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Hassasin Bahram beginner

Discussion in 'Haqqislam' started by Xagul82, May 23, 2020.

  1. Xagul82

    Xagul82 Well-Known Member

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    Time to revive the thread[emoji846]

    I had the chance of playing two games after N4 dropped.

    The first game was again more me learning what not to do after doing it...

    Smoke-shooting is nice and Yara ruined the day of my opponent who relied heavily on visual mods to keep his nasty units safe[emoji16].

    Having 3 Daylamis, 2 Farzan, 3 Fidays and a forward deploying Link - thanks to Yara - means a hell lot of midfield presence.

    I have to admit, that Yara overshined the Assawira.

    The next games will be part of an escalation campaign containing SpecOps. Starting at 150 pts. going to 400 pts in the course of 4 games. Restrictions are the list has to stay the same only adding units and it has to contain a specops.


    I'm working on a list and looking forward to your comments as soon as I have narrowed my plans.

    Gesendet von meinem ASUS_I01WD mit Tapatalk
     
  2. Cannon Fodder

    Cannon Fodder Well-Known Member

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    I can see the value of Yara over asawira in lower point value games. Also Yara would be MUCH better vs lists which have lots of Mimitism. But once you get to 300 points I think the Asawira is a better choice for an un-tailored list.


    --------------


    If someone is looking to get into HB, here is what I would consider a minimum purchase to make a decent 300 point forces.
    • HB starter (you can proxy Daylami as Ghulams)
    • Muyib box
    • Asawira Spitfire
    • Barid
    • Beyond Red Veil*
    Most of that list is fairly straight forward, except the Beyond red veil box. But its the only place you can get the good Fiday sculpt which is a model HB player will want. The Ragik is a nice option to have, but I find I rarely play them. Depending on your local meta and strictness of your group you can proxy Tarik as Yara. The problem is he's the wrong silhouette. You can try to fit him on a 25mm base, but I don't think he'll fit.

    HB players will want to get a Leila, but I don't like recommending new players getting Dire foes boxes. In theory you can use the YJ model as your Yara proxy, but the aesthetic doesn't fit. If you do that you can get the Al-djabel blister instead of the beyond red veil box, but you are missing out on an amazing sculpt.

    I left the Muyibs on the short list. In N3 they were a mandatory purchase for HB, but in N4 you don't quite need 5. I'm assuming new players are looking to keep initial purchase to a minimum, and it's cost effective & enjoyment effective way to fill up your army to 300 points. I do see players using more than 1 regularly.

    In N3 I would have put the Ghazis on the short list, but with the N4 model cap, I'd put them into the follow up list. They can probably change the ghazis from a 4 model box to a 2 model blister and not affect player options.

    After that you can expand as you want multiple different ways. But that is the definitive HB core options. If you start with other HB options you'll eventually head back to get these models.
     
  3. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    I don't think they're really comparable as they do very different things. You can quite reasonably bring both in the same list.

    That said, I've found that Yara does things that I want to have in literally every list I write. Whereas I'm rarely bringing an Asawira spitfire, as I've been preferring the Shakush HMG for the Big Gun role. Others will have different playstyles of course.

    I'm hoping that the Shujae model will make a good Fiday proxy and that it gets released soon. Might be worth waiting rather than shelling out for Red Veil.

    I'd just proxy any S2 model for Yara for now. I think she'll get a release soon which will be an auto-buy.

    That was true in N3 but I don't think it's true in N4. She is good in N4 but no longer anything close to an auto-include.
     
  4. Cannon Fodder

    Cannon Fodder Well-Known Member

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    I think it depend on what is your fireteam core. If you are using a ghulam core, I think the Barid is a decent replacement for Leila. I still havn't had a chance to play HB yet so I can't really state one is better than the other. I really like having a Hacker in my cores to defend my HI point guy. If you drop the Asawira you can skip the hacker completely.

    As for Yara vs Asawira: at 300 points it's easy to get both. The only time I see a need to chose is if you are playing a TAG and need to really shave points to keep a high model count. But I'd leave that out of the beginner discussions. Having a high point value model in a list means sacrificing other things which newer player should avoid. Get a couple games under you belt before getting a tag.
     
  5. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    Yup, I think we're on the same page re Leila. She'd be very nice in a Govad or Asawira (or Lasiq!) core, but you won't often see her in a Ghulam core. Whereas in N3 one would run either a Ghulam core or a Muyib core, and Leila was pretty much an auto-include in either of them, so she was on the table in basically every game.

    Fair enough, although what I like about the Shakush is precisely that he's cheap and disposable, and I can fit him in without sacrificing other things. I'd say he'd be one of the easiest TAGs for a beginner to play, FWIW.
     
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  6. KedzioR_vo

    KedzioR_vo Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    I asked Koni about new models for Haqq and it appears that we won't see any of them in the 1st third of 2021.
    Not a good information, but IMHO better know than wait and be more dissapointed each month.


    PozdRawiam / Greetings
     
  7. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    Bad news, but nonetheless much appreciated to know!
     
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  8. WWHSD

    WWHSD Well-Known Member

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    It’s seems like the Haqq Action Pack should probably make this list since it includes Beyond Red Veil. You also end up with some Ghulams. The Al Fasid can easily proxy an Asawira or a Shakush. The Tuareg makes a decent proxy for Leila and either the Khwarij or Zheyaden could stand in for Yara if you don’t mind a bit of gender bending i your proxies.
     
  9. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    I definitely wouldn't recommend the Action Pack as a purchase for HB players. The Fiday is the only model in it that an HB player is likely to use. 1 out of 10 is terrible value.

    You might also use the Boarding Shotgun Ragik, but I think most HB players will be taking a different loadout when they take a Ragik. It's not a total loss since she can be converted to a different loadout. Mine has a Rifle+LSG (and looks great on my shelf, but never sees the table.)

    The 3 Ghulams are also usable in HB, but you're not likely to take more than 1 of them - and likely none with the Rifle+LSG loadout. You really need a Ghulam with a Rifle+GL, so maybe one of the models will make an ok conversion, but the other two won't be useful.

    The other 5 models aren't even HB units. They're only good for proxying and they don't really work well as proxies for any HB units. I mean, you can proxy anything for anything, but if you're spending that kind of money you want the models to look at least a little like the units they're proxying for.

    If you like the Fiday, you're better off getting him on ebay rather than paying for 9 models you don't need. Or, play for a while and then get the Action Pack if you find you use a lot of Rifle+LSG Ghulams.
     
  10. Papa Bey

    Papa Bey Clueless Wonder. Still.

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    At least we're not Tohaa.
     
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  11. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    Actually, to be fair, she has seen the table as a Ragik Hacker in Highly Classified and Countermeasures. Whether she's worth buying and converting for that purpose depends on whether you like the actual Ragik Hacker model (I hate it, so I'm happy to have an alternative).
     
  12. WWHSD

    WWHSD Well-Known Member

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    I guess it just seems to me if someone is going to pay $40 for a Fiday + 2 Haqq models + 3 Yu Jing models that they’d be better off paying $75 for a Fiday + 9 Haqq models. There’s a bunch of stuff they’ll probably need proxies for and I’d rather use Haqq models to do that.

    I get where you are coming from though.
     
  13. QueensGambit

    QueensGambit Chickenbot herder

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    Agreed, it sucks that they don't sell the Fiday separately. It is what it is I guess.

    Out of curiosity I just checked ebay and no one is selling the Fiday right now, but typically one can get individual models for a price that's more than you'd want to pay, but still a lot less than buying a whole boxed set. My guess is around 2x normal price for the Fiday, which is still cheaper than either Beyond Red Veil or the Action Pack. But you're right, there aren't any great options for splitting boxes.

    My suggestion to a new player would be to proxy the Fiday for the time being, and wait until you've been playing a while before deciding what to do in the long run. Maybe you eventually ebay the Fiday, or buy the Action Pack or Beyond Red Veil, or use a different Fiday model, or a different proxy or conversion. It's not hard to proxy in the interim since the Fidays spend most of their time in marker state anyway.
     
  14. sackofowls

    sackofowls Member

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    It's hard to find Beyond Red Veil right now, unfortunately.

    Thought they discontinued it. I'm sure there's still some floating around though.
     
  15. Cannon Fodder

    Cannon Fodder Well-Known Member

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    They'll need to make a new Fiday. The old ones are lackluster, and the Fiday is probably the most signature model in haqq, let alone HB. Unfortunately the future haqq action pack is not that great for HB. Extra Ghulam's are nice, but not required. You really just want the Fiday & Ragik for HB. I doubt they'll sell the red veil fiday separately from the action pack.
     
  16. Papa Bey

    Papa Bey Clueless Wonder. Still.

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    It's the upcoming Haqqislam Action Pack.
     
  17. Xagul82

    Xagul82 Well-Known Member

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    At the moment I am limited to TTS. But I posses a variety of models, including the beyond part.

    The first round of our mini-campain will be acquisition at 150 points and 3 SWC. The list has to contain a SpecOps.

    So I came up with this list, and I'm hoping for your very appreciated inputs [emoji16].

    Yara served me well and the Assawira should bring a lot of punch and a specialist. Beside it bringings a friend to a brawl (Nasmat).

    I guess depending on the situation, I could run a full core or a 4 Men Link and a duo.

    Daylamis are a no brauner I guess, and the Mutt delivers Smoke or could be upgraded to the Jammer/e-marat version.

    My opponent is - as always - JSA.[​IMG]


    Edit: sorry for the bad quality of the picture, but I could not find the button to import the list into the forum [emoji37]

    I found it :-)


    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]5 [​IMG]3 [​IMG]1
    ASAWIRA (Doctor [+3]) AP Rifle, Light Shotgun ( | MediKit) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 36)
    MUYIB (Infinity Spec-Ops) Rifle, Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust, D-Charges / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 24)
    GHULAM (NCO) Rifle, Grenade Launcher, Smoke Grenade Launcher / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1 | 15)
    BARID (Hacker, Killer Hacking Device [UPGRADE: Trinity (-3)]) Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 6)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 6)
    RAFIQ REMOTE Rifle, Light Shotgun, Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 14)
    MUTTAWI'AH Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 5)
    YARA HADDAD (Lieutenant) AP Marksman Rifle / Heavy Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (0 | 25)
    NASMAT PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 3)

    1 SWC | 149 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Gesendet von meinem ASUS_I01WD mit Tapatalk
     
    #57 Xagul82, Dec 8, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2020
  18. theGricks

    theGricks Well-Known Member

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    I mean honestly, we have had a really good release schedule the last couple years (including a HB rework TWICE) so I am not particularly put off. We have a tone of good stand ins.
     
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  19. clever handle

    clever handle Well-Known Member

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    I'm excited to try this out:

    Balanced Hassassins
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]7 [​IMG]2
    GHULAM Rifle, Light Shotgun / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 11)
    GHULAM (Doctor [+3]) Rifle, Light Shotgun ( | MediKit) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    GHULAM (Lieutenant [+1 Command Token]) Rifle, Light Shotgun / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    MUYIB (Tactical Awareness, X Visor) Spitfire, D-Charges ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 34)
    MUYIB (Tactical Awareness, X Visor) Heavy Rocket Launcher, D-Charges ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 25)
    YARA HADDAD (Strategic Deployment) AP Marksman Rifle / Heavy Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (0 | 28)
    BARID (Hacker, Hacking Device) Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 17)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]5 [​IMG]4 [​IMG]1
    NADHIR (Forward Observer) Rifle, Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 26)
    FIDAY Rifle, Light Shotgun, Shock Mines, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 27)
    SHAKUSH Heavy Machine Gun, Heavy Flamethrower / AP CC Weapon. (1.5 | 58)
    [​IMG] SHAKUSH PILOT Light Shotgun / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 0)
    BARID (Hacker, Killer Hacking Device [UPGRADE: Trinity (-3)]) Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 15)
    KAMEEL (Deactivator, Repeater) ( ) / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 8)
    MUTTAWI'AH Boarding Shotgun, E/Marat, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 9)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 6)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 6)

    5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Everything in group one fits into a core link, almost everything in group two is a decent road block. Ghazi's expensive because there were points to spare and his smoke will combo with Ms Haddad
     
    RobertShepherd likes this.
  20. RobertShepherd

    RobertShepherd Antipodean midwit

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    I've been trying to solve for Mindwipe with Hassassins without giving up pieces I like. This is the current effort, hopefully also able to flex into countermeasures and probably panic room as well. Quite hypothetical but hoping to try it out over the next week:

    Arabian Knights
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10 [​IMG]1
    ASAWIRA AP Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (1.5 | 39)
    ASAWIRA AP Rifle, Light Shotgun / Pistol, DA CC Weapon. (0 | 33)
    ASAWIRA (Doctor [+3]) AP Rifle, Light Shotgun ( | MediKit) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 36)
    MUYIB (Tactical Awareness, X Visor) Heavy Rocket Launcher, D-Charges ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1.5 | 25)
    LEILA SHARIF (Hacker) Shock Marksman Rifle, E/M Mines, D-Charges / Breaker Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 20)
    YARA HADDAD AP Marksman Rifle / Heavy Pistol(+1B), CC Weapon. (0 | 25)
    ASAWIRA (Doctor [+3]) AP Rifle, Light Shotgun ( | MediKit) / Pistol, Shock CC Weapon. (0 | 36)
    GHULAM (NCO) Rifle, Grenade Launcher, Smoke Grenade Launcher / Pistol, CC Weapon. (1 | 15)
    BARID (Hacker, Hacking Device) Rifle, Pitcher ( ) / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0.5 | 17)
    BARID (Lieutenant, Forward Observer) Rifle, Pitcher, Flash Pulse / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 13)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]2 [​IMG]3
    SHAYTANIYAH REMOTE Missile Launcher / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (1.5 | 16)
    FANOUS REMOTE Flash Pulse / PARA CC Weapon(-3). (0 | 7)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 6)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 6)
    DAYLAMI (Camouflage [1 Use], Infiltration) Light Shotgun, Panzerfaust / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 6)
    6 SWC | 300 Points
    Open in Infinity Army
     
    #60 RobertShepherd, Dec 24, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2020
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