Template Attacks vs. Civilians N5

Discussion in 'Rules' started by Danimoth, Jun 26, 2025.

  1. Danimoth

    Danimoth New Member

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    upload_2025-6-26_17-31-6.jpeg

    The rule states I am not allowed to declare an attack against neutral units, but goes on tostate that if when I declare such an attack, it is cancelled.

    upload_2025-6-26_17-32-10.png

    Civilian rule last point states that it is not cancelled, but rather the civilian is not effected. Does this mean, that the RAW is that I can not declare an attack that will effect the civilian at all, as per the main rule's first sentence. Or does it mean that I can declare, it.. It goes on to be cancelled, and is not cancelled finally as per the Civilian rule's last bullet-point?
     
  2. Iskandar

    Iskandar Well-Known Member

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    No it says you can't declare attacks against Allied or Neutral Troopers.

    So it's not cancelled but the Civilian is just not effected by the template but everyone else is.
     
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  3. iKon

    iKon Not Very Well-Known Member

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    It specifically is cancelled? "Therefore, if when declaring an Attack with a Template Weapon, an Allied or Neutral Trooper would be affected by the Template, that shot is cancelled"
     
  4. iKon

    iKon Not Very Well-Known Member

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    Lets go step by step.

    You can not declare an attack that would include a civilian.

    That you are not permitted to declare the attack if the template would include a civilian in the area of effect you just can't declare it so you must declare something else if the template can't be placed in a way that it won't contact the civilian.

    The next bit need to be there because of involuntary templates (I can only think of Explode off the top of my head) if you meet the criteria for explode and a civilian is effected then the entire Explode is cancelled so nobody is effected.

    The only thing I don't quite get the reasoning for is what template weapon doesn't have a PS or cause states?
     
  5. Tristan228

    Tristan228 Bakunin's best Morlock trainer
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    Screenshot_20250627_073757_Firefox.jpg
    Civilian:
    • Game element with attributes? :+1:
    • Belongs to the army list of any player? :-1:
    • Can spend Orders? :-1:
    So by this definition a Civilian doesn't actually count as a Trooper. It is Neutral, but not a Neutral Trooper.
     
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  6. tox

    tox SorriBarai
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    You can declare a Template Attack agaisnt Enemy Model A, while a Civilian is under the template too. The attack is not cancelled, but the Civilian is unaffected.

    You CANNOT declare a Template Attack agaist a Civilian, while an Enemy Camo Marker is under the template too. The Civilian is not a legal target.
     
  7. iKon

    iKon Not Very Well-Known Member

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    Since it is not a Trooper can I declare an attack that includes one of my own camo markers that just happens to be a mine?
     
  8. Tristan228

    Tristan228 Bakunin's best Morlock trainer
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    The camouflaged state itself forbids to declare attacks against Camouflaged Markers.
     
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  9. iKon

    iKon Not Very Well-Known Member

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    What if there is a valid enemy target though?
     
  10. tox

    tox SorriBarai
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    You CANNOT shot to an allied whatsoever.
     
  11. iKon

    iKon Not Very Well-Known Member

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    it seems like that rule is limited to friendly troopers.

    Say you chain rifle an enemy but your friendly mine is in the way what rule kicks in to prevent the mine taking a save?
     
  12. wes-o-matic

    wes-o-matic Meme List Addict

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    Another way to put it: Is an enemy safe from my Guided Missiles because he’s standing right next to my deployed Repeater, since the Repeater is a friendly (to me) game element, or does that restriction only apply to Troopers? What about when the enemy is standing next to my Armed Turret?
     
  13. Quiet Professional

    Quiet Professional HI enthusiast

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    Intuitive attacks can be performed but only if the weapon has it in its stats. But a WIP roll must be successful to allow the template to hit.
     
  14. tox

    tox SorriBarai
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    That you cannot attack any allied element or the game breaks.
    It has been a known issue for several editions, never fully addressed but it has always been indicated to be played in that way.
     
  15. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    The key words here are Civilian and Trooper. Allied/Friendly troops stops anything from happening at all. Civilians can't be hurt at all. Preventing using a civilian as a shield. Mines, Repeaters, etc. are Equipment. Regardless of yours or theirs, it can be effected by templates because they are neither Civilian or Trooper.
     
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