Climbing prone? Like, having your body and chest against the surface of the wall like you're crawling up it? Hah, no. I personally resort to firmly planting my feet on the wall and then walking up it. Sometimes I stop halway up like that, sticking out worse than a sore thumb. Especially if I'm a TAG.
http://infinitythewiki.com/en/Climb Troops can never be in the Prone state while they Climb or hold on to a vertical surface. http://infinitythewiki.com/en/Climbing_Plus However, as with the Climb Skill, the user cannot benefit from Partial Cover MODs as long as he is on a vertical surface. Let's just say that the exact behaviour of ladders is a bit undefined, as in there's hints about how it's supposed to work. Also, due to the orientation of the model, it is uncertain what qualifies as "above" or "below" with regards to actually gaining cover.
I suppose Bounty hunters getting bikes after deployment is worth putting on the list. Also while the rules work fine imo, having just watched a live game with a couple of newish players on facebook, the word "Smoke Special Dodge" could maybe use some rewarding.
I feel like it's worth stating that CB talks about "Smoke" and "Special Dodge" on the same page, but as far as I've seen it never actually says "Smoke Special Dodge" anywhere. That's a player invention from what I can tell.
It is, (e.g. Smoke: Special Dodge and then it becomes Smoke Dodge) but calling the sub-ability a "Special Dodge" is where the problem is.
Fully agreed. Anyone who pulls that shit is going to be "disinvited" from most events. As long as we all agree about the Engage thing, everything else is fine. :)
What is the engage wall stick exploit? Are you talking about engaging a model with Climbing Plus, and being stuck to the wall? That's an odd one, but I'm not sure how common it is. I'd add the jumping models in the hopes of damage to complete classified objectives. That's a terrible rules interaction.
I think the problem is that the Engaged target being able to choose the placement of the successfully Engaging trooper can be interpreted as being able to put him on a wall? Seems like a bit of a stretch to me personally.
But the" place" from engage has no rules that reference how it works. And they cant say that you stick to the wall as that is a specific effect on how the climb skill works, which you did not declare or get the benefits of. Actually, if they can say you stick the wall due to engage, declare aros like attack at will as again the climb skill is what restricts your aro usage. My main rebuttal is how does the place effect from engage mean i declare the climb full order skill and have all the effects of it? Engage says i follow the movement skill and general movement rules (bottom bulletpoint of engage), but never references climb.
Better to see it fixed and then stricken from all thought. I play with people who will absolutely do this and I can't fault them for it as it is part of the rules.... I just want this rule changed.
Here's another engage problem, that I don't think has been addressed. First Skill: Controller and G:Synchronized model declare a skill (doesn't matter which one). ARO: Reactive model declares Engage, targeting the Controller. Second Skill: Controller and G:Synchronized model declare Move, with the Servant moving into b2b contact with and Engaging the Reactive model, and the Controller moving wherever it likes. Resolution: What happens and why?
Erk... I think because of the way Engage sort of teleports you (TAGs engaging into buildings or engaging over pits) that a successful Engage ARO will still move you to your target. Yah jumping is annoying. I have done it with a rem once. It still turned out kind of order intensive for me surprisingly lol. As for the engage exploit. When you do an engage ARO your opponent is allowed to place you. Some questions got brought up about what happens if you engage someone who is climbing and the answer was that you are now also climbing so don't engage something with climbing plus. However this sets the rule that you can force someone engaging you to get stuck climbing. I am not sure if it was later on or at the same time but base to base contact was also clarified as any part of your silhouette touching silhouette. This however allows me to stick you climbing on a wall without having to be climbing myself effectively making the Ninja doing an engage ARO almost always a very bad idea.
Actually, if u are climbing and the opponent declares engage. The engage will fail. Engage has a bullet point that reads: You cannot declare Engage if the reactive trooper would be incapable of reaching his target even if it is closer than 2 inches (for example, if there is a wall or an insurmountable chasm in the way). To climb, a wall would be in the way from model A's base and Model B' base so engage is illegal.
@kinginyellow It's not in the way if you both are at the same side of it. Also, where does the notion come from - that you must be on the wall yourself in order to place an engaging model there? As per FAQ, if your silhouettes are touching, you are still in base contact (accompanying pic directly features models on different heigths), and you place engaging model "anywhere in base contact". Also, IIRC placement on the wall is as legal as it gets. Being 25mm away from any wall or closer is enough to abuse this stuff, and I don't see RAW that would stop it. This should be fixed. And I believe that removing "opponent places the model" clause should be enough. He still mostly controls your final position by virtue of being in control with his trooper's movement.
Base contact used to actually mean base contact: translating it to SIL contact allowed the more generalised implementation of this tactic (previously it required someone with Climbing+ to do it). It's an unintended side-effect of an overall good rule change. Personally I see this as an obvious exploit even if strictly allowed by RAW and would not do it unless my trooper has C+ and is actually on the wall.
My question is what general rule allows a model to be stuck on a wall? A specific effect from a long order skill lets you be on the wall, but that is it, as far as I'm aware. So you cannot place the model on the wall and have it stay, so can you place them there? Same sort of logic to placing the model 1-2 inches above the table with bottom of the engagers base touching the top of the active models. I can try to attempt to explain what i meant by the wall being in the way, but less relevant then my previous argument to be fair.
It's legal to be on a vertical piece of terrain. Climb makes that clear. How you get to be on that vertical piece of terrain is irrelevent: you can deploy there, Climb there, potentially Jump there (with Climbing+) and you can Engage there. Engage has always let you get to places you otherwise could not (TAGs into Objective Rooms for instance).
As long as we played it correct, dodging/falling back the full distance while prone also seems weird. And of course the schroedingers mine thing where you activate the S2 marker in cover that drops to S0 and is not activated at all.
