1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Sectorials vs. Vanilla

Discussion in 'Access Guide to the Human Sphere' started by burlesford, Apr 23, 2022.

  1. Urobros

    Urobros Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,790
    Likes Received:
    1,380
    I totally forget about O-12, but you are absolutely right!! O-12 is amazing and far better than Starmada.

    Wh

    @Gwynbleidd if you have the chance take at least one game with Acontecimento, they have now some really interesting fireteams.
    I saw some of you guys using now Uma, is she worthy? I tried her a couple of times but I haven't much success with the infiltrator profile.

    btw what are the issue with Jan Star? I found a "mediocre" profile, the advantage is one more wound but not having 2 impersonators states.
     
    Gwynbleidd likes this.
  2. Teslarod

    Teslarod when in doubt, Yeet

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes Received:
    4,864
    If you're that concerned about Pitchers build a list to deal with it.
    Or just tough it out. Joan is WIP15, if you want the first turn odds are you either win the roll or your opponent might feel safe in their castle and the mission technically rewards going 2nd. Bring an Echo Bravo Wildparrot, some GLs, Krakots/Diggers with Nades, Tik, Uma or other options to smoke that Pitcher out before it becomes a problem. It's probably 1W ARM1, same for a potential ML Bot.
    Alternatively go for a bait list. Joan V2 non Lt and a Swiss ML waiting for anyone who wants to try to get into 24+8" range of your Joan almost hugging the back of the DZ. With a little luck you get to frag a whole Link walking into position for their Pitcher.
    The KothS CoC was almost made to deal with that kind of problem.

    Sometimes that stupid Pitcher strat works. Sometime the Flashpulse Bot stuns your TAG. Sometimes Achilles burns to death against one Flamer hit after failing a Dodge. That's the game.
    LOL is a shit mechanic, but also one Nomads have a worse time dealing with that PanO Vanilla.
    This also isn't the days of Monstrucker, Warcor, Techbee, Helot. 2 Krakots bring 2 Veteran Orders, AVA2 ABH Bikers can use their own Irregular Orders extremely well. A Turn in LOL isn't an automatic death sentence.
     
    Abrilete and burlesford like this.
  3. csjarrat

    csjarrat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,741
    Likes Received:
    1,844
    Infiltration, Marker state and 2W are literally the most powerful things in the game. Put them all on one profile and you're golden.
    You can pull a lieutenant kill or remove a key piece with minimal order expenditure and you have the durability to tank a mine or template on the way in and have the reliability of going again after taking a wound
     
  4. Gwynbleidd

    Gwynbleidd Non asto coram malo

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2021
    Messages:
    863
    Likes Received:
    1,330
    Oh, I know they’ve got some interesting fireteams, I just can’t play them. Acontecimento was my friends first Infinity army and he has all the models (past and recently OOP) for them so it’s the only panoceania sectorial I can’t do. Same for him with hassassin bahram. That was my first foray into Infinity. Was a steep learning curve… I hope you enjoy playing acontecimento though! I’ve tried Uma a few times and she’s performed relatively well so give her a go if you have the points spare!
     
    Urobros likes this.
  5. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    5,715
    Likes Received:
    6,472
    That plan doesn't work at all, they know it's not Joan the second the LT roll happens because the WIP is open information now and there's no way to obfuscate Joan's WIP 15.
     
    Savnock, burlesford and Hecaton like this.
  6. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,279
    Likes Received:
    1,936
    Open Lt WIP is one of the most obviously terrible changes going in to N4. It still surprises me that they haven't rolled that one back.
     
  7. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,279
    Likes Received:
    1,936
    I'm not saying it's the worst change going into N4. There are bigger problems (and I say this being generally positive in my view of N4). The point here being that the change to Open Lt WIP being bad shouldn't have surprised anyone. It's not like it's a matter of hard to discern case studies that are going to highlight the problems there. There are plenty of issues with the state of the game that might be hard to recognize in those early design stages, but this one may as well have been a massive, flashing neon sign.
     
    Savnock and Abrilete like this.
  8. RobertShepherd

    RobertShepherd Antipodean midwit

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2018
    Messages:
    2,048
    Likes Received:
    4,191
    It's an interesting one. I sympathise with the move to open Lt WIP from a broad design perspective - it's analogous to how every M:tG card that lets you search a deck has a clause requiring you to then reveal the card to your opponent, simply because without that the opportunity for misplays (ok, cheating) would be rife.

    But at the same time, infinity is a game with explicit rules about private information and therefore a strong alternate construct for handling hidden lieutenant WIP. They could equally easily have used that as a framework, e.g. with a requirement to recording list decision before Lt roll, for example.

    That said, I don't find open lieutenant WIP to actually be a significant issue for me in any of my usual factions (nomads, haqq, tohaa, combined, yu jing, ariadna) - it's a minor list consideration occasionally at most but usually not an issue. But I get it bugs some people.
     
    Savnock, Daniel Darko and Diphoration like this.
  9. Diphoration

    Diphoration Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2018
    Messages:
    1,349
    Likes Received:
    2,533
    I think Nomads actually suffer from this the most, but I also find it's rather inconsequential for the most time as figuring out LT (even in N3) has alway been pretty trivial.

    I've always played obvious LT in every faction that I've every played, so it doesn't really affect me either.
     
    RobertShepherd likes this.
  10. Weathercock

    Weathercock Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,279
    Likes Received:
    1,936
    I view it from two main points. First off, I've dealt with some frustration in dealing with Lt options in ISS. Granted, most ISS Lts kick their own share of ass, and CoC is easier to fit into that sectorial than ever before, but there are some shell games that are taken completely off the table because of it now.

    The other is that it makes things more difficult for newer players to catch up. For a player that already knows what most factions have available, identifying a possible Lt based on potential WIP values is pretty easy. Conversely, it presents a bit of a knowledge check on newer players from the very first roll of the game. If both players are inexperienced, it's not a big deal, but in a very alpha-strike focused meta, it can serve to widen the gap considerably between an already more skilled opponent, especially since those less skilled players are already more likely to have more holes in their defense.

    Knowledge checks aren't bad in themselves, but this is one that really didn't need to be there in the first place, and just makes it easier to punish new players for being new, in my experience.
     
    Savnock, DaRedOne, Abrilete and 2 others like this.
  11. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2019
    Messages:
    2,213
    Likes Received:
    3,456
    Encouraging the new players to ask their opponents what Lt options they see should solve that problem.
     
  12. DaRedOne

    DaRedOne Morat Warrior Philosopher
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,549
    Likes Received:
    3,629
    It's still a knowledge check. You're just easing the person into the mindset. Nothing wrong with that and I think that's healthy behavior, but doesn't solve the core issue.

    I for one prefer Open LT WIP, but there are some good points on why it should not be so. I really think the game is kinda buckling under its own weight lately, so it's hard to point at one single issue and go 'that. that's the problem'
     
    csjarrat likes this.
  13. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2017
    Messages:
    5,886
    Likes Received:
    11,260
    I think one can express their opinion in a less graphic way.
     
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation