Ah yes but it's really hard to justify 2 Hulang in my mind. I've tried too! But for near the same price of the FD Hulang, I could get a Mowang, Shang Ji, etc.
In general terms, you get a repeater up with Krit and Oblivion the enemy hacker in the active with the ShanJi. Behind the Firewall he is BTS9, and with the Tinbot (-6) their ARO will be tough. The KHD HaiDao is also very proficient behind the Tinbot in the attack. Hacking CAN be bad, but also you can Reset now to get out of ISO/IMM. In my last game I passed 4 Reset rolls to keep going. Zuyongs might be ARM3, but they have 2W. They move 6in now as well, which means a lot more Cautious Move is possible to get into possition. A midfield hacker faced with a Koala AND a somebody shooting him is also a very bad fork for him. All in all we are in a much better position than N3.
The most prevalent hacking in N4 may well be Spotlight, and it works on everything. The Invincible approach to dealing with hacking is mainly a combination of linked Tinbot firewalls and, well, bullets. Lots and lots of bullets. Hacker can’t hack you if he’s dead. And you can shoot deployable repeaters. Bear in mind that the linkable HI are generally BTS 3 or 6, and with a Tinbot in the link it goes up to 6 or 9, plus applying the hacking equivalent of mimetism -6. (Haidao are an exception at BTS 0.) Both the Zuyong and Shang Ji have profiles with a linkable Tinbot and Tactical Awareness, and Tai Sheng’s breaker combi profile also brings a Tinbot. Zhencha and Hac Tao can both camouflage, which provides protection from hacking at the cost of an Order. The main risks are to HI that move out of their link (and thus lose the firewall) or are deployed solo without camouflage, such as Krit’s FD profile or a Liu Xing. Also, the HI most likely to run solo in the midfield tend to have Stealth, which can help as long as your opponent doesn’t have hackers with Sixth Sense online. Even our TAG can get a linked Tinbot firewall, because the Guijia has Duo and you can have a Tinbot Shang Ji or Tai Sheng keep the TAG company. There are a few key unhackables to consider, besides Zhanshi. Lei Gong is excellent and fast, and Chief Jeong is unhackable but carries a repeater in case you’ve got a counter-hacker you want to employ. Both are linkable, too. The Daoying is our top LT, but it’s also an unhackable camo Boarding Shotgun for 22 points, and they’re AVA 3. Lastly, if your Guijia is stuck because of a deployable repeater, the pilot can dismount and riddle it with SMG bullets if you’re desperate and you can’t maneuver the Guijia itself to shoot it for some reason. We also have great engineers, and they come with Deactivators, as do our Sensor bots and the 8 pt Pangguling REMs. A linked pitcher lobbed into our DZ is a bad time, no doubt, but generally Invincibles are reasonably equipped to handle our hacking vulnerabilities.
Deactivators are trash. They are only useful on non combatants who literally don't have a gun, who are never going to be up the field anyway. Why they bothered to keep deactivators and removed actually useful shit like sniffers is beyond me.
Agreed on Sniffers, but Deactivators are all on troopers with better WIP than BS (except the Haidao Engineer, who’s BS 13 and WIP 13) and they ignore Cover MODs, plus they don’t permit an ARM roll, as compared to say a Combi Rifle. FD Krit shooting at a repeater in cover with his HSG is rolling 2 dice on 10s vs. deactivating it with one die on 17. There’s a small but non-zero chance that even if both shotgun attacks hit, the repeater could tank the saves. His E/Mitter isn’t much better, rolling one die on 13. Deactivators also ignore the Mimetism of a mine; at 15” Jeong can roll 3 dice with a combi on 9s versus a Discovered mine in cover, or one die on a 17 that doesn’t permit an ARM roll if it hits. Since it’s a short skill with the BS Attack label, you can Discover and Deactivate instead of Discover and Shoot. Granted it’s pretty situational, but that describes a lot of the kit an army list brings to the table.
My greatest thanks for your advices. It helped. Now I am understanding, how to deal with the problem. Before this I was playing tohaa. “Hacking is for humans,” - I thought. :) Now I am in another world, and fitting my mind in new faction. I really like them, background, design... but it takes some time to understand and tune up. And I am for sure going to try some profiles, just because I want. Yan Huo with missiles and neurocinetics. Liu Xing for sure. And the others...
The neurocinetic Yan Huo ML is a fun stand-alone ARO beast, assuming he can make his Guts rolls. If I'm bringing an unlinked Yan Huo it's probably the HRMC profile because giant gun goes brrrrrrrrrrr. But have you considered... This is a valid Haris that gives you a BS 14 Burst 3 missile launcher in the active turn, Burst 2 in ARO just like the Yan Huo neurocinetic profile, plus a paramedic, a tinbot firewall, and a Shock MULTI Rifle with +1B if someone gets in under the Yan Huo's optimal ranges: Fireworks! ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 3 YĀN HUǑ FTO Missile Launcher(+1B) / CC Weapon, Heavy Pistol. (1.5 | 42) ZÚYǑNG (Paramedic) Combi Rifle ( | MediKit) / CC Weapon, Breaker Pistol(+1B). (0 | 28) SHÀNG JÍ MULTI Rifle, Chain-colt ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 38) 1.5 SWC | 108 Points Of course, you can do something similar with Zuyongs if you don't mind losing that extra Burst on the missiles. Boomsticks ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 3 1 ZÚYǑNG Missile Launcher, Light Shotgun / CC Weapon, Breaker Pistol(+1B). (1.5 | 35) ZÚYǑNG (Paramedic) Combi Rifle ( | MediKit) / CC Weapon, Breaker Pistol(+1B). (0 | 28) ZÚYǑNG (Tactical Awareness) Combi Rifle ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / CC Weapon, Breaker Pistol(+1B). (0 | 31) 1.5 SWC | 94 Points And then there's this absolute nonsense: This Nonsense Right Here ────────────────────────────────────────────────── 5 3 ZÚYǑNG (Paramedic) Combi Rifle ( | MediKit) / CC Weapon, Breaker Pistol(+1B). (0 | 28) SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) Heavy Rocket Launcher, Light Shotgun / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 38) SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) Heavy Rocket Launcher, Light Shotgun / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 38) SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) AP Heavy Machine Gun, Chain-colt ( | TinBot: Firewall [-6]) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 49) HǍIDÀO (Multispectral Visor L2) MULTI Sniper Rifle ( ) / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 33) 6 SWC | 186 Points
These numbers are assuming your opponent is a spud and is placing their shit in stupid spots that are somehow allowing long range shots at S0 targets that are still getting partial cover instead of total cover. That's going beyond situational. If it was a defensively placed object it's going to be dug in, you're not getting LOF until you get close enough or far forward enough to deny it cover. If it's an aggressively placed object (like a repeater that just hurled missiles into your link team) then odds are it's placed for coverage instead and is likely right in the open anyway.
I'm not sure on this, but when it says a link that's specifically 1 Zuyong + 2 Yan Huo FTO, I don't think you can replace a YH FTO. Can anyone confirm?
Wildcard doesn't give a fuck as long as one of those nominated models is in the link (and they meet the Haris/Duo skill requirement). You can wildcard Joan out of her crusade link if you want to.
Bonus points for doing it Qapu-Khalqi-style and using Wild Bill to count as your Janissary so you can have a fireteam of essentially 5 Wildcards. Edit: Ramah can do it too by having a Hortlak Jannissary "count as" a regular Jannisary, leading to a completely Legal Core Fireteam with 5 models that aren't listed as able to form a Core in the sectorial chart.
What are your thoughts on bringing a doctor/paramedic when your list is mostly 1.5W HI since you can't use it when they go down? Does anybody actually try to heal stuff like their Haidao/Hulang when they're in NWI? It feels like an unnecessary risk, but I could see the benefit of keeping them topped off.
That is an interesting question. I do believe the one big target for that strategy is a HaiDao that managed to lose only one wound in ARO, dropped prone, and then you have the extra orders to top him up, pop him up and use in the active. I have considered it, and never ever done it: - It typically dies outright or I would rather he stays up and waste more active orders from the opponent, or - I am running IA, I don´t have an extra order to heal him up... that order is best used on Krit or a Zencha in the midfield! Suck it up stand up and shoot soldier! So no, I don´t really think it works except in our imaginations. HOWEVER, a Paramedic to shot/heal a ShanJi or HacTao is a totally different consideration. I am partial to the Zuyong Paramedic, mostly because he has two wounds and B3 Breaker Pistols are a nice 8in weapon to defend in close quarters. As in, your ShanJi goes down to a decapitation attemp and the Paramedic was in the link, it is typically in range of the pistols to clear the menace (B4 linked!) and then shoot/heal the ShanJi. Plus it is a fast specialist.
More that they haven't really changed fundamentally in a few years so most of the same advice is valid. As far as I know it's about as popular as it always was; not top-tier competitive but with a solid base of players who enjoy its heavily-armoured playstyle.
I guess (and hope) it will get some more discussion with reinforcements as I am in a writers block writing lists for them. I also want to see 8Bit's lists from Interplanetario he came after all 13th in Kraken masters and was in round 4 in the 8th position.
That's hopeful @psychoticstorm , i like the idea of a tough elite but shooty force but struggle to see how to make a list that does that and takes tools for pressing buttons right now. Though my onyx seem to be in a similar spot!!
Right now my advice for IA and Reinforcements is: Don't do it. Well unless you are playing more than the 250pt main group. IA is one of the forces that is hurt by Reinforcements. IA is a force where every point counts. The stupid Zhanshi Comms really screws with IA . If you are playing 250pts you are only going to be able to play Zhanshi team and very little HI other than a haris. However you are probably going to want your Daebak to be the haris. It's not like you can make an effective core with Daebak. To me if you can't play HI, then what's the point of playing IA?
