1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Help and tips for a haqqislamite brother playing Vanilla

Discussion in 'Haqqislam' started by siri, Jun 2, 2019.

  1. siri

    siri Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2017
    Messages:
    138
    Likes Received:
    57
    Salaam Aleikum my brothers

    Yesterday I had a tournament here in Rio de Janeiro with 9 players. I finished in 9.

    I had played with vanilla. Missions were:
    1 - Supplies
    2 - supremacy
    3 - show of force

    All my games were rough ones.
    The first one was against a friendly Haqqislam Vanilla.
    My greatest problem, as always has been, was the slow pace of the game. I take a very long time to play those many orders. Lot's of impetuous and irregular orders, and I failed not playing by the objective.
    We didn't had our 3 turn. And because of this I couldn't use my Nahab and bashi bazouk smg.
    I lost this game 5x1, my adversary finished with one box and I had none.

    How you speed your game ?

    My second game was a uphill battle against SP. Supremacy.
    All those ODD and link team with Phoenix and Ajax was a problem. I lost a lot of against Agema sniper and had to throw everything to take him out.
    I won advancing my Khawarij msv2 jumping and shooting from smoke. But I lost to many took 3 consoles and in my last ARO took a hacker with my killer hacker barid, thanks to my deployed repeaters from a Hunzakut.

    My 3 game was show of force.

    I played against STARCO
    I didn't have the power to take out the mobile brigada core and specially the ML one.
    In the last movement my opponent used Raoul to took out my Nahab touching the antenna and took it.

    Lost 5 x 3 cause I killed his data tracker

    What to do against fire teams, specially those HI ?


    Thanks for you help in advance.
     
  2. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,272
    Likes Received:
    3,915
    Wa alaikum salaam!

    As for speeding the game up - I'm afraid first and foremost would be gaining experience. Train for exactly that, playing with limited time (I'd suggest setting up a timer for your regular games, perhaps suggesting your opponent to use it too: something akin to a chess clock).

    Checking up rules tends to eat up time, too, tohugh I don't know how it was in your case.

    In my experience, the more models you have on table (and Orders to sepnd on them), the longer it, naturally, takes. If you were to play a Limited Insertion game, it would likely go way quicker. Of course, if you aren't forced to play LI by the tournament organizer, I can fully understeand going with a large list, especially in factions like Haqq, i.e. having acess to excellent low-cost troops.


    As for dealing with Fire Teams - yes, they can be a tough nut to crack. Especially the HI fireteams: they can take a lot of abuse. But usually the first model is the one toughest to take out (since the Fireteam is then riding at full bonus pack). Still, there are a few things Fireteams fear, and I'd say Template Weapons are first among them: you can endanger several models simultaneously. While Direct Template is relatively easy to dodge, a Terminal Template has the possibility of coming in with a high Attack roll that will be really hard to FtF.

    I like our Camo Infiltrators for that job.

    When attacking a Fireteam, mind your target selection. Sometimes it might be worth ignoring the Team Leader and taking an unopposed shot from him to pump your ARO unopposed at some other team member, if it has a good chance of taking that one down and thus weakneing the team for the est of the game.


    Naturally, a HI fireteam, with their high ARM and multiple Wounds isn't easy to get that way. But in case of HI, it might be advantageous to Hack them first - or set up a Hacker (perhaps via Repeater) to ARO them as soon as they start pulling anything. Whether you'll be able to Isolate or Immobilize the Team Leader or Heavy Weapons' man is a matter of dice luck - but the very chance of that happening should make the opponent waste a lot of orders moving around Resetting, or sending in somebody to kill the Hacker / Repeater first. Naturally, if you can protect your assets, it is great, but having the opponent spend most of his Order pool to get rid of them is also acceptable.

    If you want to see a grimace of sheer terror on your opponent's face, jump his HI Fireteam Core with a Ghazi Muttawi'ah. Or a few of them on a Coordinated Order.


    I hope that helps...
     
    Myomer, Stiopa, siri and 1 other person like this.
  3. wisefaiz

    wisefaiz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    528
    I can talk about speeding up the game. This is something I've struggled with too. I annotate my army list, marking who are active turn models (burst 4+, MSV), and who are ARO models (low burst, high dam). I highlight hackers, doctors and engineers so I don't forget I have them. Anyone not marked is someone I don't think about. So, on my turn with a 17 order list, I look at who I marked as an 'active turn model' so I'm only really thinking about 4-5 models. Makes it much easier to think about who to spend orders on. Beyond this, of course, you have your specialists to press buttons etc, but again, that should be only a few models, so also easier to think about.
     
    Sojourne and siri like this.
  4. Papa Bey

    Papa Bey Clueless Wonder. Still.

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,254
    Likes Received:
    1,268
    Are you taking a long time for your turn because of the number of orders, or because you take "a long time" on each order?
     
  5. Errhile

    Errhile A traveller on the Silk Road

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2017
    Messages:
    2,272
    Likes Received:
    3,915
    A most excellent question, effendi!
    Since the inital post suggested a double Combat Group list, I have assumed the former, but indeed I have known players who had a problem with the latter...
     
  6. siri

    siri Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2017
    Messages:
    138
    Likes Received:
    57
    Hi brother, and thank for the help.


    I truly think both things.
    I used, in most of the games my daylami wrong, in this particular day.
    They should work in move to good position and ARO to try take most of the units out of cover, or do coordinated orders to try take a sniper or something similar out.
    With this I should use less orders and faster moves.
     
  7. Papa Bey

    Papa Bey Clueless Wonder. Still.

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,254
    Likes Received:
    1,268
    You know the old adage perhaps. Those who can't. Teach. So...

    To deal with the number of orders, scale things back. Play 200 points if you need to. Don't bring 14 special snowflakes with dozens of skills. Take things basic for at least five games. Get a handle on playing smoothly and cleanly. Set a timer for the turn and remember the first turn is always the longest. Remember to explain what you want to do and say that before you start moving things.

    "I'm spending this Order to activate this model and it's first short skill is X. Do you have any AROs? Ok. My second short skill will be Y." Then resolve. Stick to that tempo. It'll make things easier for you and it will make things very clear for your opponent.

    The amount of time you're spending on an individual order comes down to complexity. You may have too many figures which balloons into way too many options. You may have complicated figures which makes their individual options more numerous, which then feeds into the first part. Suddenly I'm taking three minutes just to walk to the corner and place a mine. :( Just trim your options with a more basic and boring list so you can figure out what you want to do. 10 games from now you can swap models out that will do those things more effectively. Don't change any models for at least 5 games. Get a handle on _that_ list and see if you find yourself playing faster.

    Last off the cuff advice. Try to do one thing on a given turn. One general thing that scores points.. "I will take control of that console/quadrant/zone/etc". Then look at what prevents you from just walking up and doing it. "He's got a suppression fire guy there. There is a sniper across the table. Mines." and think about what you're going to do to get that done. "I can sneak around back. I can lob a grenade over the building. Discover from outside the trigger area." Then try to do those things. See if little steps can make you progress even if it's not bringing you a win.

    Lastly, read my .sig at the bottom. It's pretty general and vague. But it works. When I remember it.
     
    Deltervees and Urobros like this.
  8. Solar

    Solar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2017
    Messages:
    3,006
    Likes Received:
    5,384
    Can you post your list? We can give some better suggestions if we know what you're working with and perhaps make some minor adjustments too!
     
  9. Urobros

    Urobros Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    1,790
    Likes Received:
    1,380
    Hello,

    I don't play Vainilla very often, but I still believe I can say something usseful. Like others said before, if you post your lists it will be easier provide you some advices. The other question is where the problems remains. When more you play, less time you need to take a decision and spend an order, but of course not every one had the same learning ratio or the time to play a lot, so...

    When I build a List for a tournament, most of the time I place in my mind what role must that miniature cover. In other words I try to answer the question:

    How this troup works in this mission? It is clear that we really have three general categories in our armies:

    ARO-Pieces.

    Killer-Pieces.

    Button-Pieces.

    But not all are the same. Some could have various roles, of course.

    If you have clear in your mind what do you whant to do with every miniature before the deployment begins you can spare a lot of time when playing.

    For example, what could do the fiday in a mission as Highly Classified.

    - If I go second not to do roll to infiltrate inside the enemy's DZ unless the rival do a mistake and place several LI in line with several impetuous troups really close, so a light shot gun blast could do a lot of damage. Else, I will place the fiday where none can go easy and do a discover in the same order but inside the enemys half table.
    - If I go first and I have some Objetive which I can't complete, in this case I place the Fiday close to the enemy specialist who can do that objetive.


    This is only an example, but I hope the point can be easily taken. I'am sure if you do this for every troup included in your army list before a match, you save a lot of time.

    Best regards!
     
  10. HardDisk

    HardDisk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2017
    Messages:
    363
    Likes Received:
    258
    Hi Siri! I'm from Campinas, glad to see another haqqislamite in Brazil!

    I had played 400pts with 3 combat groups and a lot of impetuous orders under 2 hours and this is that i do to stay on the clock:
    • Have a plan and think about what you want to do at each round from the start of the game, know what you should do and how to do it from the start.
    • Have a plan B, C, D,... if your plan A failed, you must know what to do next, without thinking too much.
    • Think during your reative turn, if he did something, how can i stop it on my turn? Don't wait your next ative turn to think about that happened.
    • Play with limited time, to play faster, you must train also.
    • Know (at least) your skills by heart.
    • Play the mission, never forget it.

    It seems like you tried to play by our opponent strengths, not yours... use smoke grenades to get some templates near, Fidays to kill some targets (like that Agema...) with mines/CC/shooting on their backs, stop using your Daylamis only for ARO if you could get one near the opponent DZ, run with the shotgun! Try our AD troops, use camos to get close/behind... Haqq is a force that trade kills, assymetrical trades are our biggest strength, use it! Don't try to win only shooting fair and square.

    You played without Maggie? She's good to shread armor.
    And you could use Ghazis E/Maraut to immobilised his HIs, or go after the soft targets, with less orders on the pool, your opponent can't accomplish a lot.
    Hackers can help too.
     
    Gabarra, Errhile and siri like this.
  • About Us

    We are a company founded in 2001 in Cangas (Spain), and devoted to design and manufacture games and figures. Our main product, Infinity the Game, was born with the ambition to satisfy the most demanding audience, offering the best quality.

     

    Why are we here?

     

    Because we are, first and foremost, players.

  • Quick Navigation

    Open the Quick Navigation