Your N4 Games

Sounds like you had a rough time of the dice!
I played Shas recently on Firefight which tends to lend itself to IAs strengths and won quite comprehensively.

I've always liked drop troops, even rating Liu in N3 for the simple fact it's a HI in your enemy's DZ, so I decided to try the new improved version...
... all 4 of them

My Liu-nacy list worked really well but beware the combat crash tackle!
One dropped behind a lowly flash pulse bot, it passed its Dodge -3, and I was foolishly close enough for it to get into CC.

Para CCW is fierce! Once I was bricked there wasn't much I could do. I felt a little embarrassed he got schooled by a flash pulse bot but luckily the others redeemed themselves.

Shang Ji-sus is as good as predicted. While not invulnerable, BTS6 with the tinbot means you don't have to be as terrified of hacking as we once were.
He also took on a Sphinx and mowed him down without a scratch. Again, as predicted, AP is now a highly valuable ammunition.

Crit mechanic really makes our guys feel a bit tankier. Big fan!
The double (or linked triple!) boarding shotgun templates also mean you can do some serious damage vs high BS/cover/mimetism units in the active turn and hope to tank the ARO. Always drag along an engineer in case of hacking/EM though

Stick with it! First turn is still our friend. Abuse our order hyper efficiency to get in the opponent's face and prune easy orders. Now that the Daoying is less likely to use its Lt L2 itself, NCO becomes more of a focus. Luckily we have more profiles with it!

I'm going to try a TAG list next and see how the Guijia has improved and feels on the table.

 

Thanks for sharing! Can't really get any games in where I am at the moment, so I'm really hungry for stuff like this heh.

Not sure if intended, but Nadhir FO do not have a flash pulse.

I'm hesitant to leave a fireteam even as far as the midfield. Maybe this belongs in a new thread, but how far do you push, and how far do you fall back?

 

Without watching the games, I only have two bits of advice:

1) Against HB, always try to go first to disable Fiday/Daylami trading.

2) Play with caution against HB. They are like a living minefield, however none of their AROs are singularly strong. Also if FP are hitting on 17s, that must mean you were in good rangebands, and out of cover or just engaging linked FPs, which is kinda a tough spot to try and fight them.

 

Good quezzie, and one I often get wrong! With the new Duos & Haris wildcard options and 6-2 moves you can punch quite far forwards quite quickly and pull back with relative ease. Tinbot and repeaters (paired with a backfield KHD & hidden HD) mean your opponent will probably burn more orders than N3 to try to isolate/carbonite them which means they need to dig them out the hard way.

I've found having a big difficult tempting Haris and a secondary attack piece (Mowang) or a Liu Xing left in their backfield makes the opponent have to spend orders to dig one of them out, reducing the time spent scoring objectives and setting you up to start your turn with your secondary piece.

You can also hold the midfield with two trios (Haris & 3-model Core) using TacAware and NCO to move up and mutually support. Equally putting a nasty duo up and then coordinated SF works well if you can provide hacking protection.

 

So I got a couple of games in for Show of Force with some different options

First one I took a Guijia and it was against Vanilla CA running an Avatar. The Guijia's S7 is still a pain in the ass to work around, and I should've deployed it more centrally as it wound up getting stuck with some cross table shots from a Maakrep MSV2 sniper in a high position, something that normally wouldn't bother smaller models because of building shadow zones but the Guijia's fat dome kept being visible.

On the other hand with Stun ammo on multi weapons being gone I ended up just sucking it up and brute forcing the Guijia into its desired range bands to get rid of the damn thing. Cost it a wound in the process but that was acceptable. The end result was a Monk got smoke down and the Guijia straight up smashed the Avatar in CC, overall effectiveness of the model aside that felt like a fun use of the model which instantly makes it better than the N3 Guijia.

Overall I think the CC readiness of the TAG is going to be a vital part of its kit. Most TAGs generally have a shitshow of a time dealing with CQB and City Fight sucks for them as much as german armour trying to force its way through soviet infested city rubble. A TAG trying to clear Mimetic targets under 8" generally just has a complete ass of a time. The Flamethrowers straight up just have shit odds vs targets that just elect to dodge and refuse to go away to the point where you're almost better off just firing the HMG on BS5 and hoping for crits.

The Guijia on the other hand has the capacity to simply point to a target and say "right, enough of your fuckery" and walking up to it and smack it with a giant dao. The flamethrower still fits into the kit because it can straight force Dodge AROs while the Guijia closes the gap to deliver the beatdown, and if the target doesn't dodge it can elect to tank the small arms fire on ARM8 with 3 wounds and set it on fire.

I do think we need to establish a willingness to play with a manageable amount of risk and not expect to finish the game with a Guijia in perfect condition. We need to approach it in the same way the unnamed Betrayal Guijia pilot furiously jetpacked themselves into the enemy without any weapons in a half repaired, beat to shit TAG to smash the ever loving fuck out of some combine troops with their fists.

On a tangent there, @Bostria that Guijia pilot was Boba Fett levels of 5 seconds on screen yet completely badass cool and deserves a name and a profile and you know it. Cash in whatever blackmail material you have on Gutier and make it happen.


The other game was against Varuna and I elected to try the Liu Xing and Blue Wolf. I had some issues with a Kamau that would just not fucking die that was blocking the TAG from moving out and the Blue Wolf basically didn't wind up doing anything the entire game so I can't really comment too much on it, other than the CC readiness of the TAG will probably find itself useful in similar ways to the Guijia, although I like the Guijia's CC kit more that's not really the point.

On the other hand the Liu Xing showed up in a big way. I'm pretty confident in saying this model will be an absolute bane to any opponent of Yu Jing in N4 and it's a remarkable 180 from its absolute lukewarm leftover garbage tier status in N3.

Bit of a weird statement to lead with after praising the model though, Explode is still a giant trap. DO NOT even think about trying to use it it honestly got fucking worse in N4. Dodge with no LOF means you're setting yourself up to statistically fail to kill the target and get crash tackled and stuck in CC instead. With the amount of Kinematica running around you may even get tackled by shit out of your explode range if you're trying to hit some link team members.

The Liu Xing's reversal of fortunes are both from direct and indirect buffs. The direct buffs are largely the PH14 for combat drops. Arriving on 17s with the EVO is super reliable, you really feel safe taking the drop roll now. Basically think of it like being able to, with minimum risk, Roger Van Zant the shit out of a motherfucker anywhere on the table. You don't show up behind his deployment zone you just show up in the rear arc of his most expensive most valuable unit. In my case, it got behind a Squalo, putting it in the open and wrecked it with AP rounds. The removal of dispersion was also a huge risk mitigation factor in now if you fail you don't have to worry about scattering in front of say the Kamau and just fucking dieing, at the very least you get to keep your model alive and put it in your DZ.

The indirect buffs are meta changes. The change to counter hacking the drop roll, where you can't F2F with a bunch of shitkicker hackers is extremely helpful. You don't drop and then immediately worry about a 10-15% of cumulative chance to crit the drop roll. Secondly, the counter hack was moved to the EVO hacker which is rarer now with the death of B2 Flash Pulse bot spam. The EVO hacker is also defenseless and an easy target for a Ninja to wreck quickly to pave the way for an uncontested airdrop.

Lastly the 15 model cap means there's a reduction of shitkicker repeaters running around the back of the table hiding in DZs, it's much more likely the Liu Xing can penetrate enemy lines without needing serious hacking help getting through there. With fewer models on the table it's also more likely the Liu Xing can find a spot out of LOF to arrive and attack a weak point of your opponent.

 

Unnamed badass Betrayal Guijia Leeroy pilot profile would rock so much!!

 

Pretty sure he merged with the default guijia like Toni to her Tikbalangs

 

That sounds like you don't have enough terrain

 

List:
Shang-Ji-sus
Shang-Ji Hacker
Shang-Ji HRL
Zuyong TacAware Combi
Krit Kokram Feuerbach

Daoying Hacker LT2
Husong
Pangguling LSG
Pangguling LSG
Zhanshi Yisheng

Mission: Acquisition
Opponent: Tartary

Now, because of a bug with armoury, some 4 lists I made the other night all got saved as exact copies of the first list I made for the evening, and this is a reconstruction of one of those I made. I think the original had Hulang SMG FTO instead of the Shang-Ji hacker and since I was facing TAK that would've made a huge difference both because the Hacker didn't get to do much/anything and because an aggressive Fireteam tends to shoot a lot in ARO so - kicks from Fireteam is a real concern.

Still, I wanted to play with Shang-Ji and lots of orders concentrated into one group.

TL:DR: Killed most Tartary, had problems with an AP HMG Tankhunter and failed to kill the Vet Kazak AP HMG.

Some summary of mistakes made:
* Spent most of turn one moving 4-4 with my 6-2 units, this cost me maybe 2 orders total.
* In hindsight, I realize my opponent infiltrated/FD2:ed the Tankhunter
* Missed a couple of camouflage markers, so spent a couple of skills trying to Discover what would've been obvious Ambush Camo
* Used dual Breaker Pistols on Shang-Ji-sus a few times, too used to Zuyong HMG.
* Forgot to hack the one time I had the chance to
* Bloody everything in IA has Number 2 and I used it 0 times...

Opponent allowed me to take first turn, so I set up my heavy infantry in the middle, used ITS 11 rules to deploy my Daoying in a building outside the deployment zone, and set the Panggulings up to be a PITA (which they failed to be). Opponent set his troops up with doggies on my left and Line-vet-front kazaks around a house on my right. TR HMG got set down to cover my Doctor and two of the objectives on my left since most long range threats that could take care of it seemed to be on my right and opponent stuck down an AP Spitfire Ratnik.

Spent first turn clearing a Strelok, Irmandinho and the Ratnik out, taking a total of 2 wounds to my HI from a shock mine in the process. Then flanked the Core Fireteam which probably wasted about as many orders as Rifle-Kazaks I killed (which was 3). Opponent re-constituted Fireteam with the Vet Kazak AP HMG and two Line Kazaks and then proceded to kill my Datatracker Zuyong and down Hacker and Shang-Ji-sus using cross-fire action between the Vet Kazak and the Tankhunter.
Turn two I spend most of my orders running a Yaozao up to bring the Hacker and Shang-Ji-sus back on their feet, managing to not quite clear very many miniatures. In return my opponent does manage to kill the Hacker and Shang-Ji-sus dead and wastes a few orders on the Yaozao. Irmandinho on the other flank kills the Pangguling and I forgot to hack it, not that this mattered in the end.
Turn three I have Krit Kokram kill the Tankhunter and set up to dominate the table. I jump down my Daoying to camp the central objective. I realize my other Pangguling is trapped in the building I set him in and can't move forward to camp the right objective. Clear the Strelok FO that was set up on the right objective. Opponent tries to smoke the left objective, does not quite succeed, so climbs the Antipode controller down to shoot my Daoying who fails Dodge and saves while in return Krit puts EXP bullets into the controller, a Strelok, the Line Kazak LT... Game ends with Veteran Kazak getting 7.5" from my HVT.

1 points to Tartary. 0 points to Invincibles

Lessons learned:
This is a meme list. No, that's not something I learned, I knew it all along, but it really is. As fun as dumping large amount of orders on HI is, this list put all the eggs in the same basket.
IA really don't do Sensorship well, I can see adaptation to White Banner of this list working decently, though.
I need to check opponent profiles now that everything is new and strange.
I need to really make a review of pistols. Pistols actually matter on SWC profiles.

 

Played into Shas today on Supremacy. Took the Liu Xing but it doesn't have great drop options into Shas and dropping is risky biscuits against an army with heavy weapons and hidden deployment. I was going second and playing very passively just focusing on the mission so I didn't end up making the Liu Xing do much beyond walk onto the board on turn 2 to clear an Ikadron baggage bot and a Haiduk MSR out of a zone. Other than that he just camped and scored points so nothing to really write about.

Took me 5 attempts to pass a WIP10 check to do the classified on turn 1 which slowed the shit out of my game too but it was worth the 2pts. That heavily contributed to deciding to play a super passive game.

I have come to the conclusion I should drop the Daofei Hacker for this style of mission. It's generally just roof ratting and the Zencha is both better at that and cheaper. C+ is super useful both in counter ratting and getting away from people coming to clear him and the only real complaint about the profile before was getting shitblasted by shock mines and that issue has finally been resolved. It's a significant enough points saving it'd let me upgrade a baggage bot to a full combat REM either the Lu Duan or Rui Shi so it's a significant advantage to swap them out I think.

I had a Kanren pretending to be a Hulang. I think the Hulang buff to ODD is a pretty big indirect buff to the Kanren, having a HI 2W target to play holomask bullshit with is great. The -6 makes people really think twice about whether it's worth their time to deal with it or just try to avoid it which the Kanren likes, or they might try to send a hacker to deal with them which can be funny bait if he's either unhackable or hiding a KHD profile.

I'm also starting to think spending the command token to hold 2 models back for many lists going 1st will be a no brainer. You can very heavily disguise what the list is doing and make it annoying to deploy against if you're hiding 100+ points in reserve plus whatever else is air dropping or is HD/Camo

 

So, had my first game of N4 last sunday, against morats on supplies.

My opponent was playing a raicho list with a vanguard /suryat HRL/kornak defensive core and various support (KHD zerat, gakis, REMs, daturazis), while I was playing the an hacking heavy Invincible Army list:

Spoiler

A bit memey, but I wanted to have fun with the yan huo DML haris and test hacking at the same time.

I won the initiative roll, and took first turn.

IA Turn1: I spent my first 2 orders moving a chayi around to get in repeater range of the KHD zerat and quickly put her down with the haidao KHD (some things never change). Then I spent most of my turn manoeuvring with the yan huo haris to hunt down the raicho who was blocking kokram from moving forward, and "only" managed to put him unconscious. My last few orders were used to move kokram forward, drop a repeater near kornak, spotlight him and fire one guided missile... which missed.

Morat Turn1: With both the raicho and zerat out of action, he could only use his daturazi and fireteam core which were pinned down by both the haidao sniper and kokram's repeater. All of his turn was spent dealing with those threats but at the end both kokram and the haidao were dead and the yan huo had suffered one wound against kornak, who was left in ARO.

IA Turn2: With kokram dead and no attack REM to get a repeater closer and/or brute force kornak, suddenly my list lacked some teeth. I spent my first few orders retreating with the haris (the yan huo couldn't engage korkak from further than 24", and 3 BS11 shots vs 2 at 17 is a pretty bad face to face), and then spent the remaining of my turn going throwing a lone zhanshi hacker at my opponent's core. After a successful tactical roll against an out of range flash pulse bot, she manage to sneak close enough to kornak to spotlight him (he had reseted at some point during morat first turn), and this time the missile pulverized him. I fiddle my troops around and move the daoying forward to prepare for a mad T3 rush to the objectives.

Morat Turn2: Loss of lieutenant for the morat player, and even though it's not such a big deal for morats it still cost him a few order. He started by trying to rush his daturazi at my yan huo, who quickly dispatched him with a missile. Likewise with a gaki who got nailed by my daoyingHe then used his morat vanguard hacker to kill my zhanshi hacker with his combi. Then he realized I had no ARO to stop Dr worm from reaching the Raicho... and put it back together. Yes, it was at this moment I knew I fucked up. The raicho put a wound on my zuyong, and threw mines around one of the supplies.

IA Turn3: The Raicho was back online but I still had a mission to do, so it was time for the risky moves. I started by sending the flash pulse REM on orbit with the yan huo, scoring 2 crits and a hit in the face to face for a grand total of 11 ARM roll (god that haris is hilarious). Moved forward, picked a box, killed the stranded vanguard hacker and then engaged the raicho with my yan-huo for the final showdown. But the hunter became the hunted, and the raicho scored a crit which simply pulverized the yan huo. In a last ditch effort, I gave the box to my zuyong and threw the haidao KHD at the remains of the morat core team stopping the daoying from picking a supply. The Haidao miraculously survived an EXP hit from the raicho, but didn't do anything to the fireteam. Another attempt, same result. In a last, LAST ditch effort, the daoying made a suicidal rush to the box, but got killed by the suryat HRL.

Morat Turn3: With nothing left to stop him, the raicho got on the move and fishied-off the haidao. Then a morat vanguard tried to have a go at my zuyong, but got crit and killed in the process. The suryat took his chance with his multi-pistol, but even though he didn't killed him either I failed my guts roll and had to move in line of sight of the raicho who quickly killed my heroic zuyong. The 2 last members of the morat core moved forward, picked up the box of the fallen zuyong and scored 2 classified on my nearby HVT, making it an 8-0 victory for the morats.

Final score: Morat 8-0 IA, with respectively 166 and 76 surviving points. Leaving the raicho unconscious and not finish it when I had the opportunity (and I had plenty) clearly cost me the victory, as I had the upper hand until that point. Still, I could've probably secured a victory If I had backed down after picking the supply on my last turn and just moved everything I had on ARO to stop my opponent from getting one as well, but I got too greedy.

Notes:

- KOKRAM IS SO DAMN GOOD

- YAN HUO DML HARIS IS SO DAMN FUN

- Hacking definitely works really well this edition, and my opponent stated it was an absolute nightmare to deal with it. The guided missile bot made the prospect of ending his turn with targeted units absolutely terrifying. My list could largely be improved in this regard though. Getting rid of the Yan huo haris to get more aggressive REM would make it easier to move repeater forward and let my daoying do her magic.

 

Can you use a Wildcard in the Yan Huo + Zuyong Special link?

 

Yes

 

They've hidden it deeper in this edition; template attacks need targets and you can't target camo.

I really dislike their inability to repeat important information (and use consistent language when they do repeat it)