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Help dealing with Impersonation markers

Discussion in 'Ariadna' started by Randomcallsign, Jan 24, 2019.

  1. Randomcallsign

    Randomcallsign Well-Known Member

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    Title says it all, I've played a few games back to back against Haqq lately and I've been getting wrecked by those dang Fidays and their impersonation.
    What are some strategies for dealing with these models? Especially when they come down as a final reserve model after everything else has been deployed.
    Without a wide network of sniffers (USARF might have one sometimes) or biometric visors my initial guess is to just throw a boatload of dice at them in hopes that I'll hit a few of the 6 or 7s I need to discover with our moderate WIP skills. But even then, I still have to punch through IMP-2 after that.

    Do you try to bait the Fiday out with a sacrificial model and then bring them down with ARO? surely a clever player wouldn't fall for that trap.
    Any help much be much appreciated.
     
  2. barakiel

    barakiel Echo Bravo Master Sergeant
    Warcor

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    Link Teams are a very good tool for denying and restricting where Impersonators can operate. There's two components involved there. The first is Sixth Sense Level 2. Downgrade it to Level 1, so that you can see your opponent's full Order declaration if they're within your Zone of Control. This means you never "waste" your AROs... You can either Discover at close range (remember +3 for being in a link, +3 for being within 8 inches) or else pull the trigger if the Impersonator reveals.

    Chances are good your opponent won't want to maneuver too much near Sixth Sense Level 1, which will tempt him into taking 1 v 1 engagements or shots that don't cause mass damage. This plays to your favor, since even a pistol-equipped Grunt in a 5-man link still has a very good chance of beating or stopping a shotgun blast in a 1 v 1 engagement vs an Impersonator. Shotgun or flamethrower-equipped linked USAr troops have even more tools for countering an Impersonator (remember to use Sixth Sense Level 1 so that your opponent fully declares his Order, so you can pick the ARO and weapon that's best for countering your opponent's intentions.)

    Ideally, your link will deploy in an area where they all have line of fire to one another, able to provide mutual support, but aren't lined up single-file for a mine or shotgun blast. Remember to keep your troops prone too, so that they can see over one another, and the Impersonator can't use their own silhouettes to block or restrict LoF to friendly AROs.

    Your unlinked troops should use your Core link as a protective zone. Definitely don't stack everyone close where they're vulnerable to shotgun blasts or mines, but instead use the Core link to babysit and challenge the Impersonator. Even taking 2-3 casualties isn't bad, if you end up taxing your opponent's entire Turn 1 Order Pool by making him work for those kills.

    Additionally, having something like a few Foxtrot FOs that can look backwards into your Deployment Zone is helpful too. Their Flash Pulses are very effective, and often they can watch the "dead zone" in front of your DZ where Impersonators tend to deploy and stage their attacks from. They can be a good tool for restricting Impersonator movement, stopping them from re-impersonating, etc.

    At the end of the day, Impersonators are usually operating with thin margins for success: 2 dice shotgun blasts, 1 hit forced from a mine, etc.

    Link Teams, Camo, etc. all challenge those thin margins and increase your odds of a favorable outcome. If you can encourage the 1 v 1 fight vs your linked trooper... Negate one shotgun blast with a defensive pistol shot... Then hope your ARM3 stops the remaining hit... You've done a very decent job of playing the odds. Even if you lose the trooper, this is much more preferable to letting that hostile shotgun swamp 3 or 4 of your troops, where you're forced to roll buckets of saves and you're giving your opponent huge returns on every order that he spends attacking you.
     
    #2 barakiel, Jan 24, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2019
  3. daszul

    daszul Well-Known Member

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    Maybe Camo-Minelayers and Mines will help too: Two camo-tokens that block the way/movement - either the Friday has to walk around it spending more orders for nothing (except granting AROs to detect it), or a 50/50 chance to engage a mine. And even if the fiday attacks the trooper the mine will go off, at least after your trooper got killed by the friday.
     
  4. Randomcallsign

    Randomcallsign Well-Known Member

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    I always forget two super vital link team rules.... SSL2/1 and the +3 bonus applies to more than just BS.....
    Thanks for the excellent advice.
     
    barakiel likes this.
  5. mightymuffin

    mightymuffin Well-Known Member

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    It's also worth deploying in layers, preferably with each model able to see at least one other layer; i.e. force your opponent to churn through the chaff first, (the stuff you don't care about dying), and waste orders.

    I'd say it'll be inevitable that they'll kill something, but the main trick is to stop them before they kill anything significant. (That doesn't necessarily mean a cheap/expensive model - just anyone that you can do without).


    (Guess all of that applies to any enemy model though, not just Impersonators!)
     
    BLOODGOD likes this.
  6. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

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    A few of useful things to know against Imp marker :
    - Discover + Discover is allowed. When you rolls on 7 or 10 (depending if you are in the 20" range or not), it's better to have 2 dice to roll
    - you can coordinate your discover to roll as many dice as possible
    - warcor aerocam have 360 visor and they are great to prevent fiday to shoot more than once
    - as said above : FT are great (so are chasseur)
     
    holycannoli likes this.
  7. Randomcallsign

    Randomcallsign Well-Known Member

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    So in the instance of a discover short followed by a second discover short can you still attempt the second discover even if you fail the first one because the entire order is considered to be simultaneous?
     
  8. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

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    You don't attemp one after the other : everything is simultaneous so you roll 2 dice to discover in the resolution phase of the order

    If at least one is a success your opponent is discovered
     
  9. daszul

    daszul Well-Known Member

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    But even with 2 successes you only discover the Imp1 state, right? The target drops to Imp2 and you still have to do another discover vs Imp2, because thats a different roll/discovery, right?
     
    Nemo No Name likes this.
  10. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

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    Yes

    The advantage of using discover/discover is only to raise your chance to get a success:
    One dice on 7 is 35 % chance success.
    Two dice on 7 is 57,75 % chance success.
     
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  11. RogueJello

    RogueJello Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, is this true? While you're correct it raises the chances of discover, if you fail either one of the rolls you may not attempt to discover again, correct? So if the trooper is in IMP-1, you'd put it into IMP-2, but be unable to Discover again, assuming one pass and one fail.
     
  12. TriggerPuller9000

    TriggerPuller9000 Poverty Orde Wingate

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    Against Fidays deploying in your DZ (or close to it):

    If you are deploying second, even if the Fiday or Speculo doesn't deploy backed against a wall, a Strelok minelayer as the reserve model can completely block him in.

    If he's deployed against a wall, a single model with Ambush Camo can block him in.


    Generally:

    The nice thing about Ariadna (and its sectorials) is that it's fairly easy to engineer situations where the Fiday's only targets are (1) units in Fireteams, with SSL2 that ignore Surprise Shot, (2) camo markers that he has to reveal to discover, (3) hard units like Vet Kazaks with native SSL2, or (4) cheap models with DTWs like Irmandinhos and Chain Rifle volunteers that will happily trade with a Fiday at close range.

    I'm not going to say it's a list thing, but generally when I play with Haqq against Ariadna, I have a terrible time finding a suitable target for assassination. Likewise, running Ariadna and TAK it's fairly easy to mitigate Fidays.
     
  13. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

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    I have seen both interpretation in the rule forum.

    The rules says "If an enemy fails his Discover Roll, that enemy cannot attempt to Discover the same impersonator until the next (Active or Reactive) Turn". Some people says "the same impersonnator" mean the same trooper, others says it mean the same marker (imp-1 and imp-2 marker being considered 2 different impersonnator)

    First theory seems to be winning but there never were an official answer.

    No matter the answer, I think discover + discover is the best solution. Rolling one dice on 7 is a very high chance of failure, resulting in you needing to bring another trooper to discover

    PS : coordinated order to discover is also a solution, as is ghost synchro with antipode or strelok/k9
     
  14. Spauracchio

    Spauracchio Member

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    Super interested in the answers to this topic since I'm new to Infinity and got the pleasure of dealing with a Fiday already!

    One clarification, if possible, on this: why (and how) downgrade SSL2 to SSL1? Numerical levels don't include automatically lower levels' bonuses, unless otherwise specifically stated?
     
  15. daszul

    daszul Well-Known Member

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    It's the other way round:

    Special Skill Levels
    Some Special Skills are divided into Levels of expertise with distinct effects and uses.

    Unless otherwise stated, any numerical Level of a Special Skill automatically grants all lower Levels of the same Skill. For example, a Level 3 also grants Levels 1 and 2.

    Conversely, alphabetical Levels such as Level X state whether they grant any other Levels of the Skill or not.
    (http://infinitythewiki.com/de/Special_Skills)
     
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  16. Arkhos94

    Arkhos94 Well-Known Member

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    I think Barakiel just mis-write what he means.

    You are right, SSL2 automaticaly includes SSL1 so you can use SSL 1 (which is likely what Barakiel meant by "downgrade) and retard ARO declaration if the enemy is in your ZoC
     
  17. Spauracchio

    Spauracchio Member

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    Sorry, I meant exactly this! I missplaced the "don't": should have been "don't numerical levels include automatically lower levels' bonuses, unless otherwise specifically stated?" :sweat_smile:

    @Arkhos94 thanks a lot for the clarification!
     
  18. holycannoli

    holycannoli Dancing to Kazak Kalinka

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    I have never before realized that discover is a move skill, and that discover + discover is a thing. I thank you, you're saving many Kazak lives.
     
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