Reading Isolate and IMMOBILIZED-B states I can imagine 3 ways of how do they stack for reference: IMMOBILIZED-B Troopers in Immobilized-B State cannot declare any Skill or ARO, except Reset, applying a -3 WIP MOD. ISOLATED Troopers in this state must apply a -9 WIP MOD to their Reset rolls. First way: stack completly: as IMMOBILIZED-B allow only reset, and this reset must be with -3 WIP , and aditionaly -9 from ISOLATED as isolated do not specify Reset roll, just apply to all. So model must sucsesfull roll of WIP -12 to reset both states together Second way: not stacking Target just do a roll with higher in module (-9) roll and reset both states together. Third way: Mine case Similar to dodge vs mine and shoot example at pg 86 its actualy to diffrent reset checks in one roll, where one is vs -9 and second vs -12 and they pass/fails separately. So for example a WoMing with WIP 13 under both states rolls 4 for reset roll, that would be enoght to pass reset vs Isolated st, but not IMM-B. So puting out his isolated state, but keeps IMM-B his next reset would required only 10- to pass against IMM-B. Well, what way is the right and seems to be indtended? For me, the first seems the most logical, but the counter argument, that more than half HI could not reset after EM ammo ever w/0 an engener's help. But I feel nothing wrong with that coz, it was 100% of HI (ok, not 100%. - Total immned) who could not reset this
First way, an E/M weapon hitting a non-veteran non-totally inmunne HI means a -12 to shake off both states with a reset. Keep your engineers close by.
Honestly, to me, I'd say that MODs stacking on a per task basis is the simplest solution (i.e. the malus on Reset for being Targeted would only apply to the check for removing Targeted*), but there's enough examples out there that it's clear that MODs stack on a per unit basis. * Or put it in a different way; the MODs look like difficulty levels to me. No they don't. MODs apply per target when shooting, there is no stacking of individual summed up MODs. If you split on A, B and C, you don't get -3 for Cover on A, -3 for Mimetism on B and -6 for Mimetism on C for a total of -12 on each of your individual bursts - you get -3 on A and B while you have -6 on C. Also, you certainly don't get +3 per burst from range when you send all of your dice against a single target, either.
Since a single Reset removes each instance of each State, that's kinda what happens. You roll once to cancel "their Targeted State, [Isolated State] and IMM-B State, applying any State-specific MODs". So the Targeted MOD does only apply to the check for removing Targeted, it just happens that that's the same check as removing Isolated so both MODs apply. Unless I've missed something and you now need to roll a Reset and nominate the State you're trying to remove? If so: HAHAHAHAH, oh wow... that's extremely dumb.
My understanding is that one reset roll clears all states cleared by a reset, but suffers all maluses imposed by states cleared by a reset.
That last bullet point seems to be CB tripping over trying to write “Remember back in N3 when you weren’t sure if successful non-cancelled resets during a chain-immobilize hacking attack would clear the immobilize? Well, it does.”
You're quoting a hypothetical. In the rules, you roll Reset apply all MODs and check if you scored a success, and if you did you remove everything that's removed by a Reset success. What you quoted was me describing how I perceived MODs to work when I was first reading the rules. (Roll a Reset, check if you scored a success and if you did compare the result to each state applying their MODs separately, and remove any that you scored a success against; i.e. rolled a 9 when IMM-B, Targeted and ISO; opponent rolls a 5 on Hack Attack; success and avoid the attack, success at removing Targeted and IMM-B, failed at removing ISO)
This was also a tough issue in our community... Seems like the MODs all stack on each other, regardless of which State provides them. But the last sentence, "it cancels IMM-B and Targeted state", why doesn't it include Isolated state? It seems quite obvious that a successful Reset cancels all States that provide MODs, but thanks to the last sentence, cancelling Targeted+IMM-B and Isolated state seems seperate.
well, that's not what I mean Imm-B applies a -3 to reset, targetted applies another -3, they stack to get you -6. If the target was also isolated, he would get another -9, but the total would be capped at -12. The same way cover and mimetism apply a -6 (stack) to shotting, and so on. Obviously, malus with the same origin do not stack (for example, firewall from repeater and firewall from fairy dust, both are firewall so only the bigger instance applies)
Fair enough, we're talking cross-purposes. What I mean is that when you shoot that you take everything that is relevant to your one burst into account for that specific dice and not everything that is circumstantial and would apply to the same roll. When you Reset, you will have several sources affecting a singular type of roll. The closest analogy I can find to shooting would be if when shooting a burst weapon you'd have to stack all targets' Mimetism rather than just take the primary target. A better comparison would be dodging; you're getting a bunch of maluses from different sources but you're only doing comparisons on a per-source basis just like when shooting even though this is a single roll that gets compared against everything like Reset; -3 versus dodging the mine because it is a template weapon from equipment, -3 to dodging the speculative fire because you're doding against an enemy template user you don't see, -0 versus the MadTrap because MadTraps aren't troopers. If you roll 4 below your PH you roll a success; you don't get to take all of it to the face. -- This brings me to a genuine rules question: if you're IMM-B and you Reset when attacked by a Barid using Trinity; are you rolling -3 versus IMM-B and -3 versus the Barid like you would for Dodge or do these stack? Ditto if you're attacked by a coordinated order from 4 Barid, do you roll -12 or -3?
I think it should be: IMM-B and Barid (-6) because different sources 4 Barids (-3) because one source
