Units I can't understand

Paratrooper with 2 wounds and BS12, always good! You don't need much else to flank successfully and efficiently

but

It could be better? Of course

 

If I were to complain about a unit like the Gao-Tarsos in my local meta, I'd get a lot of smack talk about that being a true "Tohaa problem".
On it's own, Gao-Tarsos is a really good unit. Two wounds on a specialist with D-Charges that can start as far out as the opponents DZ without making a roll is really strong. Complaining about it having one worse profile or "only" a Combi Rifle is well and truly a first world problem.

In my opinion, the Gao-Tarsos only has two big issues:
1. He's not fit to fight the big guys who have visual modifiers, but if you're trying to do that, that's on you for not playing to your units capabilities.
2. He's in Tohaa and thus often outshone by other options in the faction that can fill a similar role.

Units I don't understand, however:
Chaksa Longarms.

 

Inspired by this thread, I ran this list in a game of Power Pack this evening.

Frankly, I wish the Gao-Tarsos was a Nikoul, because it spent all game off-table thanks to camo marker ARO pieces my opponent hand making good use of their effective 360 LOF to stop me getting an easy walk in off the back. The Sukeuls, Libertos and Diplomatic Delegate had to do all the heavy lifting instead.

But, I think the theory is sound :)

Firefight the Power Pack
──────────────────────────────────────────────────

GROUP 1 10 3
GAO-RAEL Spitfire / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 35)
SAKIEL Viral Combi Rifle, E/M Grenades / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 23)
MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Contender, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon. (0 | 13)
SUKEUL Heavy Machine Gun, D-Charges / Pistol, Breaker Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (1.5 | 34)
SUKEUL (Lieutenant, Forward Observer) K1 Combi Rifle, D-Charges, Flash Pulse ( | Deployable Repeater) / Pistol, Breaker Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (0 | 32)
MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Contender, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon. (0 | 13)
SAKIEL Viral Combi Rifle, E/M Grenades / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 23)
MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Contender, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon. (0 | 13)
KAELTAR (Chain of Command) Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse, SymbioBomb ( | SymbioMate) / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0.5 | 21)
GAO-TARSOS Spitfire / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 35)

GROUP 2 3 2 1
LIBERTO (Minelayer) Light Shotgun, Shock Mines / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1 | 8)
DIPLOMATIC (CC Attack [-3], Specialist Operative]) Nanopulser, Flash Pulse, Pheroware Tactics: Eraser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 5)
SAKIEL Combi Rifle, E/M Grenades / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 17)
KAELTAR Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse, SymbioBomb ( | SymbioMate) / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 15)
MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Contender, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon. (0 | 13)

6 SWC | 300 Points

Open in Infinity Army

 

I like this list a lot. I do, however, understand the desire for a Nikoul in it.

I would also suggest exploring the Taqeul Lieutnant a little. You could easily squeeze him in there without much inconvenience and the utility this unit provides is through the roof.
I should really make a thread about this unit. It's far and away our best Lieutenant now.

 

Fraacta more optimized and slightly cost less
Crusher 36 points vs Gao-Tarsos 29
7 points bring: Courage BS 13 2 wounds without penalties Forward Observer(useless one skill indeed) ARM 2(ok Gao has better ARM) BTS 3 mimetism -3 Panzerfaust Terrain(Zero G)
Nahaab 32 points vs Gao-Tarsos 29 points
3 points bring: Courage Stealth(useless skill) Martial Arts L2 Berserk(+3) Immunity(critical) Natural Born Warrior 2 wounds without penalties Terrain(Total) CC 23 ARM 1(Tarsos better) BTS3
Mirage-5 2 units so each one 33 points but can not deny Goa-Tarsos better,but why ppl leaving games when I deploy Mirage-5 they are so pricy and so bad in performance?
If we were talking about cars...Someone trying to sell me Russian trash car for the price of Mercedes would be braindead person.
But you are not...You are just tried to troll a bit with Fraacta:)Fat one but nice.

 

I really cannot understant why you consider 1 wound + another wound from Symbiont Armour to be "Fake Wound". After loosing them the Gao-Tarsos goes to unconscious.
On the other hand, you consider NWI as real wounds, but you are taken our of table if you are wounded again.

Yes, the Inactive Synbiont Armour profile is weaker, but even if you go Unconscious you can get up, again and again (the Taqeul, for example, might do this even automatically). This has been this way for years, I guess that we veteran Tohaa players are used to using Doctors or Medikits if necessary.

Regarding the Fraacta, having only ARM1 in your first wound means you are more likely to go directly to Unconscious if you suffer several hits (or a DA hit), while the Tarsos woud roll those multiple hits against ARM 3. Having better WILL also helps the Specialist profile.

 

I'd be interested in reading that thread. I've used the Taquel a bunch both as the Lt (+1 Order) and as a zero-SWC chain of command. It's been... mixed. And my mixed I mean I tried to force it to be great every game and for two games in a row I wasted a bunch of time making 2 dice 14s vs 1 dice 13s face to face rolls and doing nothing, and then in the third game blew up an entire white company fusilier + ORC + haidao core from outside LOF in a way that was frankly egregious.

I'm particularly interested in thoughts on weapon loadouts. The more expensive guns increase the cost of the trooper significantly but on the other hand make use of the BS13 ARM3 BTS6 platform to do more that just pheroware.

 

To try to cut costs and take advantage of CAP, I usually ugly force myself to take the Taqeul LT Spitfire (39pts + 1.5cap)

As he does not usually go in my offensive triads, I do not demand much of him either, and from turn 2 he usually does a very good job, rolling 5 dice, using pheroware and making good nasty ARO's

 

So I ran this tonight, in Biotechvore against an Onyx list. I managed to bull through a Xeodron with K1 weapons which, let me tell you, is not an easy firefight to voluntarily take.

The standout was, of all things, the K1 Sniper Sukeul. Coming in at a very attractive 30pts, she bagged the final wound on the Xeodron, a core linked Unidron missile (taking the firefight at 43", lovely stuff), and gunned down the enemy Suryat L2 Lieutenant at close range through his suppressive fire with her breaker pistols. Easy MVP off a very limited order pool. Shockingly, she might content with the Nikoul, sometimes and in some lists.

Big Game Hunters v2.1
──────────────────────────────────────────────────

GROUP 1 9 1 3
GAO-RAEL Spitfire / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 35)
TAQEUL (Chain of Command) Viral Combi Rifle, Nanopulser, Pheroware Tactics: Endgame, Pheroware Tactics: Mirrorball / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 42)
MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Contender, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon. (0 | 13)
SUKEUL Heavy Machine Gun, D-Charges / Pistol, Breaker Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (1.5 | 34)
SUKEUL (Lieutenant, Forward Observer) K1 Combi Rifle, D-Charges, Flash Pulse ( | Deployable Repeater) / Pistol, Breaker Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (0 | 32)
MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Contender, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon. (0 | 13)
TAAGMA Breaker Combi Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 16)
KAELTAR Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse, SymbioBomb ( | SymbioMate) / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 15)
MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Contender, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon. (0 | 13)
LIBERTO (Minelayer) Light Shotgun, Shock Mines / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1 | 8)

GROUP 2 4 1 1
DIPLOMATIC (CC Attack [-3], Specialist Operative]) Nanopulser, Flash Pulse, Pheroware Tactics: Eraser / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 5)
CHAKSA AUXILIAR (Sensor, Baggage) Heavy Flamethrower(+1 Dam) ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 10)
SUKEUL K1 Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Breaker Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (1.5 | 30)
KAELTAR (Chain of Command) Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse, SymbioBomb ( | SymbioMate) / Pistol, PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0.5 | 21)
MAKAUL Heavy Flamethrower, Contender, Eclipse Grenades / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon. (0 | 13)

6 SWC | 300 Points

Open in Infinity Army

 

Just finished my game against Morat.Tried K1 Sniper Sukeul in the Frontline mission and I am not so happy about her...She had just blown me away!!!She is not usual boring sniper,she is huntress,treat her that way and you will be amazed how exciting and fun to play she can be!!!
P.S.Many Veterans say it is bad profile for Sukeul,I found it absolutely exciting.Do not let her die or loose Symbiomate on ARO,let her hunt in active turn and you will be amazed.This gal will cross the table killing everything she see,accomplish classify,return back and ask the rest of the team whether they are going to do anything today:)
P.P.S.Thx for sharing this idea man.

 

Veterans might still be seeing the K1 sniper through the lense of N3, where it was substantially worse and generally had poorer targets.

The increase in damage, and the increased attractivenesd of higher ARM troopers makes the K1 sniper a much improved weapon.

 

Madame Igao Alpha-Strike unit,1 time use,find 5 man squad go there in camo,pop mirrarbol slay everyone in CC,lean her back against the wall and put her in SF state,wish her good luck and that is all

 

So Fraacta with 1 ARM likely will take 2 hits and Tarsos with 0 ARM will take only 1,go unconscious...but honestly what will help him???Your veteran status
To make it more obvious as veteran you know that Draal,Sukeul loose memitism and all ARM and BTS where units with NWI loose nothing.But sure thing they have better odds to survive to be healed.Muhahahaha
Also NWI can be healed without unconscious state.

 

And and and and and, -5pts cheaper than before, that Sniper K1 is really good 30pts resource

Better than 32pts K1 Combi profile? Well, not better not worst, different! And that makes that Sukeul profile so attractive :D

 

Sorry, maybe it's because I'm not a native english speaker, but I cannot even understand what you are trying to say.

What I was trying to explaing was that a perfectly healthy Fraacta that takes two hits (or a DA hit) will have to make two ARM rolls with only ARM 1.
On the other and, a perfectly healty Gao-Tarsos that takes two hits (or a DA hit) will have to make two ARM rolls with ARM 3.

Regarding NWI, the unit under that status can be healed only if it took onw Wound. If it takes a second wound, it's taken out of the table.
A Symbiont Armour trooper can take two wounds and it wil still be on the table. It will be unconscious, yes, but you have the choice of healing it.

 

Anyone have much experience using any of Igaos, the different Clipsos profiles, and Jaan Staar in N4? They're all on my testing list, but I was wondering if anyone with any prior experience had any tips or lessons learned that were interesting.

So far I've had one short game with Igaos and the Clipsos minelayer; the Igao did nothing (although to be fair one of them jumped a cheerkiller and got shanked for his trouble on bad dice) but the Clipsos managed to kill a linked Stempler zond and otherwise not die, which was a worthwhile use of the points.

 

I have used Them all in some capacity,

the only profile for the igao is the pheroware one , you Can use the pheroware to block line of sight for your other units further back, it’s like having a smoke grenade you can spec fire with impunity so abuse that .

Also it can be used in aro which is immensely handy.

Jan staar can be really good you just have to understand he is not exactly a fiday, if you give him the mate he can go for the suicide run and light shotty a link team, he can also fight somewhat due to his 2 burst with viral pistols . Where he shines is in domination style mission and against armies with chaff like dashat which he can take apart with his viral and his shotgun and mines

clipsos is just one of the best TO units in the game if not the best ! For its points.

Surprise attack can be really good here as it applies to whatever attack you are doing so with the shotgun they get -3 to dodge or what ever they do.

also because links can no longer delay the clipsos bsg is so good at removing links you just break stealth have them aro then start gunning them down

the clipsos Fo and minelayers are just really good for their roles.
the minelayer guarding the midfield
the Fo taking the objective after mercilessly suprise shooting some fool

the sniper is awful IMO but some people swear by it


But the best camo type unit we have is the libertos , it’s the best camo unit in the game for the points except for the dashat libertos ;)

 

I miss so much the Camo trick with Libertos, Mines and Clipsos, the Camo-0 fucked that nasty tricky tactic :p

 

About Clipsos...Wneh shooting in active turn from partial cover would not she have -3 for surprise attack,-6 for mimetism,-3 for partial cover total -12 ???