Hello, just a short question because it came up in my last game a few minutes ago. My opponent declared spotlight against an camouflage marker in his active turn. I'm sure that camouflage marker a no valid target for hacking programs. My opponent was sure that in N3 it was possible to target camouflage marker with spotlight. We found nothing in the rules. Did I miss something in the rulebook? Was this really a thing in N3?
Spotlight vs a Camo Marker is not valid. Valid AROs vs a Camo Marker are: Discover, Dodge, Look Out! or Reset. Mostly this is because Discover is the only skill that can target a Camo Marker (leaving aside Discover + BS Attack).
Spotlight is marked as a Comms Attack, and Camouflaged specifies you can’t declare Attacks (of any kind) against things in the Camouflaged state. I assume Discover + Hack would work the same way as Discover + BS Attack, but as long as the target remains a camo marker Spotlight against it will become an Idle.
Discover + Hack isn't legal. Discover + BS Attack is only legal because there's a specific rule for it.
That's what I thought, too. I just asked because he was so confident about this option. He claimed that this would be a specific option for spotlight. I think he could had mean satlock, which was a thing in N3 and gave you the opportunity to discover and target a camouflage marker. But that's not possible in N4 anymore. Thanks for your quick response.
Can you clarify why, in N4 terms? The two boxes that appear after Discover go out of the way to call out that Discover can be combined with any other short skill/short movement skill, and describe Discover + Attack as one option, but the wording is more like a walkthrough of how it resolves based on other rules than it is like an actual rule: Note that it doesn’t say “BS Attack,” just “Attack.” Given the way N4 handles speculative declarations and converts things to Idle if they fail validation later in the OES, it’s logical that based on the wording above one can declare invalid skills against a camo marker and then find that they become valid later in the active turn, because Discover + Attack works that way. The interaction is a bit complex, but RAW even covers the case of a coordinated Discover + Move order where several models try to Discover a single target and one or more tries to Move into silhouette contact: If all the Discovers fail, any Move that was declared as ending in contact would become an Idle, but as long as at least one Discover works, the troopers moving into CC can legally try to do so, although the camo trooper might want to Dodge to avoid getting stuck in CC depending on what’s declaring that Move.
No, it's not. In the Camouflage rules it's (same wording in PDF and website): You cannot declare Attacks against Camouflaged Markers, it is necessary to Discover that Marker first (Discover + Attack maneuver), unless otherwise specified by a rule or Skill. In the rules for Discover, it just calls out Discover+BS Attack, but it's not called out as the specific maneuver like it was in N3. Compare N3: http://wiki.infinitythegame.com/en/Discover N4: https://infinitythewiki.com/index.php?title=Discover There's an editing irregularity between the Spanish and English bullet points in Camo Spanish: No se pueden declarar Ataques contra un Marcador de Camuflado (CAMO), es necesario Descubrir a ese Marcador primero, salvo que una regla o Habilidad indique lo contrario. English: You cannot declare Attacks against Camouflaged Markers, it is necessary to Discover that Marker first (Discover + Attack maneuver), unless otherwise specified by a rule or Skill. But the red boxes for both of the PDF's are consistent for the detailed skill descriptions: Spanish (pdf page 83): Una combinación habitual en una Orden es: Descubrir + Ataque, maniobra táctica que, excepcionalmente, permite declarar un Ataque contra Tropa en estado Camuflado. English (pdf page 83): A common combination in an Order is Discover + Attack. This tactical maneuver allows you to declare an Attack against a Camouflaged enemy, which cannot normally be done. It's not the "Discover + BS Attack" special maneuver any more.
If you want to go for niche applications, you could also declare discover + cc attack using guard against a model within 8".
