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Dodge ARO in close combat against Dodge

Discussion in 'Rules' started by HANGMAN, Jun 1, 2021.

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  1. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    Hey Everyone,

    Watching a battle report on youtube and there was a model that for the first order declared dodge. It dodged into a doorway with start trek doors. Now, there was a few models inside the room that had the star trek doors. Can they react to the dodge with a dodge? The dodge skill in the wiki says it may not generate ARO's. Suppose his second short order was idle, then I assume they could.

    What if the first part of the order was idle, then the ARO was dodge (-3 for out of lof), then he dodged into the doorway. Since the active player goes first, it goes into the doorway. The ARO model is now in engage range and it dodges into B2B. Is that now a face to face dodge roll? Does the active player still get to place the model that dodged into him while moving?

    I feel so rusty. Thanks!
     
  2. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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  3. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit SecUnit

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    However, any trooper that was in ZoC or LoF when the Dodge was declared could have AROd normally. You can ARO to the Dodge skill, just not to Dodge movement (which happens at Resolution).
     
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  4. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    Thanks! So if the active model is within ZOC, out of lof, of the reactive model and declares and idle. The reactive player declares dodge. Then the active player declares dodge. OES suggests that the active player does his dodge move first. Say that brings him in range of the reactive players dodge. So active player dodges within range and the reactive player engages. Can this happen? Does this become of face to face?
     
  5. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    So in the scenario above, the reactive player couldn't dodge into base to base?
     
  6. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    With this one, it's best to forget everything you knew about the N3 Engage skill.

    Active and Reactive both Dodge, they will not be Face to Face as Dodges don't directly affect each other.

    At Step 6.1 the Active player moves his trooper, then the Reactive moves his. This can bring the reactive trooper into Silhouette contact if they wish (or out of contact if the Active player had moved into contact with their Dodge)
     
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  7. Robock

    Robock Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure about that. I was rereading 6.1 and it doesn't specify when both players moves if, as you say, Active player moves, then Reactive player moves. Or if it could be Reactive player moves, then Active player moves.

    I looked a bit around and I can't find if the rule says that in those case the active player decides who'll do the movement first. Or if the rules says reactive player chose. Or even if there is nothing to chose and active player simply always moves first.
     
  8. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    https://infinitythewiki.com/Dodge
    Screenshot_20210601-114036_Chrome.jpg
     
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  9. Robock

    Robock Well-Known Member

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  10. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    I think Dodge is the only time you get to make a choice in step 6.1.
     
  11. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    I'm not sure how they don't effect each other as one is attempting to going into b2b. If one model is attempting to get into b2b and there is a dodge, why doesn't that stop it? How isn't it a f2f roll? If a model moves into lof of 4 other models and 3 shoot and one dodges into b2b and the active player dodges and beats all the rolls, including the other reactive players dodge to get into b2b, that reactive model can't be stopped? Sorry, it doesn't make sense. How do you stop a model from engaging?
     
    #11 HANGMAN, Jun 1, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2021
  12. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    I suppose the question becomes how do you dodge a dodge (engage) from a reactive player?
     
    #12 HANGMAN, Jun 1, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2021
  13. Robock

    Robock Well-Known Member

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    the active player also gets to move on an active turn dodge. so he can attempt to dodge to be too far to be reached by the reactive player.

    also, as dodge movement is only done end of order, how do you even know that the dodges interacts ? when the other player ARO dodge, you have no idea if he's trying to dodge away in cover or to dodge toward your model to reach b2b. Then when you declare dodge as second half, the other player doesn't know if you are trying to dodge all the shots and move away; or trying to dodge all the shots while reaching him in b2b.

    edit: as an active player, you can also cancel the enemy's dodge by shooting him in FtF. But then you'll need to split Burst to oppose the other shooters. And generally speaking, try to not give away 4 ARO when you move.
     
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  14. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit SecUnit

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    End your movement outside their maximum Dodge range.

    Or if you have LoF, shoot them and win the F2F.
     
  15. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    Because you don't Declare "Dodge into silhouette contact" you just declare "Dodge". The decision of where to move isn't made until step 6.1

    In your example the Active trooper can avoid the Dodging Reactive trooper in two main ways:

    1) Using their own Dodge movement to get out of range of the reactive player's Dodge

    2) Not moving into Dodge range of the reactive trooper in the first place
     
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  16. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    Well, the original scenario the active model was too far away to be reached. It wasn't until the active players dodge brought him close enough as to where the reactive could reach the model with a dodge. Your explanation does make sense. Thank you.
     
  17. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    Ahh, yes, these make sense! Thanks!

    Another quick question, who places the reactive player dodging model? It used to be active player (engaging while the active player is moving) in N3. Who does it now?
     
  18. colbrook

    colbrook Black Fryer

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    Reactive player, forget everything you knew about N3 Engage ;)
     
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  19. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    lol, I'm trying but it's so hard!! :laughing::sob:
     
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  20. HANGMAN

    HANGMAN Member

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    Thanks everyone, I appreciate your responses and explanations!!
     
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