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Will expansions be available with metal miniatures?

Discussion in 'News' started by Croepoek, Jan 2, 2018.

  1. dlfleetw

    dlfleetw Well-Known Member

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    They don't make spray paint. It is sourced much like their paints.
     
  2. Plebian

    Plebian Well-Known Member

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    [QUOTE = "dlfleetw, post: 23038, member: 88"] They do not make spray paint. It is sourced much like their paints. [/ QUOTE]
    Iguess it has never been a priority for them to ensure their brand is associated with high quality....
     
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  3. ephrael

    ephrael Member

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    Just high prices for the spray paints.
     
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  4. dlfleetw

    dlfleetw Well-Known Member

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    At one point GW paints were Krylon. Haven't a clue where they source from now.

    Any 'hobby' brand spray primers are over priced compared to Duplicolor/Rustomlem/etc.
     
  5. csjarrat

    csjarrat Well-Known Member

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    To be fair, the gw sprays are better than army painter ones. Had 5 cans leak propellant and waste half the can of paint recently :-(
     
  6. ephrael

    ephrael Member

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    I’ve been using Duplicolor sandable primer for automobiles for 20 years and never had a problem. I usually airbrush or hand brush every mini I paint so I can’t speak to the quality of GW or Army Painter sprays. I personally feel that they are very overpriced though.
     
  7. Knastcore

    Knastcore Real Life Aristo!

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    Received my Collectors Edition a few days ago and there is really a big difference in Detail and Quality. Not happy at all with any of the Plastic Miniatures. Not even Fun to paint them, let alone the swords of Mish are bend to a lvl i can never get straight.

    Glad i have the Metal version...

    So i really hope CB considering Metal Versions of the Expansions. I'm ready to pay much more for that way higher lvl of quality (maybe release a Collectors Version of the expansions well aswell)

    I get the idea of simpler miniatures for a Board Game, but my guess would be a huge part of tabletop players are interested in aresteia as well, and would appreciate having the CB Quality lvl of Miniatures we know and love from Infinity.
     
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  8. Ursun

    Ursun Tough as Nails, Grim as Old Boots

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    Sooo, Angel recently posted pictures of the painted Miniatures from the SoF Box.

    " Were the miniatures master resin sculpts or plastic, like the ones in the boxes?

    [​IMG]Studio Giraldez I don't know it, I painted metal [​IMG]"


    Since making the moulds for the miniatures is the most expensive part, and those do exsist by now (if we trust Angel, who has no reason to lie/stirr the pot just for fun), why can´t we get the expansion in metal? That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever !
     
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  9. -V-

    -V- A! Team member
    CB Staff

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    Ángel received metal version of SoF because ─as it happened with Core Box─ we didn't have final plastics yet and we needed to have anything to show. It's not an evil marketing plan to conquer the world, simply that. For next expansion (S&M) we expect to have plastics, and ─due to the upgrade of quality that our Sculpture Dept. has obtained─ we'll be proud to show them painted.

    :wink:
     
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  10. Ursun

    Ursun Tough as Nails, Grim as Old Boots

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    Well, I never said anything about an eveil plan, but now that you denied it out of thin air... you know :P

    Besides, that still doesnt explain why you guys went for metal miniatures (instead of resin masters to paint) for angel, invested in moulds for metal miniatures, had metal miniatures produced and still keep telling us that there will be no metal miniatures for us.
    But anyways, I´m sure you have your reason for it, even though after some demo´s in our locel gaming store with the plastics from the Main Box not that many people where happy to hear that there is now way to get better quality. And let´s be honest here... the base game miniatures sucked compared to other Boardgame Miniatures.
     
  11. -V-

    -V- A! Team member
    CB Staff

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    Because it's easier for us to make'em metal and give to Ángel something we know how it's gonna result. I conced it wasn't the best decision.

    People who like board games like miniatures quality. People who like miniature games don't (not all, ok). I think their quality are not below most of the miniature board games ─not sucking, of course, no need to be rude─, but wait for Soldiers of Fortune, because we've improved it.
     
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  12. deep-green-x

    deep-green-x Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    I’ve allot of experience with boardgame minis, both as a player and commission painter of them.

    I can assure you the Aristea! PVC minis were well above the quality of most boardgame minis, like vastly better.
     
  13. Ursun

    Ursun Tough as Nails, Grim as Old Boots

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    [​IMG]

    So do I, so have I, no they are not.
    You might not like me saying they suck, but that doesn´t change the fact that Gata is a detailless Blob, Major Luna has basically no face whatsoever and the rest of the cast has very shallow and soft details, who are worse than what Boardgames had in 2011.

    If CB wants to take a step into the boardgame market thats fine, and I find it great, Aristeia is a superb game and really fun
    Thats why I´m doing demos and try to get people to play it.
    But then they have to measure up to what Boardgames deliver in quality in 2017/8... and they are really not there (yet).

    Still doesn´t answer why there will be no metal minis in the future if the moulds exist. Anyways, thats for CB to know and for us to wonder.
     
  14. deep-green-x

    deep-green-x Well-Known Member

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    Show me some better looking single piece PVC Board game minis then?

    Metal production moulds may exist but this is not the same as producing and shipping metal casts for retail.
     
  15. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

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    Which resin masters are you referring to? If you mean 3D printed ones, those aren't usually suitable for painting. Also (as someone who has some of the metal prototypes) the metal copies produced for Angel to paint aren't the same as the production copies as they're produced using shortcuts that can be used for very low quantity runs but which results in moulds that aren't suitable for actual production.

    So no, the 'moulds for metal miniatures' don't exist in the way you think.
     
  16. Ursun

    Ursun Tough as Nails, Grim as Old Boots

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    Well thank you, that is an insightfull answer that actually clears up a lot.
     
  17. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

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    Because it's a field I find interesting, here's a mini-essay. :yum:

    Production casting via 3D modelling typically goes through these steps:
    1. A resin master is printed at very high resolution.
    2. This resin master is used to make a master mould (for 'traditional' sculpting, this is where the actual sculpt is used). If things go wrong, this can destroy the original resin master or sculpt. :-(
    3. The master mould is used to make a series of hard metal masters.
    4. These hard metal masters are manually cleaned up to removed any mould lines from the master mould.
    5. The masters are then used to make the production moulds, typically segregated by piece size so that one mould will have a set of arms and another will have a set of bodies as they need slightly different spin speeds etc. Each mould will have multiple copies of each item, maybe even dozens per mould if it's a very small piece. This means that a single model can have multiple production moulds. If a mould wears out, it's then redone from the stored hard metal masters.
    6. The production moulds are then used to cast the actual models that get packed and sold, including a series of checks to try and catch any miscast pieces.
    It's educated guesswork because I haven't asked, but the prototypes probably skipped steps 3-5 and presumably had only 1-2 moulds for the whole set (maybe all the different arms in one and bodies in the other). Mixing different pieces on a mould for prototypes doesn't matter too much because the higher rate of miscasts can be compensated for by spinning the mould a few more times for spare parts, but for a production mould that would be very inefficient.

    For the Aristeia! Core Set even the resin masters were different for the production versions, with the sculpts being 'cut' differently into pieces - for example the prototype Maximus has a single piece for the main body while the production copies have a hollow body with a separate chest piece, making him cheaper and more reliable to mass-produce. The Lunah prototype is a one-piece cast while the production version is separated in two at the waist (and doesn't have the slight signs of mould rip around the tips of the hair that are visible on my prototype).

    The PVC figures are cut up a third different way, to be more suitable for that kind of moulding process - note that sculpts are (ideally) designed not just for a specific scale but for the specific material and moulding process that's going to be used, as the way the figure detail works needs to be different in each case.
     
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  18. psychoticstorm

    psychoticstorm Aleph's rogue child
    Moderator

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    I think the sculpts are up to the level of good quality boardgame plastic.

    Yes, some companies with vast more experience, contacts and resources can do better, CB probably will do better in the future with the acquired experience , but saying that the miniatures sucked, eh, no, Ill give you Gata's face, but that were the first attempt ever and experience has only gone up from there.
     
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  19. Monkeysloth

    Monkeysloth Well-Known Member

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    I'm not a naysayer against CB's plastic but what Monolith and Mystic games have been making are much better quality. But Monolith has people that have been in the boardgame industry for quite some time so it's not surprising they have more experience with making plastic and dealing with Chinese factories then CB. I'm wanting this game to do well as I'd like CB to have the resources to do more plastic (as I've really gotten tired of metal minis).
     
  20. Agorapocalypse

    Agorapocalypse Namurr and Nahab are girlfriends

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    Remember too, CB offered metal minis of the main game as an offset to the expected lack of quality that comes with a first time forray into plastic boardgame minis.The quality of the next expansion and likely those after it has increased by an impressive margin. Now i cant give any guarentee that the final product for SOF will live up to my hype, but ive see the plastic "not resin or metal" prototypes from the chinese manufacturer, and they are on the upper end of quality boardgame minis.
     
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