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Yu Jing Fireteams

Discussion in 'Yu Jing' started by Space Ranger, Jun 12, 2019.

  1. Fed4ykin

    Fed4ykin Well-Known Member

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    I would say the monk. He is cheap and has smoke to cover their approach or give other parts of the army smoke if needed.
    Most of the others are better of in bigger teams or don't want to approach the enemy in CQC.
    But thats just my opinion.
     
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  2. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    I agree. Unfortunately her options are limited. Of all of the combos I'd say Shaolin is top. Number 2 would be a Tian Gou. You can have him appear to be one of the more expensive troops to just throw off your opponent. Like have him appear to be a Shang Ji hacker but is actually a TG Jammer. throw him up against a enemy hacker who does an ARO hack and you the Jammer him.

    JQ is already pretty expensive though. That's the main reason why the others are not really that great. It should be her as a wildcard or able to join a specific team like Shona Carrano can. But, shoulda coulda woulda. We have what we have.
     
    #142 Space Ranger, Nov 30, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2020
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  3. Jukebox3113

    Jukebox3113 Highlander

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    I guess the biggest question I have for White Banner is what the mainstay Fireteam: Core. Being as there are only 2 options in WB. Im finding if i want to bring some of the more "fun/ sneaky things" I bring Zhanshi. If I want the Core to do alot of work I bring Shang Ji.
     
  4. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    To my eyes there is only one mainstay and that's Zhanshi. Shang-Ji Core got slightly cheaper going into N4 so it's now possible to make gimmick lists with it, but it's still too expensive to use as a mainstay.
    Yu Jing is a bit funny like that, most other sectorials will take the token Heavy Infantry and skew it cheaper with wildcards; Yu Jing takes a similarly priced HI as the base for a Core and skew it more expensive. IA being a bit of an oddball for having cheap Wildcards.
     
  5. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    I'm mainly seeing the Zhanshi+Shang Ji AP HMG as a "most of the time" core. I've tried making many lists of SJ cores with and without Jujak. They would be fantastic if it wasn't that the rest of the force is also kind of expensive and you end up hurting the rest of the force. To me a SJ core would be for very specific missions where I think the SJ core will be able to be the focus. Like the Armory is fantastic for them.
     
    #145 Space Ranger, Dec 1, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2020
  6. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    I was playing around with Shang Ji core teams. I'm not sure if I like IA or WB more. The WB core is a little faster maybe with Jujak. Guilang are always great.

    Shang Ji core
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]2
    SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) AP Heavy Machine Gun, Chain-colt ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 49)
    SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) Heavy Rocket Launcher, Light Shotgun / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 38)
    SHÀNG JÍ (Hacker, Hacking Device) MULTI Rifle, Chain-colt ( ) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0.5 | 41)
    TAI SHENG Mk12, Chain-colt, Flash Pulse / Heavy Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 40)
    HǍIDÀO (Engineer, Deactivator) Combi Rifle, D-Charges ( | GizmoKit) / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 25)
    ZHĒNCHÁ (Forward Observer) Submachine Gun, Panzerfaust, Shock Mines / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 35)
    Zhanshi YĪSHĒNG Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    YÁOZĂO PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 3)
    DĀOYĪNG (Lieutenant [+1 Order], Hacker, Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun ( ) / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 30)
    SON-BAE Yaókòng Missile Launcher / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (1.5 | 16)
    CHAĪYÌ Yaókòng Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 7)
    5 SWC | 299 Points
    Open in Infinity Army


    SJ core
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]9 [​IMG]2
    SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) AP Heavy Machine Gun, Chain-colt ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 49)
    SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) Heavy Rocket Launcher, Light Shotgun / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 38)
    SHÀNG JÍ (Hacker, Hacking Device) MULTI Rifle, Chain-colt ( ) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0.5 | 41)
    JUJAK (Engineer, Deactivator) Boarding Shotgun, Panzerfaust, D-Charges ( | GizmoKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 30)
    JUJAK (Lieutenant) Combi Rifle, Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 26)
    GŬILÁNG (Hacker, Hacking Device) Combi Rifle, Shock Mines ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 30)
    GŬILÁNG (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Flash Pulse, Shock Mines / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 26)
    Zhanshi YĪSHĒNG Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    YÁOZĂO PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 3)
    YÁOZĂO PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 3)
    LÓNG YÁ (Minelayer) Panzerfaust(+1B), Flammenspeer(+1B), Submachine Gun, AP Mines / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0.5 | 17)
    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]1 [​IMG]3 [​IMG]3
    SHAOLIN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 5)
    SHAOLIN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 5)
    SHAOLIN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 5)
    CHAĪYÌ Yaókòng Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 7)
    4.5 SWC | 300 Points
    Open in Infinity Army
     
  7. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    The White Banner fireteam is moving the LT to the enemy by necessity while the IA Fireteam can be sped up significantly by bringing Krit and a Zuyong Tinbot instead of Tai and Haidao (you'll be 1 point over, unless you opt out of TacAware version, but I feel like the Yisheng's Yaozao is more style and less content)
     
  8. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    The IA already has a tinbot with the Shang Ji HMG. But Krit and a Paramedic Zuyong works well. I guess that can go back and forth. Like the NCO on Tai Sheng. The main thing is the Shang Ji would probably not change. Now if they only not make us wait several years for more than one to come out! :rage:

    Edit: at this point it might be said for the Jujak too.
     
  9. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    So I spent yesterday getting royally fucked by my inability to roll dice, consistently losing firefights with core links firing on targets in the open over multiple turns, and culminating in straight up failing to kill targets attacking on BS19 and dieing to the AROs was a fucking embarrassing shitshow to say the least.

    Shang Ji-sus had been a particularly incompetent fuck up that day. While attempting to tackle Psi-Cops caught in the open he repeatedly failed at bringing them down while they were caught out of position in the open on my active turn, to the point where I went on tilt and sent him to the back of the fireteam and had the Haidao MSR take over pointman duties.

    However after the salt had been washed away I went back to do some some math for what had gone down with IA. Now I'm working with an N3 calculator so shit's a bit rough given crit mechanics not being the same, but given that the Psi-Cops are ARM1 and without cover the crit mechanic doesn't have a huge bearing in difference on how likely their success rate is of wounding Psi-Cops with damage 15 weapons and mostly a bigger impact on the HI's chance to take a wound from crits in return. What I discovered was I was unintentionally correcting an error during my tilting.

    The Shang Ji was firing on 5 dice on BS13, versus the Haidao firing on 3 dice on BS16 against the Psi Cop shooting back. I was valuing 2 burst more than the +3 difference, internally I was judging it to be 5-10% better on a gut feeling. The reality is the Haidao with the MSR firing at 8-16" for BS16 with the core link is the superior option here, it's about 9% better than Shang Ji-sus trying to BRRT his way through things which is actually a fairly significant turn.

    Upon further inspection on swapping different ammo types and playing with stats it wasn't just the effective +3 I was gaining from the MSV, the significant increase in odds was also very much a result of the Double Action ammunition which was a factor I had completely overlooked. Without DA ammo the odds between the Haidao and the Shang Ji were almost identical.

    This probably largely due to the fact that I normally play Vanilla so my options to utilise DA in the active turn are extremely limited so it's not properly ingrained for me. It is something I am going to pay attention to though and try to keep a better track of statistically when I should be utlising the Haidao as a pointman for a core link. Don't get me wrong, statistically given the respective odds Shang Ji-sus still should've blown through the Psi-Cops without any trouble instead of repeatedly flat out losing the F2F encounters, but it was interesting to find out that I wasn't using the optimal pointman at the time upon closer inspection.
     
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  10. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    The other take away from the previous post is that Knauf is probably a dark horse high value/cost effective Vanilla attack piece that we're largely overlooking.

    With Mimetism, MSV1, and +1B on an MSR he's actually rolling extremely similar odds to the core linked Haidao in that situation. For the 32pt unit to be statistically outperforming a core linked Shang Ji that's definitely worth considering the value of.
     
  11. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    I'm more and more frustrated by not being able to use Jing Qo in a fireteam other than Duo. Why didn't they give her wildcard? At the very least give her Haris and allow Shaolin to join with her. It's not like the few other wildcards replacing a shaolin would make it too powerful either. I'm seriously thinking of not getting the box set with her because I think she will sit on the shelf.
     
  12. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    Guijia Duo
    1 to 2 Gujia
    0 to 1 Captain Gao
    0 to 1 Cheong-Hee Jeong
    0 to 1 Haidao
    0 to 1 Hulang FTO
    0 to 1 Krit Kokram FTO
    0 to 1 Lei Gong
    0 to 1 Shang Ji
    0 to 1 Son-Bae
    0 to 1 Tai Sheng
    0 to 1 Yaopu Pangguling FTO

    In IA, so far I've used the Guijia+Cheong twice and both times Cheong was turned to paste. I think it's because he's going up against weapons that can kill a TAG. I think next I'm going to try a Haidao ENG. He's cheaper and is a little tougher. I may go with Krit though if I feel I can do the points.
     
    #152 Space Ranger, May 14, 2021
    Last edited: May 14, 2021
  13. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    One of my favourite lists has a Guijia in a Duo with Cheeong and one in Duo with a Pango. The Pango tends to be left behind, while Cheeong has been keeping up and healthy quite well. Key is to be cowardly AF with him and not be afraid to break the Duo. Primary reason to consider a Duo for me is to bring a Repeater (removing POS can be done in ARO.); typically I never have an opportunity/reason to use Engineer.
     
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  14. Willen

    Willen Well-Known Member

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    My little experience with the duo is the same. Especially if you can move the Chief indoors while keeping coherency and does not expose him.
     
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  15. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    I went with the Krit Multi Rifle+Guijia Duo on the weekend and it worked fantastic. I played against Varuna. A croc man on top of a building tried to hack Krit but I made my reset roll vs. Oblivion. I than did super jump with the Guijia he again tried to oblivion the guijia and I did HFT. Croc dead and I failed the BTS. But then along game Krit and made it all better :) later on Krit also fixed a wound on the Gujia. Then then parted ways while Krit went to do a panoply and Gujia went to destroy an AC2 unit.

    So far I've done:
    Cheong, he's a great ENG but very sqishy.
    Haidao ENG, a little harder for him to keep up with 4-4 move. A little tougher and cheaper than Cheong.
    Shang Ji Hacker, it was ok. I wished I had an ENG instead because I lost him to HRMC fire.
    Now Krit Kokram MR.
     
    #155 Space Ranger, Jun 21, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2021
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  16. zapp

    zapp Well-Known Member

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    One of my favorite IA lists has the combo used in N3 to great success. The list is now cheaper, but also has to deal with new threats.
    Some customization is needed.


    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    GŪIJIĂ MULTI Heavy Machine Gun, Heavy Flamethrower / DA CC Weapon. (1.5 | 82)
    [​IMG] GŪIJIĂ PILOT Submachine Gun / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 0)
    KOKRAM FTO MULTI Rifle(+1 Dam), Chain-colt, D-Charges / Heavy Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (0 | 36)
    HǍIDÀO (Multispectral Visor L2) MULTI Sniper Rifle ( ) / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 33)
    ZHANSHI (Paramedic) Combi Rifle ( | MediKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 13)
    ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11)
    ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11)
    ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11)
    DĀOYĪNG (Lieutenant [+1 Order], Hacker, Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun ( ) / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 30)
    MÓWÁNG (NCO) Spitfire, Flammenspeer / Heavy Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 47)
    CHAĪYÌ Yaókòng Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 7)
    4.5 SWC | 281 Points
    Open in Infinity Army
     
  17. zapp

    zapp Well-Known Member

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    Something like this:


    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    GŪIJIĂ MULTI Heavy Machine Gun, Heavy Flamethrower / DA CC Weapon. (1.5 | 82)
    [​IMG] GŪIJIĂ PILOT Submachine Gun / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 0)
    KOKRAM FTO MULTI Rifle(+1 Dam), Chain-colt, D-Charges / Heavy Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (0 | 36)
    HǍIDÀO (Multispectral Visor L2) MULTI Sniper Rifle ( ) / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 33)
    ZHANSHI (Paramedic) Combi Rifle ( | MediKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 13)
    ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11)
    ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11)
    ZHANSHI Combi Rifle / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11)
    SON-BAE Yaókòng Missile Launcher / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (1.5 | 16)
    DĀOYĪNG (Lieutenant [+1 Order]) Boarding Shotgun / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 22)
    HAC TAO (NCO) Heavy Machine Gun, Nanopulser / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (1.5 | 65)
    6 SWC | 300 Points
    Open in Infinity Army
     
  18. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

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    I went back into many of my Guijia lists and added Krit in almost every one of them. I've thought of trying something else but I'm going to keep doing Krit for a while to see how it works out. I like the FD Krit but I'm more likely to use that profile in Vanilla.

    Now I also noticed something else, almost all of my core team was the below.

    SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) AP Heavy Machine Gun, Chain-colt ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 49)
    SON-BAE Yaókòng Missile Launcher / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (1.5 | 16)
    ZHANSHI (Hacker, Hacking Device) Combi Rifle ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 16)
    ZHANSHI (Forward Observer) Combi Rifle, Flash Pulse / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 12)
    ZHANSHI (Paramedic) Combi Rifle ( | MediKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 13)

    I've found this to be a very good team.
    The Shang of course is good but he can be switched out for the Haidao MSR.

    I don't know why anyone would take a Zhanshi ML instead of the Son-Bae. They cost the same pts and swc but the SB has BS12, BTS3, Courage, and MOV 6-4.

    I don't think I can't NOT take a Zhanshi hacker. With a tinbot backing it up, it turns a meh hacker into a good hacker.

    The last two change the most if I want to save points for something else.

    Others that tend to make it into the core are Lei Gong SMR and Haidao ENG depending on missions mostly.
     
  19. zapp

    zapp Well-Known Member

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    This should also be a valid Haris now, right?


    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    [​IMG]3
    ZÚYǑNG Missile Launcher, Light Shotgun / CC Weapon, Breaker Pistol(+1B). (1.5 | 35)
    PANGGULING FTO (Repeater) Light Shotgun ( ) / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 12)
    PANGGULING FTO (Repeater) Light Shotgun ( ) / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 12)
    1.5 SWC | 59 Points
    Open in Infinity Army
     
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  20. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, since they removed the 1-per-team restriction on IA Wildcards.
     
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