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Dogs!

Discussion in 'Ariadna' started by Takoa, Dec 2, 2019.

  1. Takoa

    Takoa New Member

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    I am totally new to infinity, and after a while of looking at the differing aesthetics, I decided to jump on Ariadna thanks to their collection of awesome looking dog warriors.

    What I'm here on the forums to ask is:
    Are they viable, and what should I collect to support them on the field? I believe I'll be going with TAK as they have the most amount of them, but I'm just not sure what to collect.
     
    barakiel likes this.
  2. barakiel

    barakiel Echo Bravo Master Sergeant
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    @Takoa
    Cool choice. I assume we're talking about Vanilla Ariadna, yeah? And you specifically mean Dog Warriors, rather than Antipodes?

    The premise of the Dog Warrior is pretty straightforward, but it does require some finesse to use. They're focus is on short range, and they get durability in the form of Total Immunity, as well as multiple Wounds, to help them do as much close-range damage as possible (specifically using double Chain Rifles) before they go down. You may get an opportunity to dump a bunch of Orders into them, and run them all the way up the table and into a target-rich environment in one turn.

    More likely though, you'll probably need to wait until a good target presents itself. This requires careful positioning of the unit, so that their Impetuous move doesn't carry them out into a fusillade of lethal AROs too soon. Since a Dog Warrior starts with Silhouette 2, this makes them much easier to hide and keep out of Cover. They're pretty tough to conceal once they Hulk Out into Dog form, but that Size 2 is pretty easy to work with. Pair them with some other Impetuous models with smoke, such as Irmandinhos, so that those other models can get smoke down quickly and help clear a safe path of advance.

    You'll also want some strong gunfighters, to help clear the lanes and deter the enemy from contesting your Dog Warrior with AROs. Getting shot by high-Burst weaponry is going to be the big danger for any Dog Warrior, so you'll want units like Spetsnaz, or good Coordinated Order heavy weapon users, to help clear enemy AROs and give you a clear path to advance. Balance out that small Silhouette with the increased stats of the Dog form. You may want to look for an opportunity to take a hit, if you think the increased mobility of the Dog form will help you.

    Once you get near though, you're really just look to maximize Chain Rifle coverage, or even lob grenades. Chain Rifles can be devastating, but aren't always effective, and give the Dog Warrior no way of protecting himself with a face-to-face. If you see multiple opponents grouped up closely, consider throwing grenades, either as a F2F or with Speculative Fire. The PH of the Dog Warrior makes it one of the few units in the game who can use grenades really well in this mode of attack.

    Read up on Total Immunity, so you're aware of what weapons it will stop, and how it can be applied. Abuse it to storm past defensive Flash Pulses, or take risks against opponents with Double Action or Explosive ammo. You won't be invincible to everything out there, but you can leverage Total Immunity to do some pretty amazing things against an enemy defense.

    Lastly, be aware of the advantages and limitations of Super Jump. Being able to clear out models hiding on rooftops can be game-winning, but it can also make your Impetuous moves near-suicidal. Depending on your table, the height of the terrain you usually use, the positioning of your opponents, etc., it can be very easy to throw away a Dog Warrior that way. Don't be afraid to spend an Order to halt their Impetuous move, if you think it will let you preserve a valuable model for future use.
     
    TheDiceAbide and Golem2God like this.
  3. TriggerPuller9000

    TriggerPuller9000 Poverty Orde Wingate

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    As usual, @barakiel has it. A few additional things to note,

    1) TR bots and mass linked combi rifles are a doge's worst enemy so try to avoid those by throwing down smoke with other impetuous units before allowing doge to move.

    2) Don't forget that they have Grenades. If you're blitzing a 5-link of Fusiliers for example, often times it's better to spec fire a couple frags before committing to rounding a corner and eating B2 combis. With Impetuous, the dog's never getting that 6 effective armor and -3 BS to hit like most ARM 3 units, so even things like B2 combis can wreck him. For example, that 5-link of Fusiliers is hitting him on 18s...ouch.

    3) They can do CC...obviously not reliably against any CC monster but PH16 in dog form and an AP CCW means you can throw them at TAGs in a pinch.

    4) You can present opponents with no good option fairly easily. Move into CC, and if they dodge, either hit them with your AP CCW or a frag. If they CC you, give them both chain rifles to the face.
     
    Golem2God and barakiel like this.
  4. Takoa

    Takoa New Member

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    So, yes, this did include anitpodes and the assault squad, etc. This is why I mentioned TAK heh. Anyways, sounds like I need to pick up some irmandinhos and spetznas, though I am unsure of how much of both. I also will be getting half of the TAK conflict box, so I should have some other stuff behind the Ariadna support box I bought as well as the one box of dog warriors my local shop had on hand (they are woefully lacking in regards to Ariadna specifically, tons of nomad and combined).

    Any particular loadout models you all suggest running, or a possible list I should shoot to collect to start practicing and learning with while using these fun werewolves?
     
  5. barakiel

    barakiel Echo Bravo Master Sergeant
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    @Takoa
    Both the Antipode assault pack and the K-9 Strelok are solid gold. One Antipode attack is a staple of any TAK list, and plenty of players run two (though I personally think it's excessive.)

    The Antipode Pack could be the subject of an article by themselves. They have a ton of uses, but many of them aren't going to be obviously apparent to someone new to using them. Sensor and Discover are an obvious one, but really they're designed to serve as a cruise-missile style attack against an important, vulnerable enemy piece. They get there quickly, and they try to overwhelm their target with multiple CC attacks. They're also quite good for sweeping minefields, disrupting Suppressive Fire units. Keep in mind that their handler also has a Smoke Light Grenade Launcher, which is a very good way to land Smoke upfield if (for some reason) your smoke tossers can't get there.

    The K-9 Strelok has a simple premise too: it's a great midfield anti-Camo unit, starting up the table and quickly discovering and attack enemy Camo tokens. The team in general is very short-range, but can punch hard with multiple ammo types thanks to the combination of SMG and Trench Hammer. You can play around a lot with getting unopposed attacks, manipulating enemy AROs, and making great use of Surprise Shot and Surprise Attack to let this team punch above its weight. Support this team with Strelok Minelayers (which are generally a solid purchase for TAK.) The big Antipode Camo Token is very big and very obvious, so it needs some protection until it can have a chance to attack.

    For Spetsnaz:
    HMG. High Burst fire superiority. The Parachutist profile has its uses, but it's not a fire superiority piece. Use that Spetsnaz to clear lanes. The Veteran Kazak with 5-man link bonuses is even better at this role as well. Having both a Spetsnaz and a Vet Kazak HMG will give you plenty of active-turn firepower to clear the way for your short-range dogs.

    For Irmandinhos:
    Chain Rifle. Their BS is abysmal and their BS weapon profiles more expensive... One of Infinity's stranger dichotomies. Get 2-3 of the Chain Rifle loadout, and never look back. These are 8 points very well spent in TAK.
     
  6. Takoa

    Takoa New Member

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    So it sounds like my buy list is the following so far:

    Spetznas hmg x1
    Assault pack x2
    Strelok w/Antipode x2
    Strelok minelayers x2?
    Veteran Kazak hmg? x5?
    Irmandinhos chain rifle x3

    Not sure I've fully understood here, but as always, I'm up for any and all comments. If it helps, I believe the local meta here is Nomads, Combined Army, and Haqqislam.
     
  7. MattyG2787

    MattyG2787 Member

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    Dogs are great. Please see my maximum doggo list. I don’t own it yet but about half way there

    Unleash the hounds──────────────────────────────────────────────────GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]6 [​IMG]4 [​IMG]2 STRELOK K-9 Submachine Gun, Chain-colt, Antipersonnel Mines + 1 K-9 Antipode / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24) [​IMG] K-9 ANTIPODE Trench-hammer, AP CC Weapon. (8) STRELOK K-9 Submachine Gun, Chain-colt, Antipersonnel Mines + 1 K-9 Antipode / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24) [​IMG] K-9 ANTIPODE Trench-hammer, AP CC Weapon. (8) STRELOK K-9 Submachine Gun, Chain-colt, Antipersonnel Mines + 1 K-9 Antipode / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24) [​IMG] K-9 ANTIPODE Trench-hammer, AP CC Weapon. (8) STRELOK K-9 Submachine Gun, Chain-colt, Antipersonnel Mines + 1 K-9 Antipode / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24) [​IMG] K-9 ANTIPODE Trench-hammer, AP CC Weapon. (8) ASSAULT PACK undefined. (0 | 25) [​IMG] HANDLER Rifle, Smoke Light Grenade Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (- | 10) [​IMG] x3 ANTIPODE AP CC Weapon. (- | 15) ASSAULT PACK undefined. (0 | 25) [​IMG] HANDLER Rifle, Smoke Light Grenade Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (- | 10) [​IMG] x3 ANTIPODE AP CC Weapon. (- | 15) DOG-WARRIOR 2 Chain Rifles, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / AP CCW. (0 | 29) DOG-WARRIOR 2 Chain Rifles, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / AP CCW. (0 | 29)GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]5 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1 DOG-WARRIOR 2 Chain Rifles, Grenades, Smoke Grenades / AP CCW. (0 | 29) LINE KAZAK Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 9) LINE KAZAK Lieutenant Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 9) LINE KAZAK AP HMG / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 23) LINE KAZAK Missile Launcher / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 17) LINE KAZAK Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 9) 2.5 SWC | 300 PointsOpen in Infinity Army
     
  8. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    Maxing out on things isn't always the best idea in Infinity.

    For example, most lists won't have space for more than 3 or 4 "Heavy weapons" due to SWC costs, Vet Kazaks can also form Fireteams with Line Kazaks (or anyone else) so you'll only ever really use a single Vet Kazak HMG.

    Irregular troopers like Irmandinhos, Assault Packs, and Dog Warriors are also something to be careful about taking too many of due to their irregular orders, you can easily be left without enough Regular orders to really accomplish much on your turn.
     
  9. TriggerPuller9000

    TriggerPuller9000 Poverty Orde Wingate

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    In general, people tend to take the Spetsnaz HMG over the Tankhunter but there are a lot of reasons to take the Tankhunter HMG too.

    Specifically, now that MI get Forward Deployment L1, that Tankhunter can often obtain cross-field shots from elevated positions that would require a lot of maneuver to achieve with the Spetsnaz.

    Re orders, I find it difficult to fit the power pieces I want and more than say 12-14 regular orders. Not saying it's a problem at all but I generally get more regular orders with PanO TAG lists than TAK.
     
    #9 TriggerPuller9000, Dec 4, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2019
  10. barakiel

    barakiel Echo Bravo Master Sergeant
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    5 Vet Kazak HMGs? Not quite. You'll want 1 Vet Kazak HMG, and link him with four 9 point Line Kazaks to maximize link bonuses, giving you a 5-person Core Fire Team.

    That's also going to give you a chunk of Regular Orders. As mentioned, the biggest mechanic issue with running dog-heavy lists is that they're short-range units, and (in the case of Dog Warriors and Antipodes, also Irregular), meaning they need a lot of orders to get close enough to be a threat. Having a list full of them is fun and fine, but there's severe diminishing returns after taking the first few.

    You'll want troops like line kazaks, or the Dozer + 5 point minsweeper muls, to give you enough Regular Orders for your dogs to get into combat.
     
  11. McDevil

    McDevil Active Member

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    I will be not duplicate any boxes on start. Like assault pack, they cool but painting same models are boring. Carmen on bike with doggos looks cool :).Just some what you like and what fellas recommend for you. You will not play competitive games from day one :). And most models can find use and be fun on table.
     
  12. Tanan

    Tanan Member

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    Vet kazak core link team is really good, but you only need one HMG and even that isn’t absolutely mandatory.

    The thing about vet kazak core link team is that it’s:
    1) Highly mobile because of fireteam order efficiency.
    2) Highly durable because of vet kazak stats and gear.
    3) Ability put multiple suppressive fire lanes on the mission area thanks to 1), 2) and readily available smoke ammo.
    4) Complete most of the missions
     
  13. Takoa

    Takoa New Member

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    So, got my hands on the TAK side of Coldfront, so I now have a ratnik, 3 line kazaks, a tankhunter, vet Kazak, scout, 2 dog warriors, and the support box.

    It sounds like I still need a spetznaz, an assault pack, some irmandinhos, and streloks. Oh and a leader of some kind.
     
  14. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    The three Line Kazaks or the Vet Kazak all make perfectly serviceable Lieutenants.

    The Tankhunter can also work either a a hidden Lt or as a Chain of Command backup to an obvious Lt.
     
  15. Captain Nevercrit

    Captain Nevercrit Well-Known Member

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    The Vet Kazak with HMG is a mandatory purchase because its an amazing miniature.
     
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