Getting a New Guy Used to Tarik

Ouch!

(Where's a facepalm emoji?!?)

 

I hope he learned to hide his Hsien Lt a bit better until its his his turn.

Apart from that...yeah quite frustrating thing to happen.

 

Ironically enough, this happened to me my first time going against Tarik too. Except good thing my Lt was a Zuyong at the time.

That said, a Ninja managed to, on an ARO no less, plant an arrow straight through his eye in the same turn.

 

ITT: Story time about Tarik being cancer. Hilariously, OP didn’t even introduce the new player to the abomination that is B5 FAT2.

 

The amount of times I get double crits from Tarik or the Khawarij Spitfire is not okay.

 

That's crits for you. Crits kill people.

I still recall that (2ed) game of Corregidor vs. Phalanx where Ajax went from around the corner and fired a burst into my Mobile Brigada Lt. I mean, a full Brigada Pain Train behind me, a Partial Cover with me, a Burst 5 Dam 13 CombiRifle on the other side, sounds like acceptable chances, doesn't it?
Wham, three Crits in one burst. Not enough left of my Brigada Lt to even cry for...

So, don't blame the ol' man Tarik. Not really his fault there!

 

https://underbourakssun.wordpress.com/2019/04/05/how-problematic-is-fatality-l2/

 

what an astonishing waste of time, I can’t decide whether I feel bad for the person wasting his time writing this article or scoff at him for making an apologia article that completely misses the point of why Fatality 2 is toxic to this game. It being a lethal has absolutely nothing to do with it. I’m gonna’ quote Cartographer here, because I think he made the best summary of this:

 

@Zewrath beat me to it. Based on the parameters the article set forth, it's fine, but it omits key variables: opportunity cost and counter play. Yes, when you look at the numbers Fat2 is roughly equivalent to any other perk to make you better at fighting (vis mod, link team, high bs, etc). However, some of those choices have an opportunity cost associated with them (links mostly) and all of them have counter play that can be used to negate them. You can bring visors to beat vis mods, you can target weaker members of the link to remove the bonus and you can stack negative penalites to reduce the success of high bs troops.

However there is nothing that can be done to reduce bonus granted by Fat2 and the article's math supports that statement. Since there is no skill that negates it, one is left with modifiers, and those don't stop it. Fat2 provides the same increased odds of success whether the model is shooting at no penalty or -12. The only way to take away the advantage is to not allow them to use their Ballistic Skill at all, and if you can do that, then it doesn't matter what shooting skills they have anyway.

 

Faceplam. It's no more toxic to the game than FA2. Have really tried to read the article, dude?

 

At the end of the day, limited though they may be, there are still more counter play options to FA2 then there are to Fat2.

 

I’d be careful with taking a pissy attitude and telling people they make you facepalm, when your article is thinly veiled apologia, using numbers that are cherry picked to the point where it’s cringe

Try making Sheeskin shoot against a Cutter where she has -6 Rangeband, try comparing Hac Tao surprise shot with HMG against a Jotumn vs Tarik against Jotumn.
You’ll notice they have the upper hand even though they have absolutely no business taking on such targets nor engaging in firefights against those targets/range bands, which makes the skill absurd because it makes people shit on basic tactics and common sense, robbing the game of any tactical sense. Furthermore it totally undermines attributes like ARM which is by far one of the most exponentially expensive attributes in the game (except for W/STR) but nooooo, go ahead. Make a cringe inducing embarrassing article where you are foolishly trying to convince that all those things I just mentioned is basically no different than visual MOD’s yo!

Jesus Christ.

 

Hey, uh, you should probably back off a little bit there, dude. It's just a game.

 

Full Auto Lv2, whilst also a very strong skill that has no direct counter ( As in no way to negate the -3 MOD. ) is still handled far better and is more fair then FAT2.

Let's look at the two units that get FA2: Boracs and the Feuerbach Sogarat.
Both of these have a few things in common: they have a large table footprint by being S5, they both lack any other innate MODs to stack with FA2, both have the weakness of being hackable ( Though the Soggy is immune to isolation but has lower BTS, so ech. ) and neither can directly boost this skill effects by using a fireteam ( Doesn't stack with +1 Burst of a 3+ size Fireteam, and neither can join a fireteam any bigger than 3 ( Kriza is limited to Haris, Soggy to a Duo. ) and both have an average, respectable BS of 13.
The Sogarat one is very expensive ( Albeit discounted in SWC ) and can at best only muster a Burst of 3 on it's primary weapon ( Though a Burst 5 Assault Pistol is available if need ever be. ), but does get some really strong ammunition for improved damage.
The Kriza gets three different profiles for use: a MULTI-Rifle, an HMG and a 360 Visor Mk12 + SMG. These are generally all cheaper than the Sogarat, but the Kriza is overall less durable than the Sogarat ( No PH15 AutoMedikit and less ARM, albeit better BTS. ). Each loadout brings different roles: Mk12 for a big midfield bully, HMG for a raw firehose.
Both are very strong both in a vacuum and in a faction context, but they both come with a sizeable list of counters/drawbacks: they cannot tank negative MODs and have no way to counter them directly, so stacking high MODs on them will work, both are susceptible to being hacked to hinder them/weaken them, they cannot stack FA2 with Suppressive fire either and are by no means optimised profiles, so they are kept in check.

Then we have the three FAT2 units: Spitfire Khawarijs, Sheskin and Tarik:
FAT2 is a skill that benefits from 2 things primarily: a higher burst value and being able to shoot on anything above a 1.
So what do all of these have in common: each one can bring Burst 4 guns, already having the maximum chances to roll a crit outside of fireteam access, each one can join cheap, full-sized fireteams ( Khawarij can join Ghulam teams, Tarik can join any Haris or Core team in the Sectorial, and Sheskin is just a straight up Wildcard. ), none of them have hacking vulnerability, each one has above par mobility.
In addition, Sheskin and Tarik have two Wounds, and Sheskin is perpetually in cover.
Negative MODs will have effectively no effect against all of these, except Tarik and Khawarij if you can MOD them down a BS of 1: only reducing the Burst will have any effect. Hacking them is not an option either, beyond maybe trying to Spotlight them. Speculative Firing on them is not much of an option either, due to their high PH stats, not even counting the idea of them getting SSL2 from a Fireteam. And due to Tariks and Sheskins 2 Wounds, suicide templating/mines will need to succeed at least twice to remove them, and to add to this, catching Sheskin outside of cover is near impossible, unless you flamed them beforehand. Yes, there are counters: suicide templates have a chance to work, trying to kill off the other link members might work ( Albeit to have any real effect you must get them below three in size. ), but there's really not much you can do in your reactive to mitigate them, unlike with FA2.

And here's the point of this rant of mine ( Just needed to get this out of my system, really... ):
Full Auto Level 2 is a really strong skill, but that is mitigated by not being handed out to units/profiles that amplify it's effects. Full Auto Level 2 would be downright broken if it were accessible on units like the Mowang or Swiss Guard or able to stack with Fireteams or on units that had several other defensive amplifiers, like Total Immunity or able to exceed effective 2 Wounds, but it's only found so far on units that would really just be bog-standard S5 HI beatsticks if they didn't have FA2.
Fatality Level 2 as a skill does not innately sound broken, the issue here lies in where it was handed out: I'm pretty sure nobody would be batting an eye if we only ever found FAT2 on stuff like HRLs, Feuerbachs or Snipers and/or on relatively fragile platforms and/or have mediocre BS, being able to at most achieve Burst 3, but instead we have it slammed pedal to the metal onto profiles with innately high burst, get cheaper than average SWC costs, one can even ignore the need to find cover entirely and two of them get 2 Wounds without having to deal with the weaknesses that they'd have if they were HI, enhanced mobility and easy fireteam Core access to boot.

So that's my short little tangent on ''Full Auto Level 2 is handled far better than Fatality Level 2 and is far better balanced as a result.''
Just needed to get that out of my system.

 

I would be careful with taking a pissy attitude and telling people if you can decide whether you feel bad for the person who has spent his time to do some the math exactly to judge what said skill does and what does not even when the results do not go along your own opinion.

Happily you are not me and can scoff around carelessly, yo!

Jeez.

 

@Ariwch
Right, I take that as an open admission that you do not understand why FAT2 is being criticised and you unironically believe you can defend it by comparing math to demonstrate that it’s “basically just like a visual mod”.

Cool story, guy.

 

Especially when he notes that it’s a beginning, not the final nor the definitive word.

 

Well. That's 2.