1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Kiel-Saan Special Tri

Discussion in 'Spiral Corps' started by Wylde83, Jan 4, 2021.

  1. Teslarod

    Teslarod when in doubt, Yeet

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes Received:
    4,864
    upload_2021-8-20_10-33-2.png

    upload_2021-8-20_10-34-21.png

    Weeeell technically you can take any of the 3 possible options and fill up the rest with Wildcards.
    Doesn't have to be the Kiel-Saan according to the rules :/
    You go by Sectorial Chart, not by Army Profiles.
     

    Attached Files:

    #21 Teslarod, Aug 20, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2021
    Ariwch likes this.
  2. Wylde83

    Wylde83 The Cyberpunk Guy
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2019
    Messages:
    120
    Likes Received:
    487
    Nope you need the Kiel-Saan, he's the only one who brings the special Triad with it , you can make Kiel-Saan with Kaauri Parametic and Keesan if you want but you can't make keesan with 2 Kaauri Paramedics because, keesan has not this skill.. she will make a normal Triad with 2 draals if you want
     
  3. Tristan228

    Tristan228 Bakunin's best Morlock trainer
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,169
    Likes Received:
    2,217
    Ok, then please change the text in Army to something that makes the Kiel-Saan's mandatory participation in the Special Triad unequivocally obvious for anyone using the Army 7 tool
     
    DukeofEarl, Delta57Dash and Ariwch like this.
  4. Teslarod

    Teslarod when in doubt, Yeet

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes Received:
    4,864
    The actual Fireteam from the Fireteam Chart (which is going to take priority over however army is trying to translate this into unit Profiles - see Fireteam Core "Skill" for other shenanigans) used to look like this:
    upload_2021-8-20_11-45-3.png

    Today's version (freshly downloaded from the website) changed this from a Kiel-Saan Fireteam entry to a Kaauri Fireteam entry:
    upload_2021-8-20_11-53-17.png


    Looks to me like @HellLois made an honest mistake because Army is not accurately representing the Fireteam Chart.
    There's absolutely 0 reason why you could not replace the Kiel-Saan with a Wildcard and keep the Draal and Kaauri to keep it legal.
     
  5. HellLois

    HellLois What the Hell...Lois?
    CB Staff

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,537
    Likes Received:
    4,137
    @Teslarod, I was talking only about that fireteam, without the wildcards extras. But yes, the wildcards are there and you can include them always you include at least one of the troopers listed for that Fireteam.

    The sectorial charts you pointed, shows us the possible fireteams options of each Unit. So, can do the Kaauris a special fireteam: Triad? yes, but they need a Kiel-Saan.

    You could swap Kiel-Saan for a wildcard or using the Kaauri as the main trooper, if it weren't for the fact that Kiel-saan is the one that gives you access to that troop listing. So, in order to make that fireteam combination, there has to be one Kiel-saan.
     
  6. Teslarod

    Teslarod when in doubt, Yeet

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes Received:
    4,864
    upload_2021-8-20_12-53-1.png
    This is a Special Fireteam Kaauri nowadays in the Sectorial Chart.
    And that seems to not have been updated in Army as it's still listed as a Kiel-Saan Fireteam there.

    This being a Kaauri Fireteam.
    Couldn't you keep the Draal (because you'll need someone with Triad) and replace the Kiel-Saan with a Wildcard?
     
  7. Stoneman95

    Stoneman95 Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2021
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    48
    The main problem in my opinion is, that there is nowhere stated how to use the "Special Fireteam" skill correctly.
    One solution would be "to form a Special Fireteam Triad/Haris/Core/* a member with Special Fireteam Triad/Haris/Core/* skill is necessary", stated somewhere in the Fireteam rules.
     
  8. HellLois

    HellLois What the Hell...Lois?
    CB Staff

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,537
    Likes Received:
    4,137
    lets see.
    The Kaauris dont have the skill Triad, so they cant be part of an fireteam unless there are a Special Skill, that allows its use. In this case the Kiel-Saan is the one who give the Kaauri the option to be part of that fireteam.

    Ok, the Drall have Fireteam: Triad, soo he can be bart of any fireteam Triad, with troopers with that skill. But the Kaauri doesnt have it.

    I will chat with the team to change this on army and charts.
     
  9. Stoneman95

    Stoneman95 Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2021
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    48
    I found another possible solution.
    You could change Special Fireteam Triad into Special Fireteam Haris, so the Draals Fireteam Triad cannot be used to form this link.

    It will prevent more than 1 Kiel Saan Link though.

    Or you change the Draal to a Wildcard without Fireteam Triad.
     
  10. Tristan228

    Tristan228 Bakunin's best Morlock trainer
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,169
    Likes Received:
    2,217
    What do you think about the following as a provisional ruling?
     
    Wylde83 and DukeofEarl like this.
  11. DukeofEarl

    DukeofEarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,444
    Likes Received:
    1,385
    I would say that would clear up any confusion.
     
    Wylde83 and Tristan228 like this.
  12. Teslarod

    Teslarod when in doubt, Yeet

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes Received:
    4,864
    Doesn't really need a Provisional ruling.
    Army calling it a "Special Fireteam Kiel-Saan" is simply wrong. It was one at some point at N4 release. But was changed and now is a "Special Fireteam Kaauri".
    Legacy army update problem not an actual rule issue.
    This should just list "Special Fireteam Kaauri: ..." under the Kaauri, Draal and Kiel-Saan entry in army.
     
  13. Stoneman95

    Stoneman95 Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2021
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    48
    I understand the Intent as following: Special Fireteam Triad with a Kiel Saan as a mandatory part of it, and with any number of Draals and Kauuris extra.

    That can be achieved in different ways
    Option 1: make the Kiel Saan a "mandatory" member of the link as stated by Tristan
    Problem: term "mandatory"
    It opens the next discussion about "is mandatory overwriteable by for example Wildcards". So a new term in use which then needs more explanations such as "Its not possible to change a mandatory unit in a Fireteam for a wildcard.

    Option 2: Avoid having more than one trooper with suitable FT skill in this specific link.
    Can be achieved through:
    - No more FT skill on FTO Draal, but instead Wildcard.
    Can be solved also by giving the FTO profile Wildcard and keep the Fireteam Triad, but exclude him from the Special Fireteam Text.
    This could lead to other possible fireteams though.
    - Being not a FT Triad anymore, switch to for example either FT Tricore or FT Haris. Comes with the drawback, that then no more than one link at a time can be formed.
     
  14. Tristan228

    Tristan228 Bakunin's best Morlock trainer
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,169
    Likes Received:
    2,217
    The MAF's Oznat & Gaki/Preta core is already an example for this situation. I seems to be clear for the three people playing MAF, that a mandatory trooper can't be substituted by a wildcard. ;) That's why I used this already established term.
     
  15. Stoneman95

    Stoneman95 Well-Known Member
    Warcor

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2021
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    48
    Yeah you're absolutely right!

    So there is the following text used:
    It is compulsory the presence of at least 1 Oznat to compose a Fireteam of Hungries (Gakis and/or Pretas).

    Can we get a change of the sentence to the following version pls:
    The presence of at least 1 Oznat is compulsory to compose a Fireteam of Hungries (Gakis and/or Pretas).

    That would lead to the following text for the Kiel Saan Fireteam situation:
    The presence of at least 1 Kiel Saan is compulsory to compose a Fireteam of Kauuris (or Kiel Saan, depending on the Fireteam Sectorial Chart).


    Btw, very sad that the Oznat/Hungries Fireteam doesnt make the Hungries orders regular anymore.
     
    #35 Stoneman95, Aug 20, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2021
    Tristan228 likes this.
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation