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Why isn't supportware like suppressive fire?

Discussion in 'Access Guide to the Human Sphere' started by Superfluid, Nov 2, 2018.

  1. Superfluid

    Superfluid Welcome to Svalarheima

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    Just an idle thought.

    Was considering using a Hacker as a data tracker in a mission and using the free order to stick supportware on REMs every turn. However, why is this even necessary?

    Why can't we just fire and forget supportware? It's not like it's particularly OP, would encourage hacking in most lists, as it's one of the most interesting and unique parts of the game, and cuts down on mental upkeep.

    It could be such that Supportware sticks until you are forced to do a seperate hacking skill?
     
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  2. colbrook

    colbrook Grenade Delivery Specialist

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    Teampro actually lasts until the hacker dies or runs another Supportware.

    Suppressive Fire has some severe downsides, you can't move, Dodge, hack, reset, and only works in the reactive turn. Programs like assisted fire are a lot more flexible, allowing the REM to run around causing havoc, and enhanced reaction doesn't go away if you dodge or reset.
     
    #2 colbrook, Nov 2, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2018
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  3. Zewrath

    Zewrath Elitist Jerk

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    interesting though, although I'd say having basic bloke prone on a roof top basically perma Marksmanship for the entire game may be a bit strong when you consider gun platforms like Rui Shit or the Bulleteer.

    Also, technically there's actually a supportware that lasts indefinitely. xD

    http://infinitythewiki.com/en/TeamPro
     
  4. fez_the_druid

    fez_the_druid Member

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    I didn't know DataTrackers got an extra order. Where does it say that?
     
  5. daszul

    daszul Well-Known Member

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    Well, but then it has to end not only when using a different hacking skill or if the hacker goes into a null state, but also when his/her hacking device ceases to function, or the target leaves the hacking area.
    Would make it much more complicated to keep track, I think.
     
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  6. Robock

    Robock Well-Known Member

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    ITS 10 page 39. That example is specific to Frostbyte scenario. But a lot of scenario that use the DataTracker special rule also use the DataTracker Special Order special rules.

    FROSTBYTE
    Special Rules: Exclusion Zone, Limited Insertion, Killer Cold, Dead Zone,
    Secure Exclusion Zone, Heating Units, Consoles, Connect a Console,
    Killing, Specialist Troops, DataTracker, DataTracker Special Order.
     
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  7. Superfluid

    Superfluid Welcome to Svalarheima

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    Well, when the device ceases to function would be easy to track, and it would be cool and thematic. Hacking area would be trickier, because In my head I was predominantly considering attack rems like bulleteers that have repeaters in built.

    It would be fine for things like fairy dust though, because thats just tablewide.
     
  8. colbrook

    colbrook Grenade Delivery Specialist

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    Considering how cheap and effective things like Bulleteers are, only having to spend one order to get MM2 all game would be kinda rediculous IMO
     
    #8 colbrook, Nov 2, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2018
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  9. wendigo

    wendigo Nomad Artichoke

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    What if running supportware put the hacker in a state similar to the suppressive fire state, where if they did anything else they would drop out of the supportware state. That way it would stay active for the rest of the game, at the cost of tying up one of your hackers. You could bait an enemy hacker out of the supportware state by activating a killer hacker, etc. The same sort of tricks people use to get units out of suppression. Does that sounds more balanced?
     
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  10. Sabin76

    Sabin76 Well-Known Member

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    I'm pretty sure anything that can get Assisted Fire can't go prone. That said, cover exists on many roofs without needing to go prone so your main point stands.

    Also, not sure if that spelling mistake was intentional or not, but lol.
     
  11. ijw

    ijw Ian Wood aka the Wargaming Trader. Rules & Wiki
    Infinity Rules Staff Warcor

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    The Hacker, not the Remote.
     
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  12. Zewrath

    Zewrath Elitist Jerk

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    God damn autocorrect! xD

    Also, what @ijw said.
     
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  13. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    Supportware doesn't need to be stronger or easier.
     
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  14. AdmiralJCJF

    AdmiralJCJF Heart of the Hyperpower

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    Well, at the moment being low-tech is an absolute advantage in the game.

    Actually improving Supportware would help show that there are reasons for Quantronic integration, rather than making it purely a disadvantage.
     
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  15. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    There's gotta be a way that doesn't make most factions in the game need to take buffable remotes to be balanced with Ariadna. Balance internally as well don't just add a super-troop that everyone needs to take.
     
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  16. Solar

    Solar Well-Known Member

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    Supportware is fine. MML2 on REMs is fucking ace, and the +3 PH to drop with the updated ITS X drop rules actually makes dropping certain AD troops pretty attractive. The B2 in ARO for REMs isn't great, and Fairy Dust is dependent on your opponent taking a relatively unpopular piece of kit, but both can be useful, and notably, the EVO Supportware boosts those (Overclock is awesome, Reboot and Kaleidoscope are situationally good, and Teampro can be handy too).

    The whole HDs, EVOs and HD+ supportware situation is probably the part of hacking that works best right now, as opposed to being too pillow fisted (AHDs) or tac nuke-y (KHDs).
     
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  17. AdmiralJCJF

    AdmiralJCJF Heart of the Hyperpower

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    I'm not sure that you can logically justify the claim that "one and up" Supportware, working as Suppressive Fire does (costing an order to activate but then staying up 'till changed) would really be "a super-troop that everyone needs to take".

    It would inarguably help reduce the order cost burden on more high tech forces, which would help with their balance against Ariadna/Haqq/Tohaa.
     
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  18. Section9

    Section9 Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. Right now, Ariadna's 150-years-behind-the-times tech is an absolute advantage in all situations.

    Given this, why the hell would anyone want to spend all the money for quantronic integration?!?
     
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  19. loricus

    loricus Satellite Druid

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    Do you think it needs to be buffed to convince the high tech factions to use it, or do you think the factions as a whole needs the improvement? Because I am finding that people are already regularly using it.
     
  20. AdmiralJCJF

    AdmiralJCJF Heart of the Hyperpower

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    I've been watching the "hacking is terrible" threads closely for a while.

    This is one of many minor adjustments I'd like to see made.
     
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