Ok so it’s gotten really boring here. No one seems to be posting anymore. For good or bad. I’d almost rather salt posts than nothing at all. My first love will always be Yu Jing but I’ve now moved to O-12 for a while. Mainly because I got lucky with a cheap auction of them but also because I was getting very frustrated with YJ too. I rarely won games and when I did, they were very close. This was pre-reinforcements, but I don’t think REF would have changed much for me. The new Daebak makes me want to go back for a while to try them out. However, I feel Daebak troops are a band-aid on bigger problem. From what I’ve experienced, YJ are generalists in a specialized world. Now I’m going to hear “But that’s their thing!” Unfortunately, the missions (and secret objectives) require or at least give advantage to specific specialists and even better if they are Veteran or Elite. YJ certainly has some but most of the time they are very expensive. I understand the generalist approach, but I think we could at least have some cheaper ones. What I want. Changes to existing troops Some existing troops need tweeks. I don’t think anything major. Mainly in costs but there’s some other things that could be changed. Zhanshi should be cheaper. I hate that YJ in general pays for a useless higher CC skill. Who the hell intentionally sends their Zhanshi into CC?! CC15 means nothing when the ones that want to get into CC have a CC of 22+ and then maybe Martial Arts on top of that, and then add more for being over 20! Not to mention likely having a DA CCW or Shock. No one is going to put their Zhanshi into CC with a Fusilier with a CC15 when you can just shoot a burst of 3 on 14s. Since we lost the JSA, we are NOT the close combat sectoral. Also, teh +1" on a dodge is almost useless. Mine never make the dodge roll. Put Mech Engineer and Doctor under the same heading and make them AVA2. Like they do with Lambda and Tokusetsu. I may not take two doctors or engineers but It’s nice to have the option. I can understand it’s a YJ “thing” but right now we have 1 AVA1 doctor in all YJ factions. The next lowest factions have 4 of various AVA. So I’m not asking for much. Sun Tzu, move the Stratego skill to only the Lt. options. He’s paying for a skill he can’t use. Maybe give those options Counter Intelligence instead. Give the Sniper ST Marksmanship or something that actually makes him the Marksman Leader. Maybe for a fireteam in ISS? The HI version should have BS13. Jing Qo, needs a forward deployment skill option with camo or impersonation. Maybe with downgraded gun to SMG. I used her a few times and she never did anything significant. I tried to do big things with her too. Gao, I don’t think anyone uses him because there’s better options. I’m not sure what to do with him but he needs something. Anything that might make him worth taking over a Shang Ji. He is supposed to be a good leader, so how about Stratego L1, Inspiring Leadership, Strategic Deployment, Chain of Command. Kanren, I think these guys are going to die out with ISS but they could still be ok. They just need to be cheaper. The BS could go down. They have meh weapons anyway. They almost never get into CC so why do they have the skills? They are easily beaten but the real CC experts. I’d say replace the Mono CCW with Para CCW-6. Holo projector is meh but it’s at least different. Bao would immediately become great if they could be in a core fireteam. It wouldn’t change all that much! There’s many other MSV snipers that can join core teams now. Vidoc, Brawler, Grenzer, etc. They also need a specialist. Their WIP14 is almost useless since they have Courage. They seem to be giving out a lot of Marksman rifles so how about a MMR for them? Tools to get the job done I HATE missions that require anti-material weapons. Mainly because we don’t have many of them. There are other factions in the same boat but then there are others that have a LOT more. Especially troops that can walk up on the first turn and destroy the objective. We have them, but on expensive troops like the Daofei, or easily killed guys in the DZ . The primary reason I take the Beasthunter in EVERY list. They are also usually restricted to one profile while other factions will have them on every troop! Why the hell is there only one on the Zhanying hacker for instance? Shaolin Now for something completely different. This is just for personal reasons mainly and would never happen. But I want to get it out of my mind. I’ve always been a bit irritated by Shaolin. The reason probably not what you think. Mainly it’s because I’m Buddhist, and Shaolin are Buddhist monks. Taking a life is a serious sin with Buddhists and there’s not much wiggle room to get out it. Some won’t even defend themselves or will sweep their path, so they don’t accidently kill a bug. Yes, Shaolin learn many close combat weapons while training. But mainly to learn how to defend against them (you can’t defend well against what you don’t know). The main weapon of war for Shaolin was the staff. In battles they tried to incapacitate rather than kill. Also, they are not bloodthirsty madmen running into battle. If anything, they are trained to be calm cool and always collected. So, I find how they do Shaolin in this game a bit offensive. Here’s how I would change them to still be playable but adhere to the teachings of the Buddha. Keep Irregular Change Impetuous to Tactical Aware Keep Smoke Grenades Change Chain Rifle to Heavy Riotstopper and/or E/Marrat Change Pistol to Stun Pistol Change DA CCW to Para CCW -6 and/or -3. I don’t mind an AP since at most it can only put a guy into unconscious state. Change Boarding Shotgun to Adhesive Launcher and Light Riotstopper. Change Combi Rifle to Flash Pulse or Adhesive Launcher. I realize it makes them useless to Immunity (Total), but I don’t find that a big problem. They couldn’t do much to them before! I also thought of not being able to do Coup de grace, but you can almost think of that as subduing the enemy rather than killing. New Troops You may have seen my thread about best troops under 20pts. and YJ has less good, cheap troops than any other faction. Also, those they have are not unique. Everyone has an equivalent of some sort Zhanshi-Fusiler, Weibing-Pathfinder, Shaolin-Morlock, etc. Many of their best cheap troops are mercenaries that almost everyone has! Digger, Liberto, Monstrucker, etc. YJ also doesn’t have good cheap midfield specialists. Right now, the only midfield specialist we have under 25pts. is the Kanren FO at 24pts., (which has been an underwhelming troop for me) and a Parachutist Cube Jager (who just sucks). Specialists So, I think we need more specialists in the 5-15pts and 16-25 range, especially a doctor. We only have the AVA1 Yisheng doctor and a few (6) paramedics. I’m not stuck on them having more doctors though. But I’d really like a new specialist troop in the less than 20pt. range. Preferably fast with a bike or some sort of forward deployment. Some examples from other factions would be: Raveneye 12pts, Ment 15pts, Moran Massai 17/18pts, Marspider 19pts, Auxilia 15pts., Dynamo 19/20pts, Barid 13-17pts. Remotes We have the HI faction but why don’t we have any HI remotes? Aleph has the Rudras, Nomads have Vostok, and now O-12 has Stormbots. So, where the hell is the HI factions HI Remote!? Part of the reason I stopped taking the Rui Shi or Lu Duan is because they can’t take a hit! Sure, they can give the damage, but they can’t take it. I don’ t how many times they were destroyed by a pistol or rifle. My Engineer looking at it, after easily taking three wounds, thinks “I just wish they had armor”. TAGS I want more TAGS! I don’t think we can call YJ the HI faction when we only have 2 TAGs to choose from. I know some will say it’s not HI. But it pretty much is. Especially if it’s a manned TAG. YJ is the second major super-power, but we have less TAGs than Nomads and the same amount as some NA2. I know Nomads have more mainly to popularity and YJ don’t NEED TAGs, but they are cool. It would be nice to have one that has more than just one option of weapons or something. We have more options on the Triphammer than the Guijia or Blue Wolf! To be honest, I’m not sure what kind of TAG that would be most beneficial. I’d say we need one for ISS but I think we all know ISS is a dead sectoral L. So, I don’t have high hopes. I think we would more likely get a Daebak (Korean) TAG. Other than being Korean, does Daebak have a theme? I can’t point at them and say they are the CC guys because they only have two that are good CC troops. They have 1 good HI shooter, 1 do anything guy, 1 good specialist, 1 generic HI. It would also be difficult to make something unique. There’s already TAGs that have mimetisim, MSV, combat jump, good CC, specialist, etc. Unless they create something new, YJ will just get something that everyone else already has but just a little different and probably worse. I don’t mind if it’s the same cost as either of the other two as long as it has a different role. The Guijia is a main battle TAG with long range gun and super jump to get into line of fire. Blue Wolf is a midfield brawler.
Every time time I hope i get disappointed. Other than REF, YJ is only second to Haqq in the least number of new figures since 2020. To me that says they are not worth giving them anything. I hate to say it but the JSA becoming vanilla feels like a kick in the gut a little. I think it's cool and all, but YJ has been drug through the mud a lot. White Banner has gotten a huge boost, I know that. But it's not like they became top tier because of it. The sectoral even sucked balls when it first came out. Like I said above they got a band-aid. But I feel IA and ISS seriously need help. TB was another kind of punch to the gut, they are IA but better. It also feels like YJ gets something cool and new and then another faction gets the same thing but better. Just look at Long Ya vs. Moonraker, Strider/Sombra vs. Zhencha, and more. I'm willing to bet the new JSA beasthunter will be better than ours too.
So, back when there was that mission that have benefits to TAGs, I kinda had to look at myself a bit more closely, because I was collecting ISS & Steel Phalanx at the time, neither of which had any TAGs :-( But times have changed! A little. For SP. For ISS, I know we have the Su Jian which is TAG-like, but for a real TAG, how about something with a Sepsitor? I like the idea that the State Empire had been working behind the scenes to appropriate some "influential" EI tech that elevates their propaganda save recruitment abilities. Or perhaps, as part of the Human Sphere's bargaining with the CA, the State Empire learned a few things about controlling their own... This would also lean into reinforcing the dodgy/"evil" motivations that are part of the ISS background, and could even end up with a Ko Dali moment, where the ISS steals a named character from another faction. Who would be the best - or funniest - Character for the ISS to Sepsitorise? I'd float Fusilier Angus. What a slap for Pan-O! Or, more seriously, take the Kuroshi Rider away from JSA - the old foe. Who is Kuroshi? Is she actually Asuka Kisaragi in a helmet? What secrets does she know, that are now the Emperor's? Will she ride beside murder-kitties to destroy her former compatriots as they invade a new planet through the wormhole? And the TAG itself could be something otherwise kinda weak, but very sneaky...
Nothing evil in ISS. It is dedicated to the protection of Yu Jing, be it from internal or external threat. From what we know of the N5 lore bits dropped during the seminar, ISS was right all along. The Japaneses can't be trusted, they betrayed PanOceania in order to clain a new world. They bite the hand that allowed them to flee the rightful justice the glorious State-Empire. ISS is here to protect you citizen. Now if you could follow calmly the Zhanying Agent there, please...
A reason to come back is what I want most of all. There's been a truly remarkable amount of discussion on the concept of "faction identity" over the years here, and in N4 I found most factions were defined more by what they lacked than what they had- skill with a tool rarely meant as much as having access in the first place. Yu Jing offered nothing to me on the very rare occasions I was able to grab a game throughout N4, having none of the fancy biological skills of Ariadna, Tohaa or Haqq while also lacking the technological toys of O12, ALEPH, CA and Nomads. Whether it be through buffs, new units, or widespread nerfs to other factions, I want a big, shining reason to pull my Yu Jing out of the box again.
In the Q&A at the seminar somebody asked about Yu Jing in light of the new JSA status and Carlos spoke a fair bit about ISS so I have a feeling that ISS will get some much needed attention early in N5.
it works for me still, you may need to be a member of the Infinity Facebook group because that is a private group.
Actually, I would also love to see the return of the Closed Battle List idea. It's totally self-serving - they only came out with one, for ISS (my favourite sectorial), and most of the appeal was the weird fireteam options, and the inclusion of a Guijia in some of them. Weird Fireteam options have mostly been addressed in N4, but I still like this "no thought necessary" list system for people who want to stop agonising over things. And who want a secret police GUIJIA!!! (People like me)
So who wants to bet the JSA beasthunter will better than YJ and the Sohei will be better Shaolin. I know it sounds negative but it's on theme that YJ is always one-upped. They are already showing Sohei get a an AP+Shock CCW. Shaolin only get DA or Shock. I'm not sure on the SMG vs. a Chainrifle. I want to say the SMG is better due to AP or Shock but templates can be good too. I thought my idea on Shaolin was going to be controversial and have more discussion!
N5 change I'd like to see is more consistency in HI profiles, how they look and what their stats n abilities are. Current N4 has NWI and BTS0 as a way to make something cheaper even if it doesn't fit the fluff or physical appearance of the model, would like to avoid repeating that in N5. -Zuyong, and Jujacks are the older budget mass production armor. ShangJi is the new standard. They do feel that way in N4. - -Zhencha, Hulang, LiuXing feel like they should get one solid specialized upgrade over the old budget armor. -HaiDao are suppose to be space marine special forces, got Hac Tao style power packs and MoWang mimetism plates. I figure ISS Crane armor should feel like that, something not meant for walking through machinegun fire but for hunting down prey. State media broadcasts the HaiDao's brave rescue operation, state media does not report on the crane's kidnapping-for-super-torture operation. -DaoFei armor looks advanced like a Hac Tao Lite, does feel that way in N4. Hsien is at a similar level. -Hac Tao is the super expensive cutting edge everything, which it already is in N4.... an N5 Hsien could be the melee-to-make-sure-state-enemy's-head-is-taken-back-to-show-emperor equivalent.
I think its way too early to judge about that. We don´t know the full skill list of them nor the price tag. At the moment I see nothing wrong with Shaolin (only the fluff maybe;-). I think the japanese monks will come without smoke ... or just in one of it sectorials. As JSA is somewhat the the CC faction, yes maybe the BH will be better, but than also more expensive. With N5 we might see a rework of the BHs anyway. Regarding YJ HI I hope the will see the following issues: Haido have to get BTS - a HI without BTS feels not right. Crane should get 6_2 move - why have a CC capable HI that can not reach the enemy in one stride. Same for Hulang. A shocktroop with FWD that only move 4-4 feels wrong suited for the task. Wu Ming and Zencha are also too slow. WuMing armour too old? The reason for Zhencha is to keep it one pt cheaper? That feels inconsistent.
The profile image shows them as having SMG, Smoke Grenades, and AP+Shock CCW. Also note, the Sohei have smoke grenades and are Reinforcements. This will be the first REF troop with them. Edit: I was wrong and it's regular grenades.
Sohei look like HI to me (big boots, armored arms, big shoulder pads, HI backpack), so I'm unsure about a comparison with Shaolin Monks (maybe more with Hwarang). The loadout states "normal" grenades, not smoke ones.
Oh Snap! You're right. My bad then. I saw grenades and must of added smoke in my head. I never trust the art or figures. There's many that look light and are HI and opposite.
I'd like to see more proactive anti-hacking in Yu-Jing. I don't really care if I need an entire turn to handle hacking before I can unleash my heavies, but at least I'd like to have the tools to do so, and without breaking sectorial theme (like being essentially forced to play LI or MI in THE HI sectorial....). he dokkaebi is kind of a nice step towards this, though it was somehow not available to the sectorials that needed it the most, IA and ISS. Some love for Baos and Cranes would be sweet too, those are the models that made me start Infinity and I'd love to have a reason to use them beside proxying...
