Bakunin has been my faction of choice for the last year, and I'm getting really comfy with their toolbox configurations. Zoe/Pi/Riots links have been getting serious work done for me: I could confidently take one list to most tourneys with those toolbox units and know it will do well for most opponents/missions. Camo lists, Tohaa 'matesbuggery, chainrifle hordes, hard HI, I'm pretty sure I can deal with all of them... ...except the Double Bearpodes and the Avatar builds, the bogeymen of ITS these days it seems. Problem is I've only faced Bearpodes once, single Bear, and haven't fought an Avatar since N3. My new-ish local meta lacks players who play those tactics so my first chance to "practice" against Bears/N4 Avatar will probably be live at a tourney in March. [Players of those lists, I could particularly use -your- feedback!] So my second list will be focused on those matchups. Thus a request to you, fellow forumites: Help me figure out what configuration of Bakunin can best deal with both Bears-Squared and Avatar. The list should also be okay with playing Supplies, Capture/Protect, or Highly Classified. There's a 12-point SpecOp allowed. Below is the first draft I've got so far. My general Bakunin style is to use Riots to take punches and waste opposing orders, then counterattack with either the Riots themselves, or a secondary unit (GML, Ubers, even Zeros). In the list below the Riots are pure bait, for either charging Bears or a shooting Avatar. I'll use them for objectives too if they live. I also lean on Uberfalls a lot, using them to either alpha or to threaten and then suck up opposing orders used to kill them. Bears and Avatar seem like a -great- excuse to take 2x Uberfalls. Warbands with Eclipse seem like the best way to close with the Avatar, and I think I rate the Chimera against a Bear in CC even in the reactive given her Viral CC weapon and Total Immunity. If I'm alphastriking with Ubers, one will likely die on the way in, so I'll leave the second to threaten and then transfer it into Group 1. Also if I deploy one set of Ubers (the Group 2 set), the Bears or Avatar will probably deploy as far from it as possible... so I'd drop the second set of them there. Zoe and Pi-Well are there to provide a Jammer for close-in threats (bears esp), help me deal with Bit and Kiss, and increase hacking presence on the Avatar. The Spec-Op is also a hacker, and there's a KHD on a Zero, all to give me a shot hacking against CA. Against Kosmo I guess they're just specialists. [I thought about going with GML, but figured it would be useless against the Bears or Avatar themselves.] Finally there's Group 2, which is essentially ablative. The Taskmaster/Morlocks are a further CC threat that might have a shot against a Bear due to high Burst in CC, and same shooting an Avatar as they close in (or just smoke and rush closer). My one structural/orders distribution question is whether adding one order to Group 2 might be wise, leaving Group 1 at 9 troops so I can juggle the second Uberfalls unit in easier, or to give them/the Taskmaster more orders to close in. The Minelayer would go in Group 2 in that case I guess. But it also robs that first Uberfall of an order, which might be really needed to close with an Avatar with an alphastrike. Bromads, have you dealt with double bears or Avatar using Bakunin (or Bakunin units at least)? What worked and what didn't? CA/Kosmo players, do you think this has a shot at taking down double bears or Avatar, either going first or second? What shortcomings or strengths do you see in this? ────────────────────────────────────────────────── GROUP 1 9 1 1 CHIMERA Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Viral CC Weapon, Pistol. (0 | 20) 3X PUPNIK DA CC Weapon. (0 | 3) ZOE (Hacker) Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0.5 | 35) Π-WELL SYNC E/Marat, Pitcher, Jammer / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-6). (0 | 10) ZONDBOT PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 3) ZERO (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Shock Mines, Flash Pulse / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 20) ZERO (Minelayer) Combi Rifle, Shock Mines / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 20) RIOT GRRL Missile Launcher / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 32) RIOT GRRL Boarding Shotgun ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 29) MODERATOR Combi Rifle, Pitcher / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-6). (0 | 10) MODERATOR (Lieutenant) Combi Rifle / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-6). (0 | 9) MODERATOR Combi Rifle / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-6). (0 | 9) MODERADOR VORTEX (Infinity Spec-Ops) (WIP:14, BTS:6, Hacking Device(Hacker), Doctor(MediKit), Minelayer(Shock Mines)) Combi Rifle / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-6). (0 | 10) GROUP 2 2 3 3 ZERO (Hacker, Killer Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Shock Mines ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 22) CHIMERA Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Eclipse Grenades / Viral CC Weapon, Pistol. (0 | 20) 3X PUPNIK DA CC Weapon. (0 | 3) TASKMASTER Heavy Machine Gun, Shock Mines / Heavy Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (1.5 | 48) MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Assault Pistol, AP CC Weapon. (0 | 6) MORLOCK Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, E/M CC Weapon. (0 | 6) 4 SWC | 299 Points Open in Infinity Army
I think you've already got it figured out. Don't know of a better Bear- and Avatar-stopper than the Überfallkommando.
Sorry for going off-topic, but has anyone tried Aida in vanilla as a roadblock for Bears? I was looking for something to deal with the Bears and noticed her. I have used her few times, but haven't actually played against Ariadna. Those Viral Mines could hurt the Bear. Even if you are not facing Bears she still has Mimetism (-3), FD (4'), MA2 and Booty (I like booty, the more you play things with Booty, like Bandits, the more you get something useful from it ^^'). In a worst case scenario when she dies to a Warband she is still 0 SWC Minelayer (the FTO profile).
She's ace but not for the mines. The bear dodges on 16s or something ridiculous before mods. Mines seem to be nearly useless in n4, lots of ways to just dodge them or trigger them with something that doesn't care (warcor, palbot or warband with high dodge) You're taking her for the viral pistol. If the bear goes beserk you auto hit it in CC with viral pistol and you choose it to make it either dodge into CC or eat a viral pistol shot if it chain rifles you. I wish we had major lunah, msv and viral sniper is ultimate in bear hunting tech!
Looks good. Don't forget that avatar lists generally compromise on quality bodies so you should be able to find openings and weak troops to hunt. Killing the avatar is a toughy, but slicing it's order pools is very doable. Bran is a good aggressive piece for disrupting weak backline troops, or getting a good attack run in on the avatar itself if board allows it. Infiltrate up the board, go stab stuff, punch a hole and put him on the backfoot a bit. The avatar is a very aggressive piece so if you can get him fighting in his own half of the table, it relieves pressure off your backline
In my experience as a Kosmoflot player, Bears are Distraction Carnifexes - I don't use my bears to achieve objectives. They're there to sow chaos while other parts of my list do their jobs. If you try to stay out of their way and don't feed them, I find them to run out of steam pretty quickly.
Interested to hear how your tournament went, if it already happened. You've got most of what I'd suggest in here. the morloc with E/M CCW has got to be one of the best threats against the avatar. when it rolls 8-4 move its an absolute avatar killer. Not a must but I'd consider swapping the BSG tinbot to a combi rife blitzen. The blitzen maintains threats against the avatar if/when the missile goes down. The combi with a visor in suppressive is good bear defense. as of the recent update: The multi marksman rifle orphan with MSV. New bran profile with breaker combi seems built for hunting bears and useful, as always in cleaning out the avatar's order batteries.
