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Linked Jammers: Super-broken, now in White Banner

Discussion in 'Access Guide to the Human Sphere' started by Savnock, Mar 26, 2020.

  1. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    Always pivot to make the model do what's best in the situation. You don't just give up on a troop because one thing it does isn't useful that game, and I know you know that. Having the ability to one hit power units after hacking them is good. Being able to hide that you can hack is good. Having the holo-echos helps that. He doesn't become useless if that doesn't come in to play.
    I don't know if they come together right now but the parts are there on the Kanren, so it can happen in the future if it hasn't already.
     
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  2. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    Everything is an investment and investing into the Kanren for this particular role is going to be detrimental to winning in most games. Again, this doesn't mean that the Kanren is so bad that their melee ability is "useless" (in comparison to a Zuyong or Fusilier in melee whom are both shockingly similarly useful in melee), but that taking the Kanren and putting it on a pedestal and saying "Look! Mono CCW! It's nearly breaking the game" is a bit much.
    Don't try to melee a Kanren with your Cutter, give it a tiny bit extra space, and you'll be fine. You don't need to respect it the way you need to respect the melee ability of a Crane, Sheeskin, or Neko Oyama, but you need to respect it a bit.

    There is a scale of usefulness and while almost nothing will hit 0 out of 5 "literally can't roll a dice" (so to speak) there are actually units that are going to hit 1 or 2 on that scale. Maybe Kanren is 3 for melee skill, but 3 is a bit low when you could invest those orders in a 5 out of 5...
     
  3. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    The guy was already taking the Kanren the only investment is the AHD.
     
  4. Mahtamori

    Mahtamori Well-Known Member

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    I think I've lost track of the plot. Weren't we segwaying about how Kanren is or isn't the best thing since meatballs because it has a mono ccw?
     
  5. toadchild

    toadchild Premeasure

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    Monofilament did get a nerf in N4 as a result of the changes to crits.

    N3:
    Regular hit, mono kills: 60%
    Critical hit, mono kills: 100%

    N4:
    Regular hit, mono kills: 60%
    Critical hit, mono kills: 84%

    Extended table based on the possibility of Kitsune using MA 5 to swing twice and double-crit:
    1 save kills: 60%
    2 saves kill: 84%
    3 saves kill: 94%
    4 saves kill: 97%
     
  6. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    No I was confused that he was on the list of guys that have a mono but can't use it. I think of it as a nice bonus on an un-optimized unit so he has something to take advantage of instead of just being worse.
     
  7. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    You're getting "can't" with "won't" confused. You can use it, but 99% of the time a gameplan that doesn't involve using it is more likely to win you the game.
     
  8. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    That means the same thing to me. Also people keep telling me that about the Bandit and I know that isn't true from experience, so I'm a bit suspicious.
     
  9. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps english isn't your first language, let me try again. Can't means it's impossible, won't means there's a choice involved.

    Take football as an example. You could attempt to kick a goal from one end of the pitch to the other, it is possible to score doing that and it's even happened in competition. However, no team legitimately tries to do this when it happens it's just a total fluke. You can do this, but you won't even attempt it because it doesn't make sense to try doing it if you're aiming to win.

    I'm not sure why you keep bringing up the bandit, that unit has Camo so it's an actual credible melee threat as it can actually gap close. Holoprojectors only cause people to rethink shooting at them in ARO if the unit under the marker has a credible shooting threat like a buffed Lu Duan has. A BS12 mook with a combi/shotgun shooting in shitty rangebands and no visor is not going to make an ARO piece think twice about picking a target and shooting him.
     
    #629 Triumph, Apr 29, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2020
  10. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    "Can I go to the bathroom?"
    "I don't know, CAN you?"
    Everyone loved that teacher, keep it up.
     
  11. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    I also hope that the many actual ESL speakers here don't stress out about seeing it used as an insult. With context around a sentence English is really easy to understand for us when we're not being intentionally obtuse.
     
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  12. meikyoushisui

    meikyoushisui Competitor for Most Ignored User

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    To be fair, this distinction has pretty gone away in modern American English. Some languages don't have this distinction at all -- potential verbs are how you ask for permission pretty much universally in my second language.

    But most languages do have grammatical markers for things that are impossible and things that are possible but not chosen.
     
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  13. Triumph

    Triumph Well-Known Member

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    I'd only take it as an insult if english actually is your first language and you're failing to understand why the Kanren isn't considered a melee threat by a melee themed faction. If it is your second language, well there's another attempt at an explanation for you.
     
  14. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    This is so stupid.
     
    #634 loricus, Apr 30, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2020
  15. Zewrath

    Zewrath Elitist Jerk

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    *Looks at thread title*

    *Looks at posts about Kanren, mono CCW and English grammar*

    [​IMG]
     
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  16. Teslarod

    Teslarod when in doubt, Yeet

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    You know what, I'm warming up to having our own Ugandan Knuckles meme on the forums.
    Teaching people "his way" instead of just using what social convention, game theory or just the commonly used English language IRL provides.

    Tell me more about the things the Brits, Australians and US guys I talk to on a daily basis just casually do wrong every day.

    Still not interested in the game advice though.
    Based on the simple fact that I ran demo games on how to reliably kill a Gorgos with an Oniwaban turn one. Not using Superior Infiltration, Crits don't auto wound, old Mates to automatically eat the first successful hit, Gorgos screened by Mines + Makaul + MSV2 Sniper ARO. Several tries, JSA deploys second and only switches up Reserve Piece deployment while Tohaa are allowed to redeploy everything.
    Infinity is a beatiful tactical game with many, many options if you can piece it all together properly.
     
    #636 Teslarod, Apr 30, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2020
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  17. Stuffist

    Stuffist Well-Known Member

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    You probably also should look at the page number those posts are.
    We're in the same situation as:
     
  18. Barrogh

    Barrogh Well-Known Member

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    I'll raise you another challenge to supplement all those "game mods" you were using for this kind of tactical mini-game (which is pretty cool btw):
    You must find someone actually willingly using Gorgos without game scenario explicitly telling them to :P

    (Please consider this a shitpost; I'm not actually making a serious comment on unit viability)
     
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  19. Nuada Airgetlam

    Nuada Airgetlam Nazis sod off ///

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    Here! :D
     
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