What type of lists do you run with MO? Because people clearly don't understand how to run them since they are not winning with MO.
I can Understand your point and i've played to few matches to counter it. I can give my example of local meta, and admit that i'm really far from beeing a good playe. At the moment in our local meta we are 3, Me with MO, a Steel Phalanx One and one Vanilla Haquislam We have to play N4 , we always played N3 and those was the result. • Steel Phalanx player: he always annihilate me. With Eclipse granade he let my firepower quite useless, and i CC he is strongly superior. • Haquislam: he is more newbie player than me, so sometime he make some mistake i can take advantage too, but he have still some very strong pieces that can hurt me a lot. The general feeling while playng (N3) is that my models are the "old fashion and expensive car" and they got the "same car but more modern and better". In My local meta, so, the 15 model is not touched so i doubt i can take advantage of that. Said this i still have to play N4 matches, and i'll se how it goes, but after the changes the feeling i explaine with the "car" metaphor is still here. Every faction can do exactly what we do, but better. Except TAG. Edit: your signature in the forum BTW explain all. Maybe (i don't know you) you are an awesome player, that can win with a underbalanced Sectorial because of his skills. But i can bet that CB target is not only your kind of player, leaving an underpowered Sectiorial at the grasp of only skilled players.
It's probably worth having a look at the stickied Massed Armor Tactics thread, as that was written by @daboarder. https://forum.corvusbelli.com/threads/a-primer-on-massed-armour-tactics.804/
I have tried to teach others how to play it for years now. Instead of listening and learning i have just been subject to complaints that i either dont know what im talking about or that i play in a non-competitive meta. Both of which are laughable give the events ive won, the events ive placed at the top of and the players I play against. Everything Ive talked about in my massed armour primer still applies in principle and N4 has magnified those strengths while minimising the weaknesses of that style. Be aggressive both offensively and defensively, I dont mean rush the opponent but use your strengths, your high BS, you high power weaponry and your ARM and Wounds to apply pressure to your opponents. Take fights in reactive with SF states, BS13/14 and low burst high punch weaponry. If you fail you "might" take a wound, if you win you probably paste your opponent. Want an example, take this santiago AD, just drop it, drop it hard and fast, go right for the opponents LT or kill their cheerleaders, hit the em weaponry they might have or hunt their hackers. Find the 2 or 3 models in their army that your list will struggle with and kill them dead with it. That alone magnifies the impact of your HI on the table. Edit:familiarise yourself with the dice calc and find ways to push the odds further in your favour, a 50/50 shot of winning is a fight to take if you are rocking troops your opponent has to beat twice for it to stick, especially if they are using stuff that does when used once.
Yeah I've read that when he posted it. lol Maybe MO just requires a really different mindset. Going hardcore single combat group ultra aggressive. MO really doesn't work if you try to play more passively. The biggest issue I have with MO in N4 is that I look at IA and think, I can do the same style of gameplay but far more effectively. So why am I playing MO?
Now that i can agree with, MO is and must be playing a balls to the wall game taking fights. As an aside, compared to IA, MOs strengths are the same, but more focused in individual troops, more resilience in each entity, more damage output from each model and its own suite of toys that IA doesnt have.
After playing a few games with MO in n4 I can happily agree with these points. I've been having a blast so far cramming HI down my opponents throats and using profiles I previously overlooked or new profiles that changed.
Don't you think that the Santiago AD only having combat jump is a big risk. If your limited to just 1 combat group you can't really afford to take an EVO REM. While a PH13 roll is really good for an AD troop, theres still a good chance of failing the roll and thats 45 points that feel wasted. Or is the fact that its has a KHD and so is a specalists means its still a useful model? Or is this just the kind of gambles you have to accept to win with MO?
@daboarder my personal complain isn't that MO is weak, because it isn't. It might require more skill to use effectively, and to unlearn some "obvious" things about the game, (like how CoC "always needs" to be a 20-something pts light unit hidded safely in the back), but it can certainly be powerful, especially in Tactical Window enviroment. My complain is that changes to MO don't really follow any set system, and that other armies and similar units are created with more imagination and enthusiasm. What does Konstantinos bring to this army, compared to, say, Jazz, or Yara Haddad? (I want to try him in Haris with BSG Hospitallers, though) What are Infirmarers for? Why upgrades to Teutons consist of changing every other unit, so that Teutons get more unique by staying almost the same? Why was Santiagos' pricing left untouched, when compared to other HIs? Then we see how creative CB got with Asawira, or Evaders, or Morats, and it feels like MO was paid lip service, really. That they got some nice options, some units - like OS, or Montesa - got the changes they needed, but the rest was left mostly as it was. And that's why I'm saying that from my pov CB has no idea what to do with MO, and no heart for them. It is a risk, but I actually like this design. I think that there should be some high risk - high reward options in the game.
Warming up a little to MO lately, oddly enough without running footslogging Knights or their Links. It's all KOJ + OS Link (Paramedic rework and MSV2 Spit improved that by a lot) AP C+ Tik, Bike, Joan, Trinitaries... Magister + Santiago still has that annoying issue that you're gonna need a Lt somewhere else or you're running a Lt up the table. Main problem with not taking Joan remains the Lt. If you want to run a HI Link, you're better off taking a look at Sval. Hospitaler Haris, Orc Haris, Orc Core... Being able to slot Karhus (Feuerbach, Engineer, Paramedic) and KOJs anywhere is amazing. Building a group 1 that can mix and match into a different Core, Haris and potentially Duo every game makes it flexible too. C+ Orcs and Karhu tie the whole thing together. Getting a Varg Sensor Wild Parrot in the mix just makes it better. Wanna play Links in PanO? Sval got you fam.
Fun fact: Remember how Pano players have clamored for a linkable engineer option and then at long last we got the linkable options for the machinists with varuna, which is real nice if limited. Well, N4 wildcard Karhu's have given us what we've long asked for. The dream is real baby! A linkable engineer that IS NOT a machnists. I mean, of course it has MSV because this pano but still. THE DREAM IS REAL! Its funny how wildcard karhus completely changes my whole perception of SWF. lol
Well, everyone is saying that N4 SWF is Karhu all the way. I fear seeing how the Bagh-Mari in ASA will look like....
Marksmanship Bagh-Mari would be crazy good, and also too similar to Bolts. But I wouldn't mind seeing some options with FD and 1-use Camo. Starting with Rao.
Just kill Rao and give all Bagh Mari Wip 14 and assault pistols Same with Kirpal, kill him and give all Akalis Assault Pistols CC20 and MA2, maybe an NCO profile or something Killing characters and buffing their units worked once already, might as well make it Acon's signature move And I'm only half joking this time, I'd take that deal, but I wrote so of course I would.
You joke, but just last night I played a game with an Akal Commando and found myself thinking that the same thing, but with an unhackable Specialist option, a bit more close-range punch and a nice CC Special Skill would be just the ticket. N4 did the impossible; make me want Kirpal Singh. I'd definitely be down with killing off some/most of PanO's character options for a few profile buffs on similar units, but sadly CB seems to disagree judging by their recent history of releases.
Tourist here, does SWF make a bit more sense after N4? I don't have a deep understanding of PanO but most of the new Kaldstrom and Beyond Kaldstrom units all seemed strangely dull to me at their release. What are the SWF list archetypes worth remembering?
