For reference. From the Rules ARO: AUTOMATIC REACTION ORDER In Infinity games, thanks to the Automatic Reaction Order (ARO) mechanic, players never stop making game-altering decisions. Even during their opponent’s Active Turn, they can take actions as their figures and Markers react to enemies activating with Orders. A trooper owned by the Reactive Player can declare an ARO if any of the following is true: »»It has Line of Fire (LoF) to a trooper being activated by the Active Player. »»An enemy trooper activates within its Zone of Control (ZoC). »»It has a Special Skill or piece of Equipment allowing reactionto enemy actions without LoF. The Reactive Player must declare AROs for all eligible troopers immediately after the Active Player declares his Entire Order or the first Short Skill of his Order (see: Order Expenditure Sequence, page 31). Troopers that fail to do so lose their ARO against that Order. If, by declaring the second Short Skill of its Order, the active trooper gives ARO to enemy troopers that did not have ARO against the first Short Skill, then those enemy troopers can declare their AROs. Each time the Active Player activates a trooper by spending an order, each eligible enemy gets one single ARO, regardless of the number of Skills the Active Player declares during that Order. AROs must choose the trooper activated by the Order as their target. Troopers cannot react to AROs, since only the Active Player’s Orders give AROs and only the Reactive Player can declare AROs. There is no limit to the number of troopers that can react to the activation of a single enemy trooper. Skill Entry From the Wiki RESET SHORT SKILL / ARO Advanced Combat: Hacking, No LoF. REQUIREMENTS A trooper can only declare Reset if at least one of these is true: The trooper is targeted by a Hacking Attack, i.e., any Attack declared using a Hacking Program. The trooper is targeted by a Comms Attack. The trooper is in the Immobilized-1 state. In his Reactive Turn, the trooper has an enemy declare or execute an Order in his Zone of Control. EFFECTS By passing a Face to Face WIP Roll, the trooper avoids a Hacking Attack or a Comms Attack. The user can declare Reset even without LoF to the attacker, and even if the attacker is outside his Zone of Control and his Hacking Area. Reset can be also declared if the attacker is in base to base contact with the user, in Engaged state. If the user wins the Face to Face WIP Roll, he may apply the Guts Roll rules. By passing a Normal WIP Roll, the user cancels his own Immobilized-1 state. Now for my question. If a reactive player has a remote (or unit) that is in the IMM-1 state and the active player spends a order and activates a troop outside of LoF and outside of ZoC from this unit. Can the IMM-1 reactive troop RESET as an ARO? I would say that the conditions are met to make a reset if any model on the board activates a skill. This is because the requirments of the reset skill specifically say: RESET SHORT SKILL / ARO Advanced Combat: Hacking, No LoF REQUIREMENTS A trooper can only declare Reset if at least one of these is true: The trooper is in the Immobilized-1 state. and the ARO rules states that by spending an order ARO's are granted. Each time the Active Player activates a trooper by spending an order, each eligible enemy gets one single ARO, regardless of the number of Skills the Active Player declares during that Order. How do you play this out? Thanks
The immobilised trooper still needs to be eligible for an ARO, so one of the following needs to happen. Enemy activates in LoF Enemy activates in ZoC Trooper is target of a Template weapon it Hacking Attack. Once the trooper is eligible to declare an ARO, that ARO may be Reset. But Reset doesn't have any language expanding what conditions grant an ARO.
Acording to the Reset rules it does not need LoF nor do you need to be in ZoC. "The user can declare Reset even without LoF to the attacker, and even if the attacker is outside his Zone of Control and his Hacking Area. Reset can be also declared if the attacker is in base to base contact with the user, in Engaged state"
But if the enemy isn't in ZoC or LoF then no ARO is generated. If no ARO is generated Reset can't be used. Reset allows you to declare it without LoF or ZoC, but is it doesn't grant you an ARO when you wouldn't normally get one.
I guess im going to need to think on this more. The skill it self has the No LoF trait. This is confusing.
Even the third bullet point of the ARO rule overrides the no LoF. "It has a Special Skill or piece of Equipment allowing reaction to enemy actions without LoF"
You're getting a bit a head of yourself. Reset is a skill. It gives you the criteria for declaring that skill. Eg. Do you need to see an enemy before declaring reset is a legal skill? No. However. Models need orders to declare skills. In the active turn you need to spend an order to activate your model before you can declare reset as part of that skill. In reactive, models can only declare skills when granted an order via ARO (automatic reaction order). The criteria for that is set (lof, zoc, targeted by templates), and until you meet those, you can't declare a skill.
I am not going to disagree there. I am just simply trying to understand how and why this skill works. Are you saying that this rule from the ARO ruling has no bearing on a skill that says it has a trait of "No-Lof"? "It has a Special Skill or piece of Equipment allowing reaction to enemy actions without LoF" <-- If this line does not apply to RESET then what does it apply too? Having an example of what it does work with might be helpful.
I am going to dig a little deeper. Here is the description for Labels under the Skills section of the N3 Rules 1.8. When I said trait earlier I really meant label to be more specific. "Labels Labels indicate a series of defining aspects of the Skill for quick reference. The most common Labels are: Attack. The use of this Skill is a form of Attack. Remember that you cannot declare attacks against allies or Neutral units, whether represented by figures or Markers. Advanced Combat: Hacking. This Skill relates to the advanced Hacking rules. Movement. The use of this Skill is a form of Movement. No LoF. This Skill does not require LoF towards the target. No Roll. Using this Skill does not require a Roll." Now, the ARO rule says that ANY (this does not mean ALL, it just means one of them) of those condition (listed above) needs to be met. Then it goes on to say that A trooper owned by the Reactive Player can declare an ARO if "It has a Special Skill or piece of Equipment allowing reaction to enemy actions without LoF". What you guys are telling me is that this does not apply to the Reset skill that has the No-Lof Label. So what I am reading is a primary rule that specifically says that "A trooper owned by the Reactive Player can declare an ARO if It has a Special Skill or piece of Equipment allowing reaction to enemy actions without LoF". And you guys are telling me that the "No-LoF" label is ignored. Are you guys telling me that the Label " No LoF" has no effect on ARO skills?
Let me walk you through how I am reading this. First, did the active player spend a order to activate a unit? Yes. ARO Granted!!!! I came to that understanding with this part of the rules. "Each time the Active Player activates a trooper by spending an order, each eligible enemy gets one single ARO, regardless of the number of Skills the Active Player declares during that Order." Second, are any of the following true? (A trooper owned by the Reactive Player can declare an ARO if any of the following is true:) it has Line of Fire (LoF) to a trooper being activated by the Active Player. (Nope.) An enemy trooper activates within its Zone of Control (ZoC). (Nope.) It has a Special Skill or piece of Equipment allowing reaction to enemy actions without LoF. (Yup. Any one of the conditions needs to be true in order for me to get an ARO. It just so happens I have a model in IMM-1 that can declare a reset. He can declare reset with out LoF because the Lable on the skill is "No LoF" and my opponent spent an order and activated a unit.) That is how I read this. Where am I going wrong?
Every eligible enemy. That means one of: With Line of Fire, In Zone of Control, Whose Hacking Area you are in, Who you are Hacking, Who you are shooting with a template (but the only allowed ARO is a Dodge). No LoF just lifts the LoF requirement. You still need one of the other things that actually generates an ARO.
Okay. So, this line "A trooper owned by the Reactive Player can declare an ARO if any of the following is true" should really say "A trooper owned by the Reactive Player can declare an ARO if ALL of the following is true". I think that would make more sense to me in relationship to how its being explained.
In this context of reading this line "A trooper owned by the Reactive Player can declare an ARO if any of the following is true." The word "any" means "either" or "one of".
I will disagree on the translation but I now understand on how its meant to be played. Thats all that really matters. Thanks!
Just to make sure im clear as mud on this.... Given a altered situation from above If a reactive player has a remote (or unit) that is in the IMM-1 state and the active player spends a order and activates a troop WITH of LoF and outside of ZoC from this unit. Can the IMM-1 reactive troop RESET as an ARO? If the unit with LoF can do a reset this situation what is the point of having a label of No-LoF? Does this mean the Label No-LoF only works within ZoC of a unit or Hacking areas?
Indeed, the no LoF label allows you declare it when an enemy provokes an ARO (such as by activating in your ZoC) but isn't in direct LoF.
Can you please cite the rule that says the No-Lof lable only applies to ZoC and Hacking Areas for me please? That way I can point that rule out when I am teaching new players. Thanks.
They're saying you still need to generate an ARO for your trooper to declare Reset. And the conditions under which an ARO are generated are spelled out in the rules. In this case, the no LOF label means you can still declare the Reset when enemies trigger an ARO, even if you cannot see them - but you still need to fulfil clause for generating an ARO in the first place. http://infinitythewiki.com/en/ARO:_Automatic_Reaction_Order A trooper owned by the Reactive Player can declare an ARO if any of the following is true: It has Line of Fire (LoF) to a trooper being activated by the Active Player. An enemy trooper activates within its Zone of Control (ZC). It has a Special Skill or piece of Equipment allowing reaction to enemy actions without LoF. The no LOF label does not count that first bullet point as fulfilled, it is just there to indicate that you can declare Reset even without LOF as long as an ARO is generated. You must still fulfil one of these conditions to get the ARO in the first place.
