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Better Starting Point - Sectorial or Vanilla?

Discussion in 'Nomads' started by Scripts, Jun 9, 2019.

  1. Scripts

    Scripts New Member

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    So, I'm looking at starting to play/collect Nomads for Infinity. I've usually been drawn to the Bakunin (who doesn't love blood thirsty nuns and hackers?), but I also like some of the other sectorial/vanilla troops as well (All the Cats, etc.).

    Is there an advantage to starting with the vanilla core versus one of the sectorial starters and a couple of the different group packs for that particular sectorial? (For Bakunin I was looking at getting the starter, Moderators, Nuns, and Zeros). Is the game easier to learn via vanilla versus one of the sectorial armies, or do the sectorial armies tend to have "weirder"/gotcha rules that the vanilla set doesn't?

    Last (immediate) question: Are there any good "all comer" 300 point lists that you would build from the starter kits and approximately $100 USD in additional models that you could recommend? This would be my 3rd or 4th game system I'd be playing into, so I'm trying to manage my entry price.
     
  2. MattyG2787

    MattyG2787 Member

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    I started with bakunin pretty recently. I had a $250 aud budget to grab a list.
    I ended up with
    2 riot grrl boxes
    Box of the 2 remotes
    Morlockes
    Uberfell kommandos
    Pack of zeroes
    Custodier with combi
    Support pack (doctor and engineer)

    It’s given me a solid including the double ml for riot grrls

    Hope that helps


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  3. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    Fireteams can be hard to learn but the limited access to troops in a sectorial makes it easier. I don't think one is better enough to start with to pick over aesthetic. Just pick based on what you like the look of. IMO go for lasting appeal; I like the Moira nuns but after 100 games I prefer the simplicity of Corregidor faceless helmeted elites. But that's just what I like.
     
  4. Diphoration

    Diphoration Well-Known Member

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    I highly suggest starting with a sectorial, it'll give you a clearer path on which model to acquire and will be simpler to focus purchases. It's also a lot less overwhelming (vanilla has a lot of profiles).

    Sectorial have some extra rules with the fireteams, I suggest you play your first few (3?) games without fireteams to get a grasp of the rule and then incorporate them. You'll have to learn how they work no matter what as you'll be facing them soon enough.

    There are no "all corner lists" in Infinity. Although you can make a skeleton of a list, you'll need to tweak it for the mission if you want to perform.

    If you end up playing sectorial you'll find that list building is a bit more streamlined, all your lists will contain a fireteam core.
     
    barakiel, ChoTimberwolf and Stiopa like this.
  5. Ogid

    Ogid Well-Known Member

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    As the other said, it's 100% your call.
    The links are the main advantages of the sectorials, you will get extra firepower and can move up the board with better eficiency; but you'll miss a lot of versatility, and the links are powerful but they can be defeated with templates, trading shots with the non leader, hacking...
    In Vanilla you can get all the tools you want, and now with puppets can have a kind of fireteam but you miss the extra punch of the links.

    If you like Bakunin then go Bakunin, you can always get a few extra models later and make some good Vanilla lists; but be careful with the nuns. ODD is great but they are total glass cannon, 1 W and no inmunity to shock for a 30+ (44 kusanagi!) model is very risky; a few bad rolls and you are out of the game. Also the custodiers pay for his ODD a lot but can't have at the same time white noise and his own ODD, which hurts them a lot. I'd start Bakunin with Grrls and Zoe instead of with nuns.
     
  6. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    I love Custodiers. I dislike what CB continues to do them. :'(

    I started playing with Bakunin. What I'd suggest is don't lean on your core link in your early games because handling Fireteams can be difficult.

    Personally I'd recommend a Moderator Core (*shudders*) + Riot Grrl Haris archetype to learn Bakunin with.

    You get the power of the Grrls without the hassle of having to manage an active full-core. It's really easy to add the great Bakunin support from that point.

    I'd also leave Uberfalls off the table until you get the hang of Morlocks. Run a CRAP Morlock as an attack Warband to get the feel of using smoke to efficiently get up the board.

    I've been running something like this recently and it's fun.

    Jurisdictional Command of Bakunin
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]8 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    RIOT GRRL (Fireteam: Haris) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL Spitfire / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 34)
    MODERATOR MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    MODERATOR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 8)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]6 [​IMG]3 [​IMG]2
    SALYUT (Minesweeper, Repeater) Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    SIN-EATER Spitfire / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 31)
    AVICENNA Combi Rifle, Flash Pulse / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 27)
    ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    ZERO (Minelayer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 19)
    ZERO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    ZERO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    WARCOR (360º Visor) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
    Ogid likes this.
  7. MattyG2787

    MattyG2787 Member

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    What’s with the CRAP morlocke?
    Sorry, seen the term a couple of times and have no idea


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  8. Tourniquet

    Tourniquet TJC Tech Support

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    Chain Rifle Assault Pistol, is the 8 point one
     
  9. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    This. Within 8" it's actually solid at killing things. I've chewed up even Hsiens with them.
     
  10. Ogid

    Ogid Well-Known Member

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    Yep, don't confuse it with the crap morlock, the 6 points one :P

    The AP morlock is scary when it get close, B4 BS14 isn't bad at all for a 8 points model; and if he make it CC will also bite.

    The uberfalls need more careful play than morlocks, but are amazing. With 3 G:Sync, I-Khol plus Natural Born Warrior, I don't think there is a single model in the entire game that is better in CC than a full Uberfall. They are glass cannon but total immunity is a great extra (and will make them immune to those annoying flash pulses), eclipse smoke is very powerful, and you can do some shenanigans with the pupniks (like sacrificing one to clear mines for example).
     
  11. Ogid

    Ogid Well-Known Member

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    Nice list! Good ARO defense and mid field control with Zeros. I'll have to try that.

    What do you think about these 2 version of that list for a new player?
    Both give up Avicenna, the sin-eater and 1 zero for a HD, and Engineer and a Reaktion (with the idea of using assisted fire). They are a bit worse at defending mid field and first turn ARO but pitcher, HD, Engi and the reaktion (plus pi well in one of the lists) give it more answers to different threats, and a reaktion supported can be a solid back up attack piece.

    Jurisdictional Command of Bakunin
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]8 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    RIOT GRRL (Fireteam: Haris) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL Spitfire / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 34)
    MODERATOR MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    MODERATOR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle + Pitcher / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 10)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 8)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]7 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    REAKTION ZOND HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    SALYUT (Minesweeper, Repeater) Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    ZERO (Minelayer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 19)
    ZERO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    ZOE & PI-WELL . (0 | 47)
    [​IMG] ZOE (Hacking Device. UPGRADE: Stop!) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 28)
    [​IMG] PI-WELL Combi Rifle / Electric Pulse. (0 | 19)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Jurisdictional Command of Bakunin
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    RIOT GRRL (Fireteam: Haris) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL Spitfire / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 34)
    MODERATOR MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    MODERATOR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle + Pitcher / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 10)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 8)
    MODERATOR Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 17)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]6 [​IMG]3 [​IMG]2
    REAKTION ZOND HMG / Electric Pulse. (1 | 26)
    ZERO (Deployable Repeater) Combi Rifle, E/Mauler / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 19)
    ZERO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    CLOCKMAKER Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 18)
    ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    SALYUT (Minesweeper, Repeater) Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    WARCOR (360º Visor) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
  12. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    The Zoe one is cool. I'd run a Transductor instead of the Salyut for another source of Sniffers. But that's a minor change.

    Personally I'm running Uberfalls and 5 Morlocks in my version. :Evil:

    Which is kinda the point: I'm not really recommending a particular list but rather an archetype (Grrls Haris + Moderator Core). Of the common Bakunin archetypes (Grrls Core, Moira Core, Kusanagi Haris + Moderators, Grrls Haris + Moderators, 2 Trios) I'd argue that Grrls Haris + Moderators balances being forgiving while still being flexible. It has a solid core that you can experiment around without running the risk of building an objectively bad list (unless you really try).

    There's also enough room that it doesn't feel samey. Your Z&P version and my Uberfalls + 5 Morlocks version will feel VERY different but retain enough similar tools that the change shouldn't be overwhelming.

    It comes down to having a very robust but cheap core.

    Jurisdictional Command of Bakunin
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]8
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    RIOT GRRL (Fireteam: Haris) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL Spitfire / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 34)

    4 SWC | 147 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    150pts / 2 SWC goes a long way in Bakunin if you already have 2 proper guns, a HI Specialist and 8 orders.

    It also slow grows / expands very well. You can build solid lists around the 'basic Bakunin must-buys'.

    Bakunin Starter
    Grrls Box
    Zeros Blister
    Morlocks Box
    Support Box

    Jurisdictional Command of Bakunin
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]8 [​IMG]2 [​IMG]2
    RIOT GRRL (Fireteam: Haris) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL Spitfire / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 34)
    MODERATOR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    MODERATOR Paramedic (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 11)
    MODERATOR Spitfire / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 15)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 8)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 8)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]5 [​IMG]3 [​IMG]3
    ZERO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    ZERO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    CLOCKMAKER Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 18)
    ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    SIN-EATER Spitfire / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 31)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
    #12 inane.imp, Jun 10, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2019
    ChoTimberwolf and Ogid like this.
  13. Jason839

    Jason839 Well-Known Member

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    I recommend starting with the Sectorials as it focuses what you are learning. Smaller pool of models to acquire and a smaller set of rules to learn, it lets you really get the hang of a small portion of the faction, and the fireteams make it easier to build lists when first starting out.
     
    loricus likes this.
  14. Ogid

    Ogid Well-Known Member

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    Yep, that's good advice, i also build my lists starting for the links.
    Could you post that 5 morloks + 2+ uberfals list, i'm curious. I've never run something with that number of irregular/impetuous.
     
  15. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Jurisdictional Command of Bakunin
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    RIOT GRRL (Fireteam: Haris) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL (Specialist Operative) Combi Rifle, Blitzen, Stun Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 30)
    RIOT GRRL Spitfire / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 34)
    MODERATOR MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (1.5 | 17)
    MODERATOR Lieutenant Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 9)
    BAKUNIN ÜBERFALLKOMMANDO undefined. (0 | 24)
    [​IMG] CHIMERA Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Viral CCW. (0 | 21)
    [​IMG] x3 PUPNIK DA CCW. (0 | 3)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG]5 [​IMG]5
    SIN-EATER Spitfire / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 31)
    DAKTARI Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    ZONDBOT Electric Pulse. (0 | 3)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CCW. (0 | 6)
    MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CCW. (0 | 8)
    ZERO (Minelayer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 19)
    ZERO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)

    6 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
    Ogid likes this.
  16. Jason839

    Jason839 Well-Known Member

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    If you have never run that many before, Bring tokens to mark the meta abilities of your morlocks. Will make everyone’s life easier.
     
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  17. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    So... I was at a tournament on the weekend. There where at least 3 people in attendance who own Metachemistry markers. It's a thing.(I was one @hachimantaro was the second and the third was running 9 Morlocks in Vanilla.)

    The other option is there are 9 Morlock models, and additional great proxies (Gata and 8-Ball). Just use the model that matches the metachem (ie 8-Ball = +3 Phys).
     
  18. Ogid

    Ogid Well-Known Member

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    9 morlocks?. Lol, I have to give that a try. I thought that lists as skewed as that were a bad idea at a tournament. But in Vanilla to make a huge smoke screen for the intruders it could work i guess...

    How did he distribute them? Half in each combat group or most of them in group 2. My biggest fear in those kind of lists is watching all my morlocks getting shoted 1 by 1 at the start of a turn.

    By the way, you seem to like the sin-eaters. I lean toward the reaktion because I like hackers and always have support for him (plus it is much more cheaper). Does the sin-eater worth it? His cost (and CAP!) plus being useless in active turn always discourage me.
     
  19. inane.imp

    inane.imp Well-Known Member

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    Neither of the main lists I posted have an Engineer or a Hacker with Supportware. They do have a Dr (to support the Grrls). This is why I'm going Sin-Eater over Reaktion. I deploy the Dak / Zond to support the Sin-Eater and the Grrls (the preference one way or the other will depend on the table). This, Bravery and the efficiency of the Sin-Eater from T1 (zero need to support them) is why I've been running them a bit recently.

    In your Z&P version the Reaktion is a MUCH better choice because you can support it properly. Having the Reaktion in there as a swing gun (does both attack and defence) opens up the options available to you. I'm a big fan of Reaktions (Z&P, 2 x Transductors, Reaktion is a staple of many of my lists).

    The 'starter' version I posted can happily run a Reaktion instead of the Sin-Eater by upgrading the Moderator Paramedic to a Hacker. The reason I didn't is that would involve buying the REMs box: it's an obvious way to grow that list though.
     
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  20. bona

    bona Active Member

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    I find Uber’s love orders so it’s hard to have enough to feed two of them.


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