If you don't want to see criticism or discussion on CB's failures you should probably go somewhere else. If you'd just like to see people mindlessly praise CB because that makes you feel good by validating your purchases I'd recommend hanging out on facebook. Meanwhile the rest of us would like some effort put into fixing parts of the game that are clearly not up to scratch.
The problem for a lot of players is that Yu Jing used to be what they wanted. And then CB suddenly took away a third of that. I got into Yu Jing shortly after the uprising, but it's still easy to see where things are missing. I've got 40 lovingly painted reasons for why that won't happen.
Invincible army was never pitched as the faction with the most fragile power armour in the human sphere piloted by warriors with super-human capacity to endure pain and maintain consciousness in the face of terrible injuries It fails on every level, but it especially fails at representing itself according to the lore preceding it's release. Some gourmets might play it competitively to prove a point, but the only new unit in IA that anyone in another faction would ever use in preference to what they already get is the Daoying, a medium infantry. There's other examples too, like for some reason they changed the boarding shotgun into something absolutely non-nonsensical.
For all the problems IA has, and it has some serious ones, I think you're still selling it short. The Haidao, Zhencha, and Mowang are all solid to great units.
Being thankful for Haidao is like being thankful for a breath mint after someone's shat in your mouth. It's the worst offender when it comes to bad lore, and bad design. It's a downgraded Yadu with a profile for each bit of equipment necessary to make a faction "meta". I have two Daofei waiting for a chance to be used in IA, now I am expected to buy a moblot tier """heavy infantry""". Nah. Mowang's pretty cool. There's already a big shooty invincible though. Could have put NCO on a Yanhuo.
While the "shut up and like it" posts rank up there as one of the most toxic things you can post on the forums, we shouldn't fool ourselves that this is "fixing" anything. To do that we'd need some indication that the devs are willing to play ball or for the faction to be so direly and widely recognised by the entire community as disadvantaged that a player-developed project could get traction. IA isn't that direly bad and CB doesn't seem to want to engage with the community, particularly not the English community, so this is all an exercise in venting. So just, you know, post ideas to get enjoyment in fiddling with mechanics and see what feedback others give. It's a round-about way of trading opinions about what the faction should be, could be, and can be used as.
I mean they did get around to addressing StarCo being Corregidor but better complaints which is kinda where IA/Dahshat dynamics are sitting at the moment.
I quote you, but this addresses to all of you who reacted to my post. I just find yours much more suitable for a quote. First of all: I am not a native english speaker, so I know my messages are probably not reflecting exactly the tone and nuances of my thoughts (i.e. my point is not "Like it and shut up", it's more "Your hate is probably not as legit as you think". Secondly: it's not that I don't want to see criticism towards CB, I'm not a fanboy and I'm not this kind of people unable to face criticism. I'm not really using FB, so I don't know the CB community over there, but I would probably not like them as much as I like this forum community. But the way you seem to assume who I am, I assume you are the kind of guy who just can't admit that what you want / would like to see happen is not necessarily the right thing not the thing CB is moving toward. What I challenge is the endless flow of salt running from some of the members, and the peremptory way they have to decide what is good and what is wrong. I know the angry part of a community is always the most noisy, but I just wanted to highlight that being disappointed doesn't make your point more valuable or right. It's just that: you've been disappointed. It obviously appear that they won't listen to any complain anyways, so why are you still there howling in the wind? Why don't you just try to adapt and work with what you have? Yeah, maybe Dashat has a better implementation and use of the new toys we were both given... Then what? Play Dashat if you find it better/more suitable for you, or play with YJ's version if YJ is your go-for - but stop crying and complaining at some point, it just sounds like jealousy at this point. Most of the time I find that you (and other "doomsayers" as I like to call them, as a joke) are at least partially true, even if a bit over-negative. But sometimes it's just too much for me, I'm not even the positive kind of guy, and if that same day I'm tired of work/life/mana death or flood at MTG/whatever I just need to express that not everyone is on the "everything is wrong, CB are stupid monkeys who don't know what they're doing" side. I actually think that CB is probably in a better spot than myself to decide what YJ should have. And if I sometimes get disappointed, the general quality is quite good imho. So I try to build the best I can with what I have - and I don't try to impose my ideas as "the only correct way to fix my faction" by repeating them here and there. It sounds way too pretentious for me. Now, as you will probably answer that with a mix of valid points (good) and passive-aggressive or trolling tone (bad), I will just get back to my silent lurking and spend my time extracting the useful parts of your posts and pile up the worst until I explode again. Cheers.
Just like @Triumph I've had more success using my hulang as a zoning piece, barely spending any order on it. Just move him near an objective, push the button and wait for someone to either come and trade blows or settle a bit too close where you can rush him. But even this way he still has way too many exploitable weaknesses for how expensive he is, and ends up being EXTREMELY meta dependant (like almost everything in IA, it should be their motto). Active hacking and spec-fired E/M nades counter him so hard it's ridiculous, and unless you're playing vanilla FD2 might as well not be printed on his profile because using it is the best way to throw away 44pts. Ditto for the SMGs profile.
I think you are utterly missing the point, mostly because you don't like people leveraging criticism at CB. The people here are less interested in playing Dahshat, they'd just like their toys like the Shang Ji not to be utter garbage. We had literally years of data backing up that Shang Ji were crap because they were just overpriced shitty expensive Zuyongs and didn't do enough to differentiate themselves from that. Fast forward several years we're expecting a Securitate level face lift and CB drop the ball because they rushed this shit out the door without testing it worth a damn and we end up with the same shitty Shang Ji with the same exact problems they had before. You wonder why people are ticked off with stuff like that? World's easiest slam fucking dunk for a games designer to get right and they screw it up. People don't want to go over and play Dahshat because Dahshat isn't what they signed up for, they signed up for IA. However, IA is a stupid mess that doesn't work and as it turns out, just a really shitty version of Dahshat which takes a whole bunch of tools that are denied from IA, then apply them to the one good unique thing IA has (The Zuyongs link). As for why do people bitch about CB screwing up their game on forums. Why are you here bitching about people bitching about CB screwing up their game on forums? It's probably the same answer. I don't really know why you think CB are the people best at making any sort of decisions in terms of game balance given they screw it up so often and have demonstrably needed an actual shitstorm to be pushed into fixing things they break. See the unofficial official WarCor FAQ debacle for an example on that. You complain about people bitching about things around here. Unfortunately because CB are the way they are it turns out we actually need to hound the shit out of them sometimes to get things fixed otherwise it gets Shang Ji'd under a rug. And hey, when they actually do something about things like get off their asses and commit to the regular FAQ? It's fantastic! It's just a shame we've got to ram our way up their asses like Ant Man gets all up Thanos to get it to happen. I mean I wouldn't play him in IA unless you put a gun to my head.
Wow. That's just dirty. I really can't help but feel that CB has some real animosity towards Yu Jing when they do stuff like this.
He's not actually very good depending on where he ends up and what he links with, but his durability compared to Yu Jing """"heavy infantry"""" is farcical. Same as Lei Gong.
Doesn't get 1-shot by viral, but doesn't have MA L3, FD L2, D-charges, or E/M grenades so the hulang's actually better at getting into and winning at CC on his own. He's also not a specialist unless you pay 5 points. I agree things like the red fury, bioimmunity, multi pistol, BS13, WIP14, etc. are eyebrow raisers but I don't think they're directly comparable. Don't get me wrong, the hulang's hot garbage and needs changes but I don't think this is the best comparison.
A lot of us liked what YJ was and then had all that shat on with Uprising fluff and then the Yuandun WarCrimes Division. And then IA introduced half as many units as were taken away in Uprising, with designs that feel so halfassed it's an embarrassment to halfassing.
I have the feeling, that there are more and more Mov 4-4 Mi with some combination of NWI+Immunity. In a nutshell: nonhackable YJ HI types... Im not sure if this is intentional (to protect this new Hero from Hacking), necessary (to save points) or just CB spitting in my face... (and yes, im aware of Lei Gong) Mi had for me the Identity of heavily armored and in return slow Linetrooper but now it seems more of a tool to fudge with the points than a unit category... I still want a Mi Linetrooper like grunts for YJ to replace the zanshi in the invincible army... and to use them in vanilla.
Under which rock have you been living? Each of the official FAQ has added a major problem. Especially the Stealth FAQ is the worst change since the NWI changes (which they made a 180 on). It's an exploit promoting fishing for Normal rolls turned into a rule. The pre FAQ RAW would have made more sense and fixed the problem.
@Stuffist, I do like your perspective. I think that is a healthy way to approach the current state of IA. I personally enjoy all flavors of Yu Jing including IA. That does not mean I think IA is a competitive sectorial for ITS. Now, this whole topic about salt and Yu Jing/IA is loaded. I'm not going to unpack that. From my point of view the biggest issue with a tabletop miniature game is that it's not easy to just switch a faction. We spend hundreds of dollars on products to build up an army. Then on top of that we paint them. If you have enough money to buy new factions and pay for commissioned painting then sure, have at it. I'm glad I had not bought a model yet when uprising happened. I really wanted to play pre-uprising Yu Jing. Well, 'cause ninjas, and space samurai, and martial arts. I would have been livid had any of my models been made useless. It's just not appropriate to ask people to invest into new armies.
Thanks. You indeed made a very valid point. I am not super rich, but I'm part of the lucky ones that are just making enough money to have a game-dedicated monthly budget - which means that I consider that I can burn up to X dollars (well, euros actually) each month to have fun with my friends. I consider that money lost anyway so switching faction is probably for me way easier than for most of people with more constraint on their wallet. When Uprising hit YJ, I just had bought a few boxes, and I could easily resell the few JSA models I had with very limited financial impact too. Add to this that I do not paint my model's myself, I just spend my monthly budget on a painter a few times and it's magically done. So I probably underestimate the "I had to work hard for 3+ years buying and painting this collection to be able to play at the standard level I consider acceptable and you just throw everything overboard CB!". Still, migrating from heavy-japanese old YJ to JSA or from YJ with IA to Dashat seems to be an acceptable gap when such changes occurs. Regarding the ITS competitiveness of IA, I agree that they have easy to exploit weaknesses, and that Vanilla or ISS are probably easier to get hands on and pilot to victory. But personally, I don't seek for easy stuff - I choose my armies with my eyes and my heart, and I then learn how to play them. IA can work just fine, and when it doesn't it is not because of the profiles/weird high-tech ILO but no real 2W design or whatever. It's because I missplayed something or built a janky list - it's my fault, not CB's one. Once again: maybe some people here have just played muuuuuch more games than me with IA, and are much more experienced players - and they concluded IA is not great. But I still think that most of the people undervaluate a bit our newest secto. I hope N4 will both satisfy those people, and not change everything - pls just fix the Zuyong with 2W while all brand new ILO are 1.9W (it looks weird to me). The Hulang, for example, does not need to be an exact replacement of something Japanese. I like the way it is today: hard to stomp with him alone, but with some good and smart plays it can do some work in addition to zone denial (which already great, but does not justify its cost alone).
