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My 2019 Conspiracy Theory

Discussion in 'Tohaa' started by Vanderbane, Sep 27, 2018.

?

Is this right?

  1. Yeah, sounds like where we are headed

    28 vote(s)
    32.2%
  2. Jeez, I hope not.

    20 vote(s)
    23.0%
  3. This has no bearing on reality.

    39 vote(s)
    44.8%
  1. Alkasyn

    Alkasyn Well-Known Member

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    As Abrilete has already said, CB were way smaller before and could keep up (less demand for their products probably helped). Unfortunately taht is no longer the case (discontinuation of weak-selling sectorials).

    Growing the game is partially on us (especially on Warcors) but relies mostly on the quality of the game, miniatures, and other by-products (Army, rules, fluff etc).

    And it is in the last segment that we have seen a significant deterioration in quality, imo. So much so, that the game is now slowly reverting to being a niche product for a smaller audience, while a few years back it was a serious competitor in the skirmish scene (at least locally).

    Granted, that is also caused by GW steppign back into the game - unfortunately CB, instead of increasing its pace, has actually slowed down when it comes to quality of the product on offer.


    Simply put, that shouldn't be an issue.

    We are paying for the work of the concept designers while buying miniatures. If it's such a hard work, hire more people to do concept design. Work on it instead of just giving up.
     
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  2. Abrilete

    Abrilete Well-Known Member

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    All the models I posted in the list already have 3D sculpts (except the Sakiel, and I'm not completly sure about the Clipsos Sniper), so they would be very easy to release if CB wanted to. Just change the position of arms and legs a little bit and attach new weapons, as they did the Sukeul. Or just mirror the previous body, as they did with the Kawaii Sentinels.

    That excuse is from 2017, already used to explain why Tohaa would have to wait for its time in 2018... try something new.
     
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  3. TheRedZealot

    TheRedZealot Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    Good point I really just went by looking at the catalog and going from there. I totally forgot about the army pack rebox.

    I think they count though I didn't mean to suggest they were good. My whole point is its been years that the releases have been poor. Not some shocking new trend ;)

    I think a major factor in any future releases would probably hinge around a faction redux. Personally I'd say the best way to handle it would be a tweak to the fireteam triad rule to simplify the possible combinations and open up some more design space without needing to play test as heavily.

    In my mind Triad formation should work something like this:
    • A certain subset of units can form the base Triad. (Kamael, Perhaps sakiel and Makaul)
    • Any unit currently with Triad can then replace members of these triads but only with one type of unit at a time:
      Ex: You can have 2 Gao Rael and a Kamael, or 1 Gao Rael and 2 Kamael, but NOT 1 Gao Rael, 1 Kamael and 1 Kumotail
    This would allow for some more interesting units that dont have to link with every other unit and can prevent the potential for some broken stuff going on. The downside is of course that it makes triads less interesting.


    CB also weren't releasing 2 player starter kits, books, or a board game every year. There has been a major shift in how they are handling their product in general. Think about the huge gap between Human Sphere and Paradiso. We're getting 2 Books this year.

    Now I'm not a model maker but I imagine theres more to production than just reposing and hitting print. You've got to pose, check your clipping and the details of the model make sense, slice the model, produce the molds, test them, cast them, pack them, send them. Even disregarding market research and ensuring that the models will make you money. Mirrored bodies would be simpler but I get the feeling most people wouldn't be happy with that :)
     
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  4. Abrilete

    Abrilete Well-Known Member

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    Of course, but what I mean is that it takes the same ammount of work once you have the 3D models regardless of those being alien or human. Yet, CB is releasing new human models and new non-Tohaa alien models, but no Tohaa models that could reuse existing 3D models.

    So, the "aliens are hard to design" excuse does not apply.
     
  5. Del S

    Del S Tunguskaball

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    I gave you two other "reasons" - consistency and narrative. That the narrative so far was Uprising, and Uprising was shite, is sadly beside the point. No room for Tohaa in the story right now on the master plan, which I agree is kind of bollocks because it seems more to be sowing uncertainty in the fanbase.

    You focused in on the one that can be given a counter with the "consistency" and age arguments as well (they don't want to redo the 3d ones yet and they want to update the non-3d first) as CB not wanting to take the lazy option... but again, uprising and the apparently inflexible approach to the narrative being taken does kind of fly in the face of that notion. But the facts are your notion of weapon swaps is what everyone seems to want - but CB say that simple swaps like that aren't in the plan. Even though all armies want that sort of thing and it solves many an SKU woe.

    You also seem confident they haven't accidentally the files for the 3d designed ones :stuck_out_tongue:
     
  6. Scribbler

    Scribbler Well-Known Member

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    See, this line of thinking really irks me as well, where the argument goes that we don't need anything because Tohaa is a complete army, and we have super OP symbiomates, so therefor we should shut up about new stuff we would like to see. I agree that there are some rules and problems specific to Tohaa that need to be addressed (like symbiomates and symbiont armor), and I will give that I think Tohaa is functionally complete, but that does not mean that we shouldn't be allowed to talk about things we want to have. We are also paying customers and should be allowed to discuss ideas and give feedback to CB about our desires for Tohaa. Whether or not CB wants to take that feedback seriously or not is on them.

    I do not think it is unreasonable to ask for something small, maybe a single blister of a new model every 2-3 months, something like a Sukeul HMG or Clipsos BS, or actually releasing a model for the Taquel, just to hold us over until Triumvirate and so that we can be assured that CB hasn't forgotten about Tohaa. Or, if that is not possible, at least being more communicative with the customer base and receptive to our concerns, because it genuinely feels right now like Tohaa is the red-headed step-child that CB doesn't know what to do with. This is never healthy for any faction to begin with, but especially after the Uprising fiasco and certain sectorials going OOP, the lack of communication and attention is seriously concerning for a lot of us who worry that Tohaa might be the next to go. While I personally don't really think that is going to happen, I'm still saving up to buy the rest of the models that I don't own yet just in case the worst happens.

    But not to make this post another rage post, I will say that I am excited to see what's inside the Triumvirate when it does come out, and I don't particularly care if its Tohaa or NA2. And I also imagine that we might see some more story development along with its release, which is something I particularly enjoy. Maybe we will see Tohaa have more of an impact on the Infinity story besides "Tohaa lure CA to human sphere and are probably using the humans as meat shields." Maybe we can see them really start pulling some strings and meddling in humanity's affairs and messing with the Combined Army. But in the meantime, we can brainstorm some more ideas on how to keep the faction interesting (if there are any left) and try to figure out ways to help attract prospective players to our faction, and hopefully the Triumvirate release will come before we know it.
     
  7. Golem2God

    Golem2God Just a Kooky Kumotail serving others.

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    @Scribbler Very good points.
    I'm also looking for more Tohaa interaction in the lore though I hope it is messing and meddling with the Combined Forces more so than humanity.
     
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  8. Scribbler

    Scribbler Well-Known Member

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    Definitely this. I would easily imagine Tohaa trying to pull the strings that would get humanity's focus on the Combined Army and hopefully put a dent in the CA forces, while also setting the Human Sphere up to become a sort of client state of the Tohaa and using us as guinea pigs for their new bioweapon ideas if humanity survives the fight with the CA.
     
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  9. Golem2God

    Golem2God Just a Kooky Kumotail serving others.

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    That would be the path I would have the Tohaa take if I was in charge of the story progression.
     
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  10. Thaddius

    Thaddius Well-Known Member

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    Makaul & Sukeul wildcards. If you get a open a special holo-wildcard you get a free symbiomate.
     
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  11. Cothel

    Cothel Well-Known Member

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    I still think the Sukeul is the ugliest Tohaa model ever. (with Diplomatic Delegate a close second)
     
  12. TheRedZealot

    TheRedZealot Well-Known Member
    Warcor

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    Which one? :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

    I'm not sure I understand what this means..
     
  13. Scribbler

    Scribbler Well-Known Member

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    I own both Sukeul models, and they do stick out like a sore thumb. They’re tall, lanky even for a Tohaa, and those pheromone sensor leaf thingies go halfway down their backs.

    I personally don’t think they look that bad, but they do stand out.
     
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  14. Cothel

    Cothel Well-Known Member

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  15. Vanderbane

    Vanderbane Well-Known Member

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    "Enjoy your armies while they are still alive"

    -Bostria, describing the Adepticon cosmic event
     
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  16. Cothel

    Cothel Well-Known Member

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    Are you suggesting that Tohaa will be destroyed and the entire current army will become the Triumvirate NA2 army?
     
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  17. Zsolt

    Zsolt Well-Known Member

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    Or just discontinued altogether!
     
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  18. Golem2God

    Golem2God Just a Kooky Kumotail serving others.

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    All of these outcomes are scary. I hope none of what these sayings suggest comes true.
     
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  19. Cothel

    Cothel Well-Known Member

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    What I honestly want to see for 2019? Triumvirate box in March like the JSA box. Bunch of new units that can also be used in Tohaa (but not all) despite the Triumvirate being an NA2 army. Then in August a two player Shasvastii vs Tohaa box introducing a new Tohaa sectorial. If we saw that the Tohaa players would be dancing in the streets.
     
  20. Grathak

    Grathak Well-Known Member

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    That would be awesome *-*
     
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