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Alternative Tohaa Lists

Discussion in 'Tohaa' started by Thaddius, Jan 10, 2018.

  1. Thaddius

    Thaddius Well-Known Member

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    I’m looking for ideas on alternative lists. My list traditionally have been max SWC units coupled with a strong long range ARO/Active presence.

    I’d like to switch it up again and am wanting some ideas. I’m toying around with the idea of pre-h3n3 units + symbiomates because I’m that kind of person. I’m not adverse to sukeuls. I think they’re great units but don’t want them to be the stand out feature.

    This has been my experimental list. Was designed for the Grid but this is where my mind is going. B good to have other people’s ideas.

    [​IMG] Grid 2

    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────


    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]4

    [​IMG] GAO-RAEL Sniper Rifle / Pistol, CCW. (1 | 31)

    [​IMG] KAELTAR (Chain of Command) Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse + 2 SymbioMates / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 21)

    [​IMG] MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CCW. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] SUKEUL Lieutenant (Forward Observer) K1 Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)

    [​IMG] SAKIEL (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Nimbus Plus Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 19)

    [​IMG] MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] SAKIEL (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Nimbus Plus Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 19)

    [​IMG] MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CCW. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 13)

    [​IMG] KERAIL PRECEPTOR Submachine Gun, Smoke Grenades + 2 Surda SymbioBeasts / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 28)

    [​IMG] [​IMG] SURDA SYMBIOBEAST Pulzar / Viral CCW. (0 | 8)


    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG]1

    [​IMG] CLIPSOS (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25)

    [​IMG] KAELTAR (Chain of Command) Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse + 2 SymbioMates / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 21)

    [​IMG] CLIPSOS Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 26)

    [​IMG] KERAIL PRECEPTOR Submachine Gun, Smoke Grenades + 1 Surda SymbioBeast / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 20)

    [​IMG] [​IMG] SURDA SYMBIOBEAST Pulzar / Viral CCW. (0 | 8)

    [​IMG] DIPLOMATIC DELEGATE (iKohl L1, Specialist Operative) Nanopulser, Flash Pulse / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 5)


    3 SWC | 299 Points


    Open in Infinity Army
     
  2. ChoTimberwolf

    ChoTimberwolf Artichoken Friend

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    Not quite sure what you want. If you want to try something different than usually, go through Tohaa units and look which units you rarely take (Gao-Tarsos? Bombs? etc) if you want to try a list that has little long range and more small range your list looks ok maybe try to get some shotguns in (igao etc)
     
  3. Thaddius

    Thaddius Well-Known Member

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    Short ranged was the plan without defaulting to Rasail's. I have tried the Gao Tarsos/Mutans but can't seem to get them to work in a competitive setting.

    I guess my aim would be to get a short range low SWC list that is competitive. I don't want to be mashing around units but I guess you cant get units to work unless you try
     
  4. ChoTimberwolf

    ChoTimberwolf Artichoken Friend

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    Ah ok so with this list you would use gao-rael with smoke trick to take out the annoying enemy aro pieces or use eclipse to get close enough for your combis to actually work?
    I would maybe try to take a kotail with E/M to have another tool vs heavy armor units
     
  5. Abrilete

    Abrilete Well-Known Member

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    Something different... have you tried Camo Spam?
    We are not Ariadna, nor Nomads, but three Minelayer Clipsos + two Igaos are fun to use from time to time. Add a Taqeul to the list and the oponent will have troubles approaching the places you decide to protect.

    I'll probably try something like that this weekend.
     
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  6. Flipswitch

    Flipswitch Sepsitorised by Intent

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    [​IMG] Tohaa - 30.12-B
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] TAQEUL Lieutenant (Advanced Command) Spitfire, SymbioBugs / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 40)
    [​IMG] TAQEUL (Chain of Command) Viral Combi Rifle, SymbioBugs / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 40)
    [​IMG] GAO-RAEL Spitfire / Pistol, CCW. (1.5 | 33)
    [​IMG] KOSUIL Engineer Boarding Shotgun, D-Charges, Panzerfaust / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 24)
    [​IMG] MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CCW. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] KERAIL PRECEPTOR Submachine Gun, Smoke Grenades + 1 Surda SymbioBeast / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 20)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] SURDA SYMBIOBEAST Pulzar / Viral CCW. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] CLIPSOS (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25)
    [​IMG] CHAKSA AUXILIAR Smart Heavy Rocket Launcher / Pistol, CCW. (1 | 15)
    [​IMG] KAAURI Sentinel Submachine Gun, 2 Nanopulsers, Nullifier / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 12)
    [​IMG] KAAURI Sentinel Submachine Gun, 2 Nanopulsers, Nullifier / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 12)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4
    [​IMG] CLIPSOS (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25)
    [​IMG] KAELTAR (Chain of Command) Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse + 2 SymbioMates / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 21)
    [​IMG] CHAKSA AUXILIAR (Baggage, Sensor) Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] CHAKSA AUXILIAR (Baggage, Sensor) Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 10)

    5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Is one that has been workin gwell for me, lots of area denial makes for great board control.
     
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  7. sorniak

    sorniak Well-Known Member

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    Played with 5 camo troopers and 7 camo on table :) .... Vs quapu qhalki...and I wasn't satisfied. Most of work performed my for always pushing triad with Sukeul FO+Makaul+Sakiel(Paramedic). Couldn't make work my infiltriation markers well. Were either blocked by yuan-yuan nearby (my opponent had 3 of those), Igao got a crit from yuan in CC :( ... Djanbazans either successfully discovered everything or were very careful not getting to close + al'hawwas blocked lots of ways with their boardings :(....
    There was a funny moment though... My opponent used his djanbazans to diffuse tohaa minefield. Thanks to armor and shock immuninty + good doctor in a link that was a reliable strategy :) Died two times from mines and was brought back to life by doctor.

    Generally - I've noticed camo spam tactics suffers greatly if opponent has lots of cheap chain rifle impeteous troops and several own camo markers with mines. So, can conclude - it might be very powerful or very bad if a good counter is met. 50% / 50% IMHO

    [​IMG] Tohaa
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] CLIPSOS Minelayer Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 25)
    [​IMG] CLIPSOS Boarding Shotgun, Nullifier / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 23)
    [​IMG] IGAO Boarding Shotgun, Stun Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 25)
    [​IMG] IGAO Boarding Shotgun, Stun Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 25)
    [​IMG] KERAIL PRECEPTOR Submachine Gun, Smoke Grenades + 1 Surda SymbioBeast / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0 | 20)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] SURDA SYMBIOBEAST Pulzar / Viral CCW. (0 | 8)
    [​IMG] SAKIEL Paramedic (Medikit) Combi Rifle, Nimbus Plus Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 20)
    [​IMG] SUKEUL Lieutenant (Forward Observer) K1 Combi Rifle, D-Charges / Pistol, Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 32)
    [​IMG] MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CCW. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] CHAKSA AUXILIAR (Baggage, Sensor) Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] CHAKSA AUXILIAR (Baggage, Sensor) Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 10)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] GAO-RAEL Sniper Rifle / Pistol, CCW. (1 | 31)
    [​IMG] KAELTAR (Chain of Command) Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse + 2 SymbioMates / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 21)
    [​IMG] KAMAEL Paramedic (Medikit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    [​IMG] DIPLOMATIC DELEGATE (iKohl L1, Specialist Operative) Nanopulser, Flash Pulse / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 5)
    [​IMG] CLIPSOS Minelayer Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 25)

    3 SWC | 299 Points

    Open in Infinity Army
     
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  8. Thaddius

    Thaddius Well-Known Member

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    Interesting list. I agree that MSV can always cause camo/odd trouble. It is after all what it is designed for and a hard counter that isn't good at what is does isn't much of a counter at all.

    I do like what is has though. I will be experimenting with something of the sort. Thanks very much.
     
  9. Thaddius

    Thaddius Well-Known Member

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    Taquel and SHRL are things I rarely use. I like that the lists has FO's but am never certain of a SHRL given that it isn't actually very good at taking on armour. Having said that it does sufficently well against a lot of HI given that it's Fire 14. Having said that I would've rather AP+DA that other factions seem to get. To me like many Tohaa things it suffers from pre H3N3 Sukeul ML.

    I do like the thought of a double Taquel though and can definitely see how combined with Chaksa it can be absolutely deadly.
     
  10. Flipswitch

    Flipswitch Sepsitorised by Intent

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    Try the list out mate! That many DTWs and Bugs forces enemies back and they end up bunched up in bottlenecks for the SML.
     
  11. Flipswitch

    Flipswitch Sepsitorised by Intent

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    I actually played vs a Joan Hospitaller fire team with it tonight and forcing them to make saves with the Hrl helps. Bagged two of them which helped break them apart for the Kosuil!
     
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  12. Thaddius

    Thaddius Well-Known Member

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    Yeah the SHRL is good. I'm always struggling to see how they work against core link teams Especially HI. Do you manage to catch them clumped together or do you FO them and indirectly shoot their faces? I always fine core knight and riot grrl links a pain and having an SHRL is tempting but you gotta get them FO'd first which can be problematic
     
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  13. Flipswitch

    Flipswitch Sepsitorised by Intent

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    Yeah i took the risk of forward observing one with the Clipsos and managed to catch 3 of them with the template. Took 5 orders over 2 turns or so but did the job. The list struggles vs Hi spam but can do it.
     
  14. Magonus

    Magonus Well-Known Member

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    I've had good luck with SHRL Chaksas, but then I've had good luck with Chaksas in general.

    Here's a fun one:

    [​IMG] camaspam
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] NIKOUL Minelayer Viral Sniper Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 30)
    [​IMG] NIKOUL Minelayer Viral Sniper Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 30)
    [​IMG] IGAO Boarding Shotgun, Stun Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 25)
    [​IMG] IGAO Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Stun Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 27)
    [​IMG] RASAIL Lieutenant Spitfire + 1 Chaksa Peripheral / Pistol, Knife. (2 | 39)
    [​IMG] [​IMG] CHAKSA PERIPHERAL Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (- | 4)
    [​IMG] KAELTAR (Chain of Command) Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse + 2 SymbioMates / Pistol, Electric Pulse. (0.5 | 21)
    [​IMG] KAMAEL Paramedic (Medikit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    [​IMG] MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CCW. (0 | 13)
    [​IMG] CLIPSOS Minelayer Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 25)
    [​IMG] CLIPSOS (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25)
    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]3 [​IMG]1
    [​IMG] CHAKSA AUXILIAR (Baggage, Sensor) Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] CHAKSA AUXILIAR (Baggage, Sensor) Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 10)
    [​IMG] CLIPSOS (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 25)
    [​IMG] DIPLOMATIC DELEGATE (iKohl L1, Specialist Operative) Nanopulser, Flash Pulse / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 5)
    6 SWC | 299 Points
    Open in Infinity Army
     
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  15. Safetyfirst

    Safetyfirst Member

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    Ive been running 6x makual, 4 x Chaksa auxiliar, Kamael F/O's as the base of alot of my lists at the moment. It makes for a solid backbone for both short ranged rambo lists and close combat lists as it gives you both, a platform to create two large order pools and redundant support units to back up your Rambos. A triad of 2x Makual, 1x kamael f/o in each order pool is a multi-task cheer leader unit that is super effective at short Range. Been running 2 kotails for my Rambos, one spitfire, one BSG. But for medium fire fights Sakiels + V.rifles are also great value.

    At the moment Im running 3x mine layer Clipsos in my secondary list with the same 6x makual, 4x Chaksa set up. Mainly for zone control, also because my main army is CA Shasvastii lists with 4x shrouded minelayers and I like the value a list can get C.Ordering mines and then having one Clipsos using 3 to 6 orders laying mines.

    Anyhow thats some short ranged lists I usually play. :)
     
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  16. Thaddius

    Thaddius Well-Known Member

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    Tried this list but moved the Clipsos into the same group. Was interesting to have the Taqeul and they worked much better than I had expected. I might change around the Spitfire Taqeul for a Rasail. Mission was frontline so movement was needed especially later game. I could very much feel the 4-2 move. I knew they would be a bit more resilient and the Regen on 13's is dam good.

    Didn't manage to get the win though it did force me to try new things. I should've used the SHRL as an aro piece later game when I know I wasn't going to be sinking orders into FOing then guiding shots down. The coordinating was a bit strange but the surpressive fire corridors that were locked down did what they were supposed to. Definitely given me an appreciation for dedicated resources into coordinating Kaauri. Thanks muchly
     
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  17. Obeisance

    Obeisance Well-Known Member

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    Are people getting much work out of less common models?

    Gao Rael, Igao, Kotail, Kerail or Krakot?

    Speaking of atypical lists.

    Tell me about how they're performing for you.
     
  18. Thaddius

    Thaddius Well-Known Member

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    I find I use those units quite a bit but there are many that I wouldn't use.

    The Gao Rael Sniper (Some people also spitfire), and Kerail get a lot of table time for me. They will make most of my lists. They don't have to be used together as throwing regular smoke for MSV2 is always fun.

    The Kerail double sundra symbiobeasts is a tool kit unit. There is really little that this unit cannot do/take out. It's a great sweeper unit and if the opportunity presents itself can be a mean alpha striker.

    Krakot are always good. Krakot's access to regular grenades really adds a lot for Tohaa I feel. though for the points you're competing against the cheap Kaauri and Chaksa HFT. All which are good and fulfil slightly different purpose though they all have DTW's which is great.

    Kotail is good but I would consider what your plan/purpose for it may be. Symbiomates attached to a Kotail will telegraph which one is real. Having said that the echoes can still be used to trap in perimeter weapons which is useful. My issue with it is it doesn't synergise well with other units. That is you need to spend orders to bring up it's support. I find them harder to use.

    The Igao is always a favourite of mine. Being able to -12 in CC with this murder beast is pretty damn funny. There are times though a Clipsos minelayer is better but it does depend if you want/need a camo unit midfield.
     
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  19. Obeisance

    Obeisance Well-Known Member

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    Oops, I meant Gar Tsaros, not Gao Rael. =P
     
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  20. Abrilete

    Abrilete Well-Known Member

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    The Gao-Tarsos is a very good parachuist, I'd say one of the best of the game. One problem is that it's not cheap, 1/10th of your list for a trooper that will not be in the table when you start the game (thus, not giving Orders) and maybe you'll keep it in reserve till the third turn. The other problem is that we rarely ever bring hackers, so deploying with the teamplate is very risky and not worth it (so you are paying for a skill you won't use).

    Anyway, I use it from time to time (always Paramedic or Boarding Shotgun), and rarely ever disapoints me. Being able to survive one unlucky ARO is great for a parachuist (sometimes is very difficult to get to a good position and you'll face several ARO's at the same time), and CD12 PH12 ARM3 are good values for Tohaa.
     
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