Love the language Ahhh the internet... Don't get me wrong I loved N3 hacking, but the single ability to now spotlight LI/MI guys has just added so much more 'viability' (Hate that word) To taking more than 1 hacker in a list.
It isn't 100% reliable. I mean, if it's a KHD, it should be 100% reliable. If it's not, then the game is broken. Beyond that, the elite Nomad Hackers do what they are supposed to do, both in regards to the fluff and their role on the battlefield. They're extremely difficult to remove in their area of expertise, Hacking, so it's on a player to use a different tool. Coming out of a state with Surprise Attack, hitting them with an E/M weapon, shooting them in the face, etc. The tool we might think/believe/wish we could use for the task may not be the correct one, so rather than continue using it, we find a different one.
However, in seriousness, it's a matter of finding what is the actual right tool for the job, rather than beating your head against a wall trying to use the tool you insist should be the right one, even when it's shown not to be.
So if it worked in N3 it should work in N4? You say there is no AP HMG or K1 for hacking? There is...AP HMGs and k1 work just fine on hackers.
The problem is that hacking warfare is really lacking in the KHD department. Having another program with B1 D15 that ignores firewall mod would't be so bad for the game. At least you have a 30% that a moderator behind a firewall can fail the armor save. The chance to kill him would be lower with the Wip confront, but it' always better than just shooting DAM 14 against BTS 12. A software like that could be a good match with Trinity because both are usefull in the right situation.
It could be interesting, if CB's thought is that there should be a Hacking way to take on an Interventor. If that's not the thought, and the goal is to make you use some other tool to take out an Interventor, especially one sitting behind a Firewall, then nothing needs to be changed. The repeated refrain is that there should be a Hacking way to take out an Interventor or Jazz behind a Firewall, but why?
The idea would be to expand on it so they do actually function as schools of space magic rather than just being a game mechanic of choose whether you cast Spotlight or Oblivion 90% of the time. The formula works well enough in other games allowing for identity despite omnipresence of wizards. It doesn't have to be, I'm just throwing out hypotheticals here. You could make Yu Jing's hacking focus purely on defense and support of their HI, which ties neatly into the HI theme. It's thematic, makes sense, and increases the chance the less advanced hacking faction engages the superior hacking faction, which allows the superior hacking faction to actually roll their factional magic dice and flex their space wizard theme. The alternative is the Yu Jing player puts a mixture of camo markers and warbands on the table and the Nomad player basically doesn't get to hack all game. Sure, it's still balanced and works fine in a competitive sense but it sucks from a gameplay perspective for the Nomad player who put hackers on the table with the desire to hack things. It's definitely a factor. For Ariadna camo spam is both very good just on its own virtues, but is then compounded by the fact that hard countering a top tier threat while simultaneously removing an otherwise hard weakness to your faction just makes it an utter no brainer. Why would you ever not camo spam when this is the case? It doesn't matter how good they make the non camo/warband side of the faction while this is true. The issue extends outside of just Ariadna though. Take Yu Jing and SEF that can both play camo spam/warband spam while also possessing reasonably potent links and non camo solo operators. Right now I see both these factions roll around with hard counters in their pockets for hacking factions. Against other factions? Things like Sheskin, Ye Mao, Mowangs etc come out to play. Drop into WhiteCo, Nomads, or Druze? Those all go back in the box the other list with ALL the camo spam comes right back out and neither player does any meaningful hacking. That's an issue I think CB need to address at some point because their goal was to make hacking more consistently useful, and I only think they managed to succeed partially there. Hacking is more consistently useful if your opponent allows it to be. It's still far too attractive to simply push the game state into a zero hacking situation and more or less just take it out of the game. Indeed I agree the hacking game is enjoyable and strategic when it's between two factions who are on a relatively even footing, and that's exactly the point I'm trying to make about the schools of space magic. When you put everyone on an even footing it creates a more enjoyable game for both sides involved. Right now if your opponent is as you put it, part of the Big Hack and you are not, you're incentivised to in fact just ignore it and throw a hard counter list at them. Neither player gets to hack now and both players lose out on a potentially enjoyable and strategic aspect of the game. The goal of course is to get everyone on an even footing but make them factionally unique, hence the schools of magic. Like I said earlier it's a proven method in various other game systems.
Hacking being binary in utility it''s the main reason Hacking list bring GML to fight LI/MI list. At the same time now with Spotlight the only real counter to GML it's camo and Camo has no counter, and eat Hacking. Side note : GIVE ME A SNIFFER SHOOTER PLZ. This bring me to the point. Hacking need to be usefull in every match-up and every faction should be able to field meaningfull defense (Tin-bot, KHD, putting down repeater) against it. This create a situation where people brings hacker cause they know that they will be usefull OR bring counter to hacking because they are sure they will fight hackers.
Cool. Maybe don't reply to what I'm saying if you don't want to have a discussion. Positive about what? I'm positive when it's warranted. There's not really other venues of discussion.
Nobody's saying this. So keep lying. And sometimes CB cocks it up. I honestly doubt they're aware of the math situation as to how protected Jazz or an interventor can be from KHDs. Infinity is not some perfectly, sublimely balanced masterpiece where the only failure is on the playerbase.
No, I mean hacking programs that have similar utility in the infowar space. Back up and take another run at the question when you understand what I'm talking about.
Because the alternative is that advancing a repeater net is functionally zero risk, like in late N2. I think any claims that CB intended for Interventors behind firewalls to be as durable as they are to KHDs is unsubstantiated.
I understand, it's just a dumb position to take. N4 is different, time to move on. You are beating a dead horse for the 10th time.
The stubborn insistence that a few units, quite powerful in their own sphere and difficult to damage in that sphere, is a flaw in the game is quite interesting. If they could only be affected by Hacking, that would be one thing, but since they can (and quite frequently are) targeted and killed by other elements, why the insistence? Additionally, it seems like a frequent concern is units that don't match/connect with their description in background/fluff. Here are units that do, and now they mesh too well with that background?
Nope. The crit mechanics got changed from N3=>N4 because of how people felt about them, actually ditto with the KHD situation. They're targeted by other elements when the controlling player's game plan collapses. If you were going to lose anyway, it doesn't matter that your Jazz/Interventor/whatever gets killed. And this goes back to what other people are talking about in this thread, that in terms of hacking if you're not at the absolute pinnacle of it you should run a denial strategy and attempt to stop your opponent from playing with their hacking toys. Probably a bit tough for you to understand, though...
Yes, I'm sure your one man crusade to be able to stage dive an Interventor behind a firewall will totally work and not come across as winging at all. Meanwhile, the rest of us will just shoot the bastard.
