Bobman MERC
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2017
    Messages:
    751
    Likes Received:
    554
    Holo projector says the trooper can be in the state when placed on the table. So should be fine for parachutist deployment, especially since you've already spent the order when placing on the table.
     
  3. Erland Hâkon

    Erland Hâkon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2020
    Messages:
    430
    Likes Received:
    433
    The first thing is that you cannot use the holomask and holoprojector simultaneously, both have the NFB Label and as the Rulebook indicates on page 81:

    IMPORTANT
    Negative Feedback (NFB). The use of a Special Skill, Equipment, Hacking Program, etc., with the NFB Label is incompatible with any other Special Skill, Equipment, Hacking Program, etc., with the same Label or Trait.
     
  4. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2017
    Messages:
    4,219
    Likes Received:
    8,414
    Holomask state and Holoecho state are combinable, it is an exception to the NFB rule stated in the Holoecho state.
     
    chromedog likes this.
  5. Erland Hâkon

    Erland Hâkon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2020
    Messages:
    430
    Likes Received:
    433
    It's true, I forgot about that exception (it shows that I don't use much troops with both pieces of equipment, the ones I use have one or the other ... so I assumed they couldn't be used together and I didn´t look if there were exceptions :sweat:).
     
    #5 Erland Hâkon, Dec 7, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2021
  6. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2017
    Messages:
    4,219
    Likes Received:
    8,414
    No worries, we all miss sometimes a part of some rule, especially if it is not a frequent rule.
     
  7. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2019
    Messages:
    1,834
    Likes Received:
    2,645
    I'm not finding an example that contradicts the rules text on this one. I see two examples but neither of them looks like the one you mean. Can you post the example you're referring to?

    In the interim, afaik yes, he can pose as 3 Ghulams all game. However, it's moot since your opponent will see through the deception at your first order count phase. It's really only a deception on turn one, and only if you go second (and only if your list has 13 or fewer units on the table).
     
  8. solkan

    solkan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2017
    Messages:
    1,292
    Likes Received:
    1,921
    If you mean this example,
    A Haqqislam player, who has the second Player Turn, decides to intimidate their rival by deploying three Ghulam Snipers on different rooftops, when in reality they only deploy one Hassassin Áyyär and his two holographic decoys in the form of Ghulam Sniper Models.

    The player does not need to place a Holoecho Token next to one of the Ghulam Sniper Models until the start of their Active Turn, indicating to their rival that they have a Trooper with Holoprojector.​
    on the bottom of this page https://infinitythewiki.com/Holoecho_State

    This is what the Holoprojector rule said in the HSN3 book (color added):
    If the player is using models instead of Holoecho Markers, then at the start of his Active Turn or if he activates the Ho- loecho state in his Active Turn, the player must place a Ho- loecho Marker next to one of the three models, but it is not compulsory that model be the real Holoprojector L2 bearer. By this way, his adversary can know he is facing a Holoprojector L2 trooper in order to be able to delay his AROs. The player can remove that Holoecho Marker at the end of his Active Turn.​

    That's pretty clearly another example of an example written for the other version of the rules.
     
    Robock and QueensGambit like this.
  9. McPopson

    McPopson New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2019
    Messages:
    8
    Likes Received:
    2
    Yes, thats the example I was refering to, thanks Solkan :) This is a subtle but nice change to Holoprojector. I think it might have its uses, will have to play a bit with them.

    Thank You all for clearing things out!
     
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation