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Hack the World!

Discussion in 'Nomads' started by jadelantern, Apr 3, 2019.

  1. jadelantern

    jadelantern New Member

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    Hey guys!

    I currently play yujing, I got into them because I thought their hacking was great and i live the hacking aspect of the game. To my surprise i was told Nomads are much better at hacking and I'm tired of the whole split faction thing right now.

    I am thinking of starting Nomads because I REALLY want to dive into that. I wanted to actually ask some questions before I bought anything. I wanted to know/have someone verify that Nomads are great at hacking. I would also like to know which hacker is our best hacker, beside that what else do nomads bring to the table? Also with a focus on hacking, what should be the first 5 things I should buy?

    Thanks guys!
     
  2. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    nomads are the kings of info war, between the massive repeater net we can build and access to cheap and reliable hackers, more access to HD+s than other factions, as well as models like the custodier, interventor and mary to back them up, it becomes incredibly difficult to out hack us.
     
  3. Maksimas

    Maksimas Maxi

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    I mean, trust me, Yu Jing hacking is pretty amazing all things considered, but Nomads blows that right out of the proverbial water.

    You got a dense repeater network, you got good hackers and you got good stuff to use those hackers for.
    7 Deployable Repeaters profiles, 12 profiles with in-built Repeaters ( One's even a TAG. ) and a lot more KHDs, AHDs, HDs and HD+s than I can bother to number.
    Even the sectorials themselves are great at hacking.

    So yeah, Nomads are indeed the premmier hackfaction.
     
  4. helsbecter

    helsbecter Ultrademocratic subSenator, #dominion Module

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    I think the Zero is the best assault hacker in the game, full stop.

    Not because he's particularly good at hacking but because he is so amazingly efficient. He's the epitome of "dude with an AHD": everything you need to be Cool Assault Hacker, and absolutely nothing you don't.

    Compare to like a Ninja or Guilang. They're about as skilled as a Zero, but they cost much more and have to repay that somehow.
     
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  5. jadelantern

    jadelantern New Member

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    Ok im sold!

    If I want to build a force where my main focus is hacking and causing havoc, what should I buy first? I would actually like to have a focus/idea of what I want to build towards and not just pick up random things. I think I saw some tutorials and army info above so ill check that out too.
     
  6. Ben Kenobi

    Ben Kenobi Well-Known Member

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    Interventor (box or blister)
    Zero (two in a blister)
    Mary Problems (you need a proxy cause the model isn't out yet)
    Tunguska Starter Box for Kriza Boracs, Securitate (repeater)
    Zoe and Pi-Well (Hacker, Engineer and a good FO Remote)
    Moran Maasai Hunter with Combi Rifle (the models are ugly as the night is dark, I proxy it with the Bountihunter) (Midfield controll and repeater)

    Non Hacking additions for every Nomad army:
    Intruder HMG + Jaguar (for Smoke Trick)
    Morlocks (good warbands)

    Hacker
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10
    MARY PROBLEMS Hacker (Forward Deployment L1) Submachine Gun + Zapper, Pitcher / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 30)
    INTERVENTOR Hacker Lieutenant (Hacking Device Plus) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 25)
    INTRUDER HMG, Grenades / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 42)
    JAGUAR Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 10)
    KRIZA BORAC HMG / Heavy Pistol, CC Weapon. (2 | 54)
    ZOE & PI-WELL . (0 | 47)
    [​IMG] ZOE (Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Stop!) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 28)
    [​IMG] PI-WELL Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 19)
    DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    ZERO (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 19)
    PUPPET MASTERS (Minelayer) Submachine Gun, Antipersonnel Mines / PistolKnife. (0.5 | 14)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]2 [​IMG]3 [​IMG]2
    TRANSDUCTOR ZOND Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    MORAN (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, CrazyKoalas (2) / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 22)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    WARCOR (360º Visor) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    5.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army


    But TBH, hacking isn't such a big thing against many factions. And it's verry hard to make it work.

    In general we had a discussion here
    Hacker Champ Faction?
     
  7. Gunmage

    Gunmage Well-Known Member

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    Except Corregidor. I mean, their hackers are WIP 14 at best, and both WIP14 hackers are common HD ones. And their only KHD is WIP 12. Sure, their repeater coverage is still great, but they have less options to use it for than any other Nomad factions.
     
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  8. Maksimas

    Maksimas Maxi

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    That's still a greater quality of hacking and repeater coverage than most other factions can muster on a reasonable expense.
     
  9. Vijel

    Vijel Member

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    Because this thread is all about hacking i want to chip in with my question:
    Is there a general hacking guide anywhere out there?
    I read somewhere that Redrum is the superior killer hacking program and you use it under all circumstances. Is this correct? Does this also apply if i have any of the UPGRADE hacking programs e.g. Lightning at my disposal?
    Are there guidelines which other hacking programs to use under which circumstances?
    Which hacking programs do i avoid?
    I know many answers on these questions are probably very situational but some guidelines would be nice. :)
     
  10. Ignovus

    Ignovus Agent of the Trinomial
    Warcor

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    Beyond that - mines. These are amazing for forcing poor choices, especially when you're backed up by a smart-missile bot or grenade tossing Krakot (anything that can spec fire, really). Drop mine around corner from something juicy - preferably a few things. Hack with Spotlight for the next order. They either eat the mine to reset, or you get an unopposed spotlight - one of the few times you'll actually have a decent chance of getting it to stick. Either way, expect to get an unhappy look from your opponent.

    Most other midfield hackers don't have mines, much less at bargain basement prices. Use all your tools.
     
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  11. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    The Hacking FAQ has some of it. It was going to have more but then I became extremely jaded with the state of hacking.

    Sword Programs:
    If in doubt, use Redrum.
    VS Dogged or NWI use Trinity in active, Redrum in Reactive
    Maestro is OP. Use it vs anything except NWI and Dogged.
    Skull Buster is worse vs everything except on Normal rolls or Interventors.

    Claw Programs:

    First rule, in Active have a plan. Don't just hack because you can. Active turn hacking is order intensive for little direct payoff it usually needs to be used as a set up for the thing you actually want to do.

    If in doubt Oblivion in ARO.

    If you don't have a Sword program then vs other hackers use Carbonite (for sweet +3 to hit).

    Otherwise Carbonite is mainly an active turn program: Carbonite a HI/TAG that's on Suppression and then shoot it in the face. It's built to get that 1/2 set up.

    Gotcha/Stop/Basilisk/Icebreaker allow you to IMM something in ARO and it stays IMM until the next turn (unless they Reset ofc). This is actually less useful than it seems in ARO, but can result in statues you can kill easily. In my active I tend to use Carbonite + EM to IMM-2 something rather than trying for Basilisk in the hope it keeps the target out of the next turn as well.

    Active turn Possession is often stupidly order intensive. I rarely do it, I more often threaten it to force a Reset to drop something out of Suppression. The principal issue with Possession is you're left with a TAG that your opponent will un-Possess with a command token (good players will keep one handy) that you can't shoot. That being said, I've seen Possession *with a plan* win games.


    Edge cases:
    If your opponent has spec fire / guided and they push a repeater bot within 8" of a juicy target Blackout/Oblivion rather than IMM.

    Shield-2/3 aren't attacks so don't get affected by Repeaters. Current thinking is they actually work more like Reset and so oppose multiple hacks simultaneously (it's not clear though). Their main use is vs Surprise Attacks since you need to be targetted by a hacking attack before you can declare them. An EVO should Breakwater vs a Surprise Hack and then subsequently Brainblast (HD+ is a little less clear cut).
     
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  12. Civilized Barbarian

    Civilized Barbarian Praxis' Lead R&D Janitor

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    To add to @Ben Kenobi's list:

    Reverend Custodier is a great midfield hacker and packs a pitcher.

    Tsyklons bring pitchers with X-visor on a platform you want to use supportware with anyway.

    Multi-Rifle Hollow Men carry a pitcher on an extremely tough and mobile unit. I brought one in vanilla vs Yu-Jing and was not dissappointed.

    If you want Morans and Tsyklons pick up a pair of Lunokhuds for the koalas and proxy the Moran with whatever you want. Lunokhuds are also great defenders in their own right.
     
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  13. neostrider

    neostrider Well-Known Member

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    My nomads always bring a hacking plan. Spotlight gets several objectives, and is safer than FO for targeting enemies. If it's gotta die I'd prefer target then shoot over shoot and shoot. A lot of ariadna will ignore your repeaters and leave themselves open to spotlight.

    Possession can be amazing. Even if your opponent cures it with 1 command token I've had plenty of games where the damage done by the TAG easily recouped my investment. Best use: any tag with a heavy flamethrower melting his own cheerleaders. End the turn next to an EM weapon and watch your opponent cry.

    Hacking doesn't directly win you any mission. It's a tool to circumvent other factions advantages. Msv giving you problems? Use this program that 180s the smoke trick (white noise). Nomads shy away for HI and prefer MI because they personally practice how vulnerable HI is to hacking.

    My 2 tips: build a hacking network. I prefer pitchers but Moran or REMs work as well. Then bring redundant hackers. 1 inventor is not as amazing vs 4 ARO or a coordinated order. Zeros stand out here because 1 sudden extra hacker in ARO can be a big psychological attack enemies collapse at.

    Ex. Everyone plays against a camo marker like it could be any problematic gun. They are almost relieved when it finally attacks. But that prone camo marker suddenly adds 1 more SWORD program in ARO vs their hacker and it's like you declared your action in another language. I've had opponents make huge mistakes because that mind freak just spun them so badly.
     
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  14. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    I've Superior Infiltrated a Bandit KHD inside 8" of an enemy EVO. His first order was to put Assisted Fire on his Dakini link. I declared Skullbuster. I then gently reminded him that yes, Null states do cancel Supportware.

    2/3rds of his first turn were spent digging out my KHD.

    I did not need to fight a MML2 Dakini Sniper on my turn.
     
  15. helsbecter

    helsbecter Ultrademocratic subSenator, #dominion Module

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    This is the most important lesson, hacking is either really slow (assault hacking) or super risky (killer hacking.) Don't make the center of your gameplan because it will fail.

    But! Hackers, especially camo hackers, can make situations so complicated that it's like the straw that breaks the camel's back. Nomads should apply pressure in as many different ways as possible to find success on the table.
     
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  16. Hachiman Taro

    Hachiman Taro Well-Known Member

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    Best use of active turn Possession is to climb TAG to highest building, plunge fire into its friends that thought they were safe, then jump to its certain death.

    Co-ordinated hacking (enabled by EVO) can be situationally strong. An example being co-ordinated Spotlight (with rerolls) -> Guided. Like a lot of active hacking tricks it requires a bit of setup so misapplied that might be better spent just shooting your opponent in the face tho.
     
    #16 Hachiman Taro, Apr 5, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2019
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  17. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    But most of the time when you're shooting them in the face they can shoot back, this way is a a lot safer.
     
  18. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Sure... Or you just take a Kriza.

    There's absolutely occasions where you really really should use hacking to allow a no-risk shot (the plethora of lone HI/REM MLs in Fireteams is a great example of when it can really pay off) but honestly my rule of thumb is 'if in doubt, just shoot it in the face'.

    Vs Suppression Fire Hacking is really solid though. You have 3 opportunities to break the Suppression Fire:
    1. They opt to Reset
    2. The Hack succeeds
    3. The Hack hits and they fail their Guts

    Spotlight is actually really effective at this even if the target isn't hackable. Particularly if you have a scary Spec Fire / Guided option. Chances are they Reset which then allows you to shoot them in the face on much better odds, and if you succeed and they don't guts then Spec Fire or just shooting them in the face is a viable follow up.

    Basically I think hacking rarely (classifieds and potentially Possession) delivers the result you want: it enables the result you want.

    So I, generally, think "I want to hack Alice so that I can do X with Bob". So it's generally a combo play across at least 2 orders. Whereas more direct actions culminate in a single order "Bob shoots Alice so that Alice dies".
     
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  19. neostrider

    neostrider Well-Known Member

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    It's orders vs risk. I play turn 1 trying to maximize my order pool, swc, and area control advantage. I find that turn 1 trying to clear my opponent's ARO pieces with B4 12s vs B2 12s is more accident prone than I like, especially with a SWC. 1 pitcher bs attack (was going to do this anyway), 1 spotlight, 1 B4 15s vs B2 12s feels better.

    This highlights why I like pitchers. Custode can pitcher your enemy's line on 9s, moderator link on 10s. Haris or link can try placing both repeaters with 1 order.
     
    #19 neostrider, Apr 5, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2019
  20. MindwormGames

    MindwormGames Well-Known Member

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    I’m sure it’s been said like 50 times, but Nomads excel at hacking, but not necessarily because they have the best individual hackers.

    What Nomads have is the easiest and cheapest access to hackers and repeaters. This means that Nomads can hack your ass off without even trying.

    Take a look at my typical list:

    Interventor LT (Hacking Device +)
    Mary Problems (AHD and KHD + Pitcher)
    Zero Killer Hacker
    Zero Assault Hacker
    Salyut EVO Hacker (Repeater)

    Clockmaker
    Tsyklon (Repeater + Pitcher)
    Tsyklon (Repeater + Pitcher)
    Transducer (Repeater)
    Transducer (Repeater)
    Salyut Minesweeper (Repeater)
    Moran (Repeater)

    Plus other stuff to fill it out. Maybe swap a Tsyklon for a Luno. Maybe another swap here or there.

    But that right there is effectively 6 hacking devices, 7 repeaters, and 3 pitchers.

    And I don’t consider my list to be a hacking reliant list. I don’t have special problems with fully or mostly non-hackable lists.

    My hacking is for me, and all my repeaters use their repeaters even if I never target an enemy with a hacking attack. My Zeros are hackers because I want infiltrating Specialists. My Moran is there for infiltrating Specialist and midfield koalas. Mary Problems is an Objective workhorse. My Interventor LT is a free Supportware every turn, and a counter to MSV. My Transducers are there for a B2 Falsh Pulse ARO. My Salyuts are there for Baggage, and the EVO buffs Hellcats and Overclocks all my REMs.

    It’s all there to do stuff regardless of whether the enemy is hackable.

    But if the enemy IS hackable... it’s party time!
    Get ready to have your brain melted, your AD dispersed, your guided missiles turned back, your TAGs Possessed, and your REMs and HI trip through a STAGGERING Repeater net.

    That’s why Nomads dominate hacking. You can do it without even trying.
     
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