1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Learning to play QK

Discussion in 'Haqqislam' started by AssaultUnicorn, Sep 16, 2019.

  1. AssaultUnicorn

    AssaultUnicorn KTS is the best unit

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    392
    Likes Received:
    401
    Yeah, Ghulams are still one of the best core links in QK. For the record, Kaplans have a very good Haris option, it's just that I oftentimes over-extend them on turn 1 and get them killed. I need to exercise restraint and have a solid attack force to which KTS Haris serves as a support/replacement.
     
  2. Capo.Paint

    Capo.Paint Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2018
    Messages:
    253
    Likes Received:
    327
    That is how I use the spitfire from times to times. The main attack is done by the Djanbazan HMG, which doesn*t tend to overextend himself that much and in turn two or three, the Kaplan pops up where needed and eleminates what is left. In most cases, the mimetism is quite nice here, because MSVs are gone or somewhere else in action.
     
    AssaultUnicorn likes this.
  3. AssaultUnicorn

    AssaultUnicorn KTS is the best unit

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    392
    Likes Received:
    401
    I had a couple of games recently. Both against new RTF and Yu Jing players.

    Eh
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    AZRA'IL Feuerbach / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 39)
    ODALISQUE Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 30)
    GHULAM (Deployable Repeater) Rifle + Light Shotgun, E/Mauler / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)
    LEILA SHARIF Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Shock Marksman Rifle, D-Charges / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 20)
    GHULAM (NCO) Rifle + Light Grenade Launcher (Normal and Smoke Ammo.) / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 16)
    GHULAM Doctor Plus (MediKit) Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 16)
    GHULAM Lieutenant Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    HAWWA' (Forward Observer) Boarding Shotgun, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    SEKBAN Doctor Plus (MediKit) Boarding Shotgun, Chain-colt / Pistol, Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 24)
    YUAN YUAN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, Shock CCW. (0 | 8)

    3.5 SWC | 200 Points

    Open in Infinity Army


    I decided to step up my ARO game a bit and this lead me to the big fat Azra'il Feuerbach. He can take a lot of punishment under right circumstances. The rest of the list is gonna be a solid Ghulam Core with Leila and Odalisque Spitfire. Hawwa FO for the midfield objective grabbing, Sekban Doc+ to do the same job since he's FDL1. A Yuan Yuan being an irregular order is somewhat mitigated by having your Lt. order for the NCO.

    The opponent's list was something like this:

    Ramah Taskforce
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]10
    KHAWARIJ (Fatality L2) Spitfire / Pistol, AP CCW. (1.5 | 32)
    KHAWARIJ (Fatality L1, Multispectral Visor L2) Mk12 / Pistol, AP CCW. (0.5 | 36)
    NAFFATÛN Lieutenant Rifle + Light Flamethrower, Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    NAFFATÛN Rifle + Light Flamethrower, Grenades / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    NAFFATÛN Rifle + Heavy Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)
    GHULAM (NCO) Rifle + Light Grenade Launcher (Normal and Smoke Ammo.) / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 16)
    FANOUS REMOTE Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    FANOUS REMOTE Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    NAHAB Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Submachine Gun + E/Mitter, Nanopulser / Pistol, Viral CC Weapon, Knife. (0 | 30)
    TUAREG Doctor Plus (MediKit) Rifle + Light Shotgun, Antipersonnel Mines / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 33)

    3 SWC | 200 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    NCO seems to be the Ghulam unit both of us like on these small-scale games. Other than that, it is all good old reliable Khawarij Mk12 core with a lone Spitfire guy. He recently bought Tuareg and Nahab and wanted to test them out, hence why they showed up on his list.

    I won the initiative and decided to go for the objective grabbing first turn. I was hoping my Azra'il would endure most of the post-turn-one punishment and that the Yuan Yuan will be a nice finger-in-the-eye distraction. She already had several good airborne infiltration spots.

    [​IMG]

    Sekban to grab the left crate, Hawwa FO to grab the second one. Core link to secure the central one around turn 2/3. The opponent covered my Sekban with his linked Khawarij Mk12 while keeping his flashbots and Spitfire in total cover. I deployed Azra'il prone to cover the enemy link team and the Doc+.

    Qapu Khalqi

    The Yuan Yuan airborne-infiltrated on the left flank right next to the enemy link and rolled up some E/M grenades. I smoked my approach and then tried speculative-firing on the Khawarij to also catch a Naffatun and the NCO in the blast. I failed the roll and then decided to end my speculative fire shenanigans on that. I went through the smoke to see the Khawarij Mk12. I pointed out that if he shoots me this close, I will be able to respond with my chain rifle and hit three of his link members.

    [​IMG]

    So the link decides to dodge, Khawarij in particular dodges to the Yuan Yuan's direction.

    [​IMG]

    All of them successfully stop paying attention to Sekban's crate which allowed him to go for the objective and grab it. I do the same for my Al Hawwa. Before that, I spent a couple of orders smoking the crates with my NCO just make sure my specialists don't bump into any TO AROs. I then spend two coordinated orders moving my crate carriers out of the midfield into cover. This is where I make my first mistake. I position my Sekban like this:

    [​IMG]

    I was REALLY concerned that the spitfire Khawarij would go through the middle of the map and try shooting the Sekban from the right flank, so I went for the cover that would protect him from the attack on the right. What I should have done is place him near that rocky terrain so that he has the partial cover on more than one flank. I also decide not to spend any more orders on my Yuan Yuan (probably another error on my part) and instead reposition the link team a little bit into the midfield, covering their approaches with an E/Mauler.

    [​IMG]

    Ramah TaskForce

    The spitfire Khawarij sees the Yuan Yuan and destroys her in one go. He then shuffles a little bit and shoots my Sekban Doc+. He then jumps up into the second floor of the midfield building in order for my Azra'il to have no elevation cover and spends two orders trying to kill Azra'il who dies on the second order to a crit and two failed armor rolls. He then jumps down near the crate my Sekban looted and goes into suppression fire. His link team repositions a little bit.

    Qapu Khalqi

    The link team goes towards the midfield roof, Leila takes the loot from Al Hawwa. They proceed to pick up the central crate with Ghulam Doc an then cover the crate with another E/Mauler. The NCO closes the distance to the suppressing Khawarij and speculative fires on him. The red turban decides to not break suppression and gets knocked out by the grenade.

    [​IMG]

    I spend the remaining orders rolling everyone back into the defensive position.

    Ramah TaskForce

    Tuareg Doc+ appears and revies the Khawarij who then goes on the murder spree and knocks out the NCO and the E/Mauler Ghulam. The Tuareg then rolls out and picks up Sekban's loot, staying right where the dead soldier lied. The Khawarij Spitfire then drops prone and goes into suppression fire again.

    [​IMG]

    Qapu Khalqi

    I spend some orders moving the Odalisque up the stairs while reviving the E/Mauler with my Doc+. The Odalisque then goes up against the Khawarij and fries him with to death her nanopulser. The Doc+ goes up and revives the NCO who then reforms the link and spends his only remaining LT order to target the Tuareg and hit him with 4 dice on 8s. The Tuareg dodges successfully, so that's two looted crates for me in case nothing goes wrong.

    [​IMG]

    Ramah TaskForce

    Naturally, it doesn't go as planned, and the Nahab appears on the right side of the table. He sees the Al Hawwa and cybermasks himself to proceed towards the link. The Hawwa discovers him, Nahab tries to shoot him with his SMG, but he tanks the armor saves and goes into partial cover. I point out that he is very close to my Leila KHD. So the Nahab goes towards the rocky cover, appears in Leila's ZoC and tries frying her while taking a hit from Hawwa's BSG and going into NWI. I decide to do a DataScan classified objective on him (which I should've done earlier with the Khawarij Spitfire being so close) instead of redruming him in return. I rolled a 5, and he rolled a 2 and a 13. Had it been the Redrum, I would've killed the Nahab with that roll, but since he didn't have any -3 penalties, it turned the other way around, and my Leila died, dropping the objective. The Nahab then spends the remaining order cleaving my Hawwa in two with his Viral CCW, and that was the game: a 1-1 draw.

    Learning points:

    – Use cover responsibly.
    – Don't get greedy for Objective Points.
    – Your warband is useless if an enemy can safely dispose of them on their active turn. This goes double for enemy rosters where the Lieutenant is hidden in the link team.

    This one is a different IA player who had been collecting both the Invincibles and the ISS. I created the list based on my ISS experience with him (Su-Jian rambo and Kuang Shis). I was surprised when he brought the Invincible Army.

    I created the list for the second-turn shenanigans specifically.

    Capture and Protect
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    GROUP 1[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]10
    JANISSARY Akbar Doctor (MediKit) AP Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 41)
    JANISSARY Missile Launcher / Pistol, CC Weapon. (2 | 37)
    HAFZA Heavy Rocket Launcher / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 18)
    HAFZA Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 16)
    WILD BILL Contender / 2 MULTI Pistols, Knife. (0 | 25)
    ODALISQUE Spitfire, Nanopulser / Pistol, Knife. (1 | 30)
    GHULAM Lieutenant Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    FANOUS REMOTE Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    FANOUS REMOTE Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    FANOUS REMOTE Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)

    GROUP 2[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]4 [​IMG]2 [​IMG]2
    DJANBAZAN Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 31)
    KAMEEL (Minesweeper, Repeater) Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    HAWWA' Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 26)
    YUAN YUAN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 9)
    YUAN YUAN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 9)
    GHULAM (Deployable Repeater) Rifle + Light Shotgun, E/Mauler / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 14)

    5.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    Janissary ML in the link to soak up the first-turn damage and be replaced by the Hafza, Djanbazan Sniper for extreme-range AROs, Odalisque Spitfire for active-turn kills, Bill and Hafza HRL for mid-range defense. Ghulam E/Mauler to guard the beacon. The Hawwa AHD is there mostly in order to field remotes, but he also ended up being useful against this HI-intensive army.

    The opponent's list was this:

    Invincible Army
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1
    DĀOYĪNG Lieutenant L2 Boarding Shotgun / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    HǍIDÀO Hacker (Killer Hacking Device) Boarding Shotgun / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (0 | 26)
    HǍIDÀO (Multispectral Visor L2) MULTI Sniper / Breaker Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 37)
    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Haris, Tactical Awareness) Combi Rifle + 1 TinBot B (Deflector L2) / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (0.5 | 34)
    ZÚYŎNG (Fireteam: Duo, Tactical Awareness) HMG / 2 Breaker Pistols, Knife. (1.5 | 38)
    KOKRAM FTO (Fireteam: Duo) Combi Rifle + E/Mitter, Chain-colt, E/Mauler / 2 Heavy Pistols, Knife. (0 | 39)
    SHÀNG JÍ (Tactical Awareness) Spitfire / Pistol, Shock CCW. (2 | 45)
    CHAĪYÌ Yaókòng Flash Pulse, Sniffer / Electric Pulse. (0 | 8)
    WARCOR (360º Visor) Flash Pulse / Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 3)
    TAI SHENG (Chain of Command) Mk12, Chain-colt, Stun Grenades / Heavy Pistol, Knife. (0 | 49)

    5.5 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army


    He picked up that list from someone in our community and decided to try it out, but it was clear he had very little experience with fireteam rules. More on that later.

    We both picked up Net Undermine as our classifieds. I won the initiative and picked the side of the table. The opponent elected to go first. So far, everything is going as planned.

    [​IMG]

    The camo marker on the rooftop is his Lt. This deployment is pretty poor, but it's only due to the opponent's lack of experience with wildcards in fireteams.

    I deployed second.

    [​IMG]

    The Djanbazan had his eyes on the prone enemy Lt. His position would have been safer if picked on top of the purple building on the left, but I really wanted to make the opponent nervous. Janissary ML would cover the right flank, the Sniper would cover the middle and some of the left flank. The Hawwa will stay on top of his position to scare everyone with his AHD programs.

    My DataTracker was the Akbar Doc, his was Kokram.

    Invincible Army

    First thing's first, the Haidao MSR knocks out my Djanbazan Sniper. An expected outcome considering that I positioned him so aggressively, but I couldn't pass up that camoed Lt.

    [​IMG]

    Kokram's Duo shuffles into the midfield only to get caught in my Assault Hacker's ZoC. He attempts to Oblivion them in order to break the link and have him spend some command tokens but I fail.

    [​IMG]

    The Duo gets out of my Hawwa's ZoC safely and then the lone Haidao KHD goes to Hawwa and fries him with the Redrum. The Duo then stops in the midfield on the left near a crate after trying to kill the flash bot without success (it critted the HMG and stunned him).

    [​IMG]

    Shang Ji in the 3-man link then goes into the midfield with Tai Sheng and TacAware Zuyong, trying to stay out of the line of fire of my linked ML. He then goes into the open and tries shooting the ML Janissary.

    [​IMG]

    The ML takes a wound, but then the opponent discovers that he has no regular orders left – only the TacAware Zuyong has one, and he has to be the link leader. So he tries to reposition the Shang Ji while not having him as the link leader, leaving my Janissary an unopposed shot that kills the power-armored soldier with three failed armor rolls.

    Qapu Khalqi

    Everything went as planned, but I found that my E/Mauler Ghulam was in the wrong group and he had to be shuffled into the first combat group, so that was -2 Command Tokens for me. Yuan Yuans dropped in the enemy DZ. One of them dispersed safely behind a flash bot and the haidao khd, (E/M CCW) while the other one (Panzerfaust) landed behind the Haidao Sniper.

    [​IMG]

    The Panzerfaust guy tried running towards Haidao and slashing him with his DA CCW, but the sniper successfully shot him. The E/M CCW girl went towards the KHD and chain rifled him and the flash bot, but the enemy changed facing successfully. The flash bot got knocked out though. The link then rolls out and goes towards what remains of the midfield link team. Wild Bill unloads into the TacAware Zuyong and headshots both wounds off him. He then proceeds to shoot Tai Sheng who in turn crits him with the Stun Grenade.

    [​IMG]

    We switch positions for Hafza HRL who kills Tai Sheng with the Assault Pistol. Her dropping body frees up the line of sight to the Haidao KHD who is turned away from them. Then I move my E/Mauler Ghulam to first cover the beacon with a mine and then I go near Kokram's Duo and plant another E/Mauler around the corner. I spend the remaining orders moving Bill and the Akbar Doc on the second floor while leaving the HRL on the corner. Both him and Bill got their eyes on the Haidao KHD.

    The remaining two orders in Group 2 go into my Djanbazan getting revived with his Regeneration and then trying to shoot something with him. Kokram was in his line of fire even as he was regenerating, but he chose not to ARO because of the E/Mauler right under his feet.

    [​IMG]

    The last order sees the Djanbazan trying to discover the prone Daoying within 32" from him. She decides to attack in response only to find that her pistol and BSG are all out of range for the attack, so the sniper shoots her unopposed and knocks her out cold. Haidao Sniper couldn't see any of it because of the fact that he turned around to shoot the Yuan Yuan.

    Invincible Army

    Being in LoL with both the Lt. and the CoC soldier in a null state, there was very little the opponent could do. So he decides to knock out the remaining Yuan Yuan and does exactly that while tanking the armor saves from the chain rifle, contender, and the hit-mode HRL (!!!). Then Kokram tries shooting the Ghulam E/Mauler who plants another mine as twin heavy pistols crit him into oblivion and the second E/Mauler bricks both Krit and HMG.

    [​IMG]

    This leaves him with no orders to go towards the beacon.

    Qapu Khalqi

    I move my link team down from the building and try shooting the Haidao KHD with my Hafza Rocket Launcher. The Haidao crits me, so now I need to spend another order to revive him and reform the link. Second try: I miss all shots, Haidao lands his and clips both Hafza and Janissary ML, knocking out the latter. I spend no orders trying to revive him. Instead, I move out my Odalisque in the open and finally pepper Haidao with bullets. I then go towards the beacon while also making the Net Undermine classified. I roll towards the Haidao MSR and detach Bill from the rest of the link team to kill him. The remaining three units: Hafza, Odalisque, and Doc – stand base to base with the enemy beacon while Bill goes up the ladder and challenges the Haidao MSR who goes into NWI and drops prone. I then spend the remaining orders in group 2 to reposition the Djanbazan so that he sees Haidao MSR in case he wants to stand up.

    Invincible Army

    Haidao MSR tries shooting Wild Bill with his breaker pistol and manages to drop him into NWI. He probably should have spent his last order to try killing the Akbar Doctor in order to deny me the DataTracker bonuses. I had to basically do nothing to win the game, so we called it there.

    Qapu Khalqi wins 9-0.

    A rather one-sided game. Honestly, the only takeaway I can get here is that I need to place my AROs more carefully. Djanbazan being able to stand up turn 2 was very cool, but I wouldn't deploy him so aggressively if not for the fact that the enemy Lt. was right in the open. Otherwise, I had a nice tall building on the left flank that would have suited my ARO game much better. And also, I guess, I should have dropped the E/Mauler Ghulam in group 1 right from the getgo, without having to burn through my CTs that could have otherwise been used on reforming the link. This would've allowed me to leave the Janissary ML in my DZ and include a regular Hafza.

    As for my opponent – that's one of his first games of Infinity, and he currently is learning the advanced rules. The main takeaway for him is to check the fireteam compositions for IA and to not overextend into the midfield.
     
    #83 AssaultUnicorn, Mar 4, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2020
    Capo.Paint and loricus like this.
  4. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    2,469
    Likes Received:
    2,613
    @AssaultUnicorn do you think it's worth trying to smoke cover against TO? If they activate in reaction they are compromising their expensive unit using up hidden deployment and their token state. If they aren't facing you or would choose not to risk it for a rifle hit on 14 it would be a waste of orders. It would be a coin flip on who dies if anyone, the reactive player would be making a bad move imo.
     
    AssaultUnicorn likes this.
  5. AssaultUnicorn

    AssaultUnicorn KTS is the best unit

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    392
    Likes Received:
    401
    That is a valid point, actually. I haven't played with that opponent enough games to know how he would use his TO troops. And I haven't played against much TO camo in general, safe a Noctifer+Sphinx list. So yeah, smoking Hawwa's objective was excessive indeed. As for that of Sekban's, I still think it's worth it since there was one linked Naffatun in the distance watching the crate.
     
    loricus likes this.
  6. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    2,469
    Likes Received:
    2,613
    I find that baiting out a TO troop is usually to my advantage, unless they are specialized for it like a sniper. While I'll give SK troops snipers most people with a Tuareg will be using it as a specialist, so revealing it would give you a chance to get their late game scorer as well.
    Of course if they do have a sniper your BS could be down to 1 and you're relying on a risky dodge and, if they aren't coming from their DZ, you might not have a guy that can clear it without walking half-way up the board. That's part of knowing your opponent.
     
  7. Ariwch

    Ariwch Tournament benthotic lurker

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2018
    Messages:
    393
    Likes Received:
    373
    Next time you can move with your first YY into B2B from blind zone (or smoke), than join him with the second guy and coordinate CC with AP CCW against the big metal lump :)
     
  8. Space Ranger

    Space Ranger Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2018
    Messages:
    5,931
    Likes Received:
    5,079
    I've learned sometimes the best thing to do with YY in Ikari, is to just set them up in the deployment zone with the rest of the troops. Just like a Shaolin or Jaguars, they are just there to drop smoke on the Brawler MSV or Rui Shi.. In QKs case its the Djanbazan.
     
    Barrogh likes this.
  9. Doa

    Doa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2017
    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    114
    Speaking from a tournament point of view I can't find a better ft core than djambazan
    Waht do you think about it?
     
  10. AssaultUnicorn

    AssaultUnicorn KTS is the best unit

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    392
    Likes Received:
    401
    It's pretty solid, especially with all the cheap hafzas and odalisque SMG. The main problem is, nowadays you often see people playing sectorials with core fireteams, so in this regard, considering that you often confront your link with the enemy link, a Djanbazan HMG in core, even if firing through smoke, is going to be fired back at without any penalties Turn 1. The Janissary core can absolutely bust some heads, the Ghulam core is cheap as chips and allows fielding some other expensive toys like a TAG, so the Djanbazan core is somewhere in the middle in terms of price. The main thing with Djanbazans is to not over-extend them into the midfield since they are still one-wound models. If going second, I would try sliding in an expendable Djanbazan Sniper to do some AROs, die on Turn 1, and then be replaced by a cheap Hafza. After that, if you have a spare order in that group, spend it to regenerate the sniper, so that he AROs on his own, and even if he dies, you just got a free spot in your combat group if you want to fill it next turn.
     
  11. Doa

    Doa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2017
    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    114
    Yes, the best option for ft core are djams, ghulam and maybe jannizzeries
    Ghulam core is more a defensive ft and qk do not have an hard hitter. Best options are kaplan or Djam Haris(azrail, although I love the unit, isn't something scary) but personally I prefer to attack with +3bs bonus.
    Jannizzeries ft is good in limited insertion, otherwise you pay too much the hmg and the doctor(speaking about 2 Jan and odalisques+hafza)
    Qk have some decent aro pieces, 3 fanous, warcor, Shihab. Individually aren't strong unit but their role is about consuming opponent order. And if you fight a ft you must rely more on higher burst than higher bs(and all pieces with bs 14/15 cost almost twice than a Djam)
    Maybe a Kaplan core could be a good bet but you must rely too often on your multisniper(and his low burst) before shooting with spitfire/adhesive launcher.
    I had give a chance to druze ft but is too expensive and really takes all swc(msr, hmg, gl)
    Obviously is only my opinion
     
    Capo.Paint likes this.
  12. AssaultUnicorn

    AssaultUnicorn KTS is the best unit

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    392
    Likes Received:
    401
    I'm gonna try them out once I get the minis from the painter. Specifically, I want to use the linked LGL on a target that is marked with Spotlight from Al Hawwa. Although in that scenario, even a single LGL guy would suffice, hitting a targeted enemy on nothing less than 12s.

    Kaplan core is just too damn expensive for my taste. I honestly tried to make them work, but the lack of HMG profile and hafza/odalisque linkability is a big detriment. Then add to it the fact that, although you can put your linked MSR and then replace it with another unlinked Kaplan – that Kaplan costs 23 points minimum, and at this point, you are approaching Limited Insertion with such a Core link layout. So right now I use Bill and Spitfire haris. Maybe I should also give a try to haris with MSR for active turn sniping from the deployment zone. Three dices on 12s against an enemy that is out of range almost always guarantee winning the face to face rolls. Well, unless your dice are cancerous of course.
     
  13. Doa

    Doa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2017
    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    114
    Yes the Kaplan unit "need" an hmg but I can understand why cb doesn't give them that weapons. Mimetism and having good specialist are their strenght, infact often I choose them(engineer and doctor) like solo pieces
    Never played Bill(it seems to me too fragile) but put he in a link and you have a spitfire with no swc cost
    About shooting to a targeted unit with druze, I am not so sure will be a great tactic (unless you play with 20 regular orders) because you need a lot of order to put al al hawwa in right spot(shoot against a dodge). Targeting a ft core is just too risky(if they shoot at you probably will be an ftf with same odds)
    Even with druze more than targeting someone with hunzakuts I prefer launch assisted fire and then shoot at 18 with clipper(to something in non positive range)
     
  14. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,272
    Likes Received:
    3,915
    My 0,02 dinar on Kaplan would be they are very good and very versatile.

    Sure, a HMG would be welcome for a long-range punch, but Spitfire is often good enough replacement. And for those real long-range jobs, I use a MSR. A linked MSR, with a full Fireteam behind it, with a BS 12 & Mimetism operator... tends to get the job done. Especially when in Cover.
    Typical job to do is taking out enemy TR HMG bots, snipers (especially lone, skirmishing-type ones) and ML operators.

    As for Wild Bill, I do see a role for him in an offensive Kaplan Haris - he does great as a short-range gunfighter. He's great for room-to-room fighting on distances well-suited for his pistols. Apart fom that, he doesn't offer noticeable advantage over a Kaplan.
    At least - that's how he did work for me.
     
    Stiopa and AssaultUnicorn like this.
  15. Capo.Paint

    Capo.Paint Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2018
    Messages:
    253
    Likes Received:
    327
    I see no reason to take the Druze core in QK. I am missing the MSR profile and can't add other utility-units. They are not shooting better than Djanbazans and are not really better equipped. The EM-launcher is so situational, that the link-benefits won't justify the costs. Better take an other core and add the EM guy alone or in a duo with the SMR or KHD.
     
  16. Doa

    Doa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2017
    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    114
    Druze and djams have different role.
    Druze are the hard hitters, hmg and msr with damage 16, smr, e/m lgl and combi with damage 14, your opponent is slightly more concerned about your bs attack
    Djams fight with camos, tos, odds and all units that give you visual malus
     
  17. AssaultUnicorn

    AssaultUnicorn KTS is the best unit

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    392
    Likes Received:
    401
    I had a custom game of "Boarding Action" from our "Echo of Paradiso" campaign just for funzies. I played against a seasoned CA player.

    So the mission was to have more specialists up the midfield and kill more army points and specialists. There was also a central 16" exclusion zone and a 4" dead zone with 12" DZs on each side. Basically it was Firefight with some Frontline mixed in. There were also rules on +1 SWC, +3 to dodge on anyone who is not the line infantry, +1 damage on template weapons, with the addition of Zero-G troops gaining Airborne Infiltration. Oh and also we had Limited Insertion. With all these things in mind, we proceeded.

    Boarding Action
    ──────────────────────────────────────────────────

    [​IMG]9 [​IMG]1 [​IMG]1
    IGUANA HMG, Heavy Flamethrower / . (2 | 75)
    [​IMG] IGUANA OPERATOR HMG / Pistol, Knife. ()
    DJANBAZAN Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 31)
    AZRA'IL Feuerbach / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 39)
    GHULAM Lieutenant Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 12)
    JANISSARY Akbar Doctor (MediKit) AP Rifle + Light Shotgun / Pistol, CCW. (0 | 41)
    HAWWA' (Forward Observer) Boarding Shotgun, D-Charges / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 21)
    SEKBAN Spitfire / Pistol, Stun Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 27)
    SEKBAN Heavy Rocket Launcher, Chain-colt / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 23)
    SEKBAN (Fireteam: Haris) AP Rifle, Chain-colt / Pistol, Stun Pistol, Knife. (0 | 22)
    YUAN YUAN Chain Rifle, Smoke Grenades / Pistol, DA CCW. (0 | 9)

    7 SWC | 300 Points

    Open in Infinity Army

    I tried my best to set it up to be as defensive as possible, and I think the main trap I got in was Sekban Haris that was supposed to move out from the table edge and start shooting whoever has overextended in the back. That is, provided I survive that long. I had some alternative ways of dealing with the scenario if I go second, like placing an E/Mauler guy, but that would leave some points gap in my list. In short: it's kind of a mess. Shooty-murdery missions tend to include TAGs, so I should have gone for the Hawwa AHD at the very least. Live and learn!

    I don't remember the list of my opponent since all I ever fought in that game was the Avatar!

    I lost the initiative and my opponent took the first turn. I placed whoever I could in the defensive positions: Djanbazan on the rooftop, Azra'il covering the Avatar right from the getgo. Akbar Doc right behind Azra'il to patch him up. I placed my Yuan Yuan in the DZ which was a big mistake (rolled up Adhesive Launcher). Iggy was in the farthest corner of the table, behind the building Djanbazan had occupied. Al Hawwa was the closest to the midfield, followed by Yuan Yuan. I placed Hawwa prone on the roof in 16" from the DZ to scare the TAG with the prospect of eating an AHD program.

    The enemy Avatar deployed in the middle, there were also two Daturazi, a hidden Noctifer, a Caliban CoC, an Imetron, and a TR bot.

    CA

    Daturazi move out impetuously and don't trigger any AROs. The Avatar idles, my Azra'il, knowing that he'd be hitting on 7s, decides to dodge, and then gets pummeled into Unconscious in one go. Probably should have taken a shot. The Avatar then moves into the line of sight of the Djanbazan and they exchange shots, both hitting on 15s or less. Djanbazan gets knocked out as well. The TAG then slices the corner and shoots the Yuan Yuan straight into dead. He then goes on top of the rooftop and tries shooting the prone Akbar Doc who in turn shoots him with his AP rifle and crits. He spends a couple of orders more finishing the Akbar Doc off and doing the In Extremis classified on Azra'il's corpse. He then reaches my Iggy and blows it up, the operator catapults into the Total Cover a bit further away from the enemy TAG.

    QK

    I play my trump card and move my Sekbans out of the sector the Avatar hadn't covered at the end of its turn. I spend my CT forming the Haris and move my Sekban AP Rifle to shoot the Avatar in the back within my good distance. Two shots connect, one of them being a crit, the other one is successfully saved. The Avatar changes facing. I move my link team so that the HRL guy observes the long diagonal firelane crossing the midfield while still having my AP rifle guy as the link leader. Seeing the HRL Sekban, a Noctifer appears on the roof and tries to shoot him with the spitfire guy, but the shot is over 40", so he misses. The Avatar sepsitorizes the AP Sekban while he fails to do any damage. I spend my last order killing my Djanbazan with his Regeneration.

    CA

    The Daturazi impetuously move out, one of them gets within line of sight of the Iggy operator and gets knocked out successfully. The Avatar then finishes off the Al Hawwa, while trying to sepsitorize the Operator who dodges the DTW. Later on, the opponent said that I should've gone for the Engage just to tie the TAG up in the CC brawl for a couple of turns, and I agree. The Avatar then repositions and shoots the Iggy operator straight into Dead. The mind-controlled Sekban shoots his teammates, and as a result, everyone in the Sekban Haris is dead by the end of the turn.

    I only had my Lt. left, and with the No Retreat rule, nothing stopped him from claiming all the objectives to beat me 10-0, so we called it there.

    Here goes my Avatar virginity. I figured the game was lost the moment I had lost the initiative. Had I had the first turn – sure, there were some things on the table like sniping the TR bot through smoke, shooting stuff with my Iguana, burning Avatar's ODD with my HFT, repositioning my troops into more advantageous ARO positions, etc. I guess it also didn't help that I decided to include my YY in the DZ whereas what I should have done is leave him off the board and use him to sneak up on the Avatar and trying him up in CC. That option was definitely better than relying solely on the Sekbans. Maybe a Djanbazan Core would also be better, I dunno. The limited insertion format kinda leaves you with things that are either durable but don't have MSVs or squishy and slow but do have MSV2. And in the end, the Avatar easily counters both advantages.

    All in all: it would have been an interesting game had I gone first, but it turned out rather one-sided, the Avatar was too manly for me to handle. The absence of the E/Mauler and the inability to keep my YY out of DZ killed me here.
     
    #97 AssaultUnicorn, Mar 10, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2020
    loricus likes this.
  18. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,272
    Likes Received:
    3,915
    I had the Zero-G = Airborne Infiltration moment in the Novy Bangkok campaign last year. Sekban make great AD Infiltrators in such a case - however, fireteams are too Order-hungry to be applied in this role.
    I mean, you needed to be short 3 Regular Orders here. And you absolutely couldn't have afford it.

    A single Sekban in that role - that would be just fine.
    Also, you have an ODD target, a Fire weapon, and not use it?Land a single hit on the monster, and suddenly it becomes way, way easier to hit, regardless of whether you have done any damage, or not.

    Also, going for a Haris instead of a regular Core Fireteam...?
     
    Capo.Paint likes this.
  19. AssaultUnicorn

    AssaultUnicorn KTS is the best unit

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    392
    Likes Received:
    401
    HFT was out of reach, and the Avatar positioned himself in a way that I could only shoot him from within 16", leaving me with 7s to hit on three dices, and I had way too few orders to spend with these odds. I trusted that the AP rifle would do the job – and it almost did.

    There was a different list with the pain train instead of Iggy and Djanbazan Sniper, and I couldn't have included both an HMG and a Missile Launcher in the link due to the nature of the Limited Insertion rule. And I feel like the link would've been wiped out just as easily, especially considering the fact that trying to hide the link inside a building is a death sentence against Sepsitor Plus and all DTW in general.

    I totally agree that I should have gone for a single Sekban instead of the three-man link. Maybe on some other similar mission, I'll try using a solo Spitfire guy instead.
     
  20. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,272
    Likes Received:
    3,915
    One more suggestion, then.

    Going for the Order Pool helps a lot if you have to deal with few big scary guys. If they have no Orders to fuel them, they become way less scary.
    If you can knock their teeth (offensive models) it is way better. But Avatar is IMO the apex case of hard-to-crack nut.
     
    AssaultUnicorn likes this.
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation