It would be great, imho, if it were allowed to take the second Haris fireteam, instead of the Core fireteam. In my army you can take 1 Core and 1 Hairs, but I want to take 2 Haris. At the same time, I cannot create an incomplete Core to get my second Hairs, due to the fact that the fireteam I need does not have the keyword 'Core'. For example - Harris Gwailo and Haris Cutthroats in Shasvasti
Heartily seconded! The hard part will be explaining the either/or logic of Core and Haris OR 2x Haris in a clear fashion. I’m guessing a desire to avoid that kind of complexity as much as possible is why this option wasn’t included in the Fireteams update.
It is also something Corvus belli could have been doing consciously to limit some strong Haris team options, but I do not think Shasvastii's options have anything to do with that.
What Harises would you say are strong enough that they need to be limited to one-only like that? I can't think of any, including the TAG-harises. Points/SWC cost tend to be limiting factors there.
This sounds likely to me. Maybe a line in the fireteam rules saying something like "An army's allocation of Core fireteams can optionally be spent on Haris fireteams instead.". I get wanting to avoid confusing exceptions to rules, but there's still plenty of other hidden nuggets in the fireteam rules. I'd love this change, a couple of my factions have far more interesting haris options than cores after the 2022 fireteam changes.
Haris that cannot be duplicated at the moment: MO White Banner This could be the only abuse seen... Caledonia USAriadna TAK Kosmo QK Ramah Corregidor Bakunin Tunguska Morat Shas OSS JSA Ikari List does not end here.... But there is so little space for abuse that i don't see why it should not be done. Some armies already have access to 2 Haris (could become 3 with this), some would REALLY gain in flexibility...
Nope... If a Fireteam is HARIS/CORE yuo can already field a Haris Fireteam (3 models) and a Core Fireteam (3 models). Core are still valid from 3 to 5 models on creation. Duo must be 2, Haris must be 3.
Sorry but not a good idea to me. What is the point? Oh yeah to have an advantage. But when everyone has an advantage, is it any more? And having limitations are good. It's something that kinda defines a sectoral.
It'd be for fun and list variety, not an advantage. I'd love to take a bike haris and a blackjack haris in USAriadna, because they're a lot more fun than taking 4 dudes with small guns and 1 dude with a big gun every game. It'd probably be a weaker list for most missions than just taking an UKR core, but I'd enjoy the option
Has it been tested? A lot of players suggest rule changes without testing it. What seems good on paper doesn't always work in practice.
i guess the idea is that if a team is limited to duo/haris it is that it would be too good as a core. if a team is allowed to be a core, then it is not that good without the full bonus. So if you take a haris at his max allowed strength (3-men) and also take a core at a reduced 3-men size; then everything is fine. But if you take two 3-men haris then you are probably getting something better than above where you were taking two 3-men teams of 1 haris and 1 core. I was originally fine with the OP idea; thinking two 3-men teams (haris, core) was equivalent to taking two 3-men teams (haris, haris). But as I wrote above, I think CB might actually consider them as not equivalent; and I would understand that (and somewhat agree too).
In addition to my comment on sectorals would be that Tohaa would not be unique if everyone can do several 3-man teams like them.
False equivalency. 2 Harises (and zero Cores as the cost of having 2 Harises) is kot NEARLY as powerful as 3-4 Harises. Also Steel Phalanx exist. As do the other 2 factions that can field multiple Harises now. Tohaa’s exclusive advantage is undercosted second wounds, plus the continuing bullcrap that is SymbioMates/Bombs. Having lots of fireteams has not been their unique advantage for some time.
Yes, 2 Harises (at the cost of getting 0 Cores) should be playtested. No, it is not likely to lead to any concentration of force or order-efficiency that exceeds the range that is already readily available in existing Core/Haris splits. Please, if you’re going to talk about potential abuse or overoptimization from 2x Haris (and 0 Core with that), do point out which specific teams are a problem if you get 2 of them (and 0 Core). Be specific, not vague when considering rules change effects, including advising caution. Fortunately the team most likely to get out of hand (Shaolin/Liang) is limited by requiring a special character. Morlock/Taskmaster teams have the high cost per Wound of the Taskmaster to balance them out. Shas Harises are all potentially really cool, and choked out by the desperate need for a visor. Shas would have a lot more interesting small-team options available if they could do 2x Haris, but again not outside the existing power range. A Jayth team or second Gwailo haris has nothing on Sheskiin with a backup team of Nox.
Tohaa/Spiral players can create 1-5 harris fireteams - this is a unique mechanic for army. Morat/Onyx/Svala/IS/ForCo players can create 2 Harris and 1 core fireteams at the same time. Usually, Harris members have high cost, so, this is a balance. You can use cheap members for creat a CORE with all bonuses (but at a cost of 1 harris), and one high cost harris, or create two high cost harris
And yet how many Tohaa player play more than three haris, maybe four haris? Admitedly it's been a long time since I've played pure Tohaa but I don't remember more than 3.
